View Full Version : Jabba IHI, To be or not to be!!!!!!!!!
That is the question!!!!!
? Are Jabba still going to supply IHI turbo conversions!!!
? When are they going to start work on the cars!!!
? Will a 340-350bhp kit be offered due to the Heat issues or will
the Bhp be reduced.
? If the main problem is heat why are they not already starting the
Stg 1's and stg 2's. Audi's and LCR'S with twin Intercoolers.
? Are there other issues not just heat releated (cat+manifold probs)
? Has anyone spoke to Jabba, and recieved a clear answer in respect
to any of the above questions.
? Does anyone exspect Santa to bring them an IHI'd Ibiza before
Chrismas 2003.
? Are Jabba keeping people informed by any site's if so where are
they so i can keep myself imformed of where they are at.
Any help with any info would be appreciated. No doubt some one will be thinking why dont i ring them. Thats a good idea, i did and i was told they would be starting the cars 3 weeks from the time of phone call which was roughly 3 weeks ago. Another member phoned them and was told something Different. Can anyone give some concrete answers????. :) :cheers:
CustardCupra
19-10-2003, 10:16
Not sure myself as to whats happening with IHI ,
All i do know is on initial inquiry about IHI way back in July i was told mine would be done for OCTOBER , and here we are no further forward :mad: .
IHI aint even been started and i think IMO won't be this year .
Would be nice if JABBA could post up a thread on this site and keep peeps informed .
Would save time and confusion with relentless phone calls to Jabba and maybe release more time for them to get on with producing this conversion.
I am aware they have come across issues which has delayed the IHI but once again when commencement was to start again ,
the goalposts have been moved yet again with further delays.
COME ON JABBA WHATS HAPPENING ?????????????????????????
Jools
It aint looking good for any IHI's to be completed before Christmas. And to be honest the uncertainty that is being produced will effect Jabba's reputation if they dont start singing of the same hymn sheet, and start keep people informed and start on the cars. Nobody wants a bad product due to Jabba not being given enough time to test the product, but keeping people informed and upto date with accurate info would help:) .
a thing like that takes time to get it right , best to wait imho . thats what im doing .
Nobody wants a bad product due to Jabba not being given enough time to test the product, but keeping people informed and upto date with accurate info would help:) . [/B][/QUOTE]
Keywords m8 people, imformed, upto, date, accurate, info.
I know what u r saying and i agree, but keeping the above helps keep people happy!!!
CustardCupra
19-10-2003, 15:35
How many peeps on here are actually waiting for this conversion ????
IBIZAs & LEONS ???
I'll start it by saying i'm on the list @ a supposed No 8-12( Keep getting contrasting number everytime i phone up ),
and i'm going for stage 3.
Jools
May be flogging a dead horse m8. I am on the warrender site looking at the cost+running cost of an Evo6.:) and modding potential
I'm on the list for a Stage 3 and yes I keep getting different stories everytime I phone up too. :(
I also heard yesterday that Jabba will no longer be doing the chargecoolers!!! Does anyone know if this is true? If so why?
Jabbasport are a great bunch of people, but I sense that people are starting to get a little tired of waiting.
I first heard of the IHI conversion at the PowerStation RR day in March 2002, and I phoned up and put my name on the list and was told that they were aiming to get it done by GTI International 2002, ie. within 2 months!!! (Also, I was the first name on the list, or so I was told, but they since lost my name altogether and I had to get put back on the list at about number 20+!!!).
Anyway, its a great kit and I'm totally commited to getting it. And to be honest I don't really need 350bhp through the winter... so long as I have it in time for the 2004 trackday season I'll be happy. :D
Cheers
Ben
If Jabba set the goal posts and stuck to it then that would be fine. On there site there used to be a price next to the charge cooler but it has now gone, and i think the re-map has gone from £425 to £475. Just hope things start to move soon!!!!:cheers:
CustardCupra
19-10-2003, 17:27
Ben s1 ,
Elton e-mailed me about the chargecooler situation 2 weeks ago and said it was no longer available as it can't cope with 350 bhp .
He also said they were looking into a FMIC in conjunction with Pace to deal with 350 bhp .
I myself am in no rush either but being promised October and having it taken away with no Definite explination why is IMO poor customer relations .
All i would like is for JABBASPORT to be Honest with peeps ,
if they are experiencing problems with regards to the IHI then so be it , but at least keep potential paying ( £4K- £5K ) customers reliably informed .
If IHI is going to start can we please have a definite Date and cut all this Bullshit thats flying around .
Personally its the unknown thats pissing me off .
Rant mode off .:D
Jools
Jools,
I didn't know that about the chargecooler!
I was planning on getting a 4 core Pace Chargecooler with a GRS FMIC sized pre-rad.... I would of thought that could cope.
Also, you points about the unknown are valid and I agree.
Cheers
Ben
PS. Gary, I have never seen the chargecooler price listed on their website and I have looked several times. It was listed, but without a price next to it.
My mistake (price cc). I dont think there is much we can do about any of it so i think i'll just forget about IHI and maybe look at other options!!!!.
I'm number 7 on the list and as far as I am aware cars will not be started until probably the new year. This is because of two things. Firstly they have had to send and resend and resend again the cast for the manifold as it keeps coming back with defects and this is taking the most time. Secondly according to Bill they are shortly to move premises and have had lots of paperwork and issues to have to deal with as well as keeping on top of the massive workload they have.
They are a victim of there own success and to be honest unless there is a substantial change I reckon that work will start on IHI around February.
It's a shame that they haven't organised this as well as they could have but to a certain extent it has been out of their control.
I am a very impatient person and want this conversion done - but you know - I am happy to wait for experts who know what they are doing and I trust to do the work and solve any glitches that may occur later
If only Jabba turned round and said it is not available till Feb, i think most people would be happy to wait. Its living in limbo, and never getting the same info as others, jabba could clear it up in 10 words and let everyone know what is going on. Thanks for postings!!!!!
Originally posted by Madmile
If only Jabba turned round and said it is not available till Feb, i think most people would be happy to wait. Its living in limbo, and never getting the same info as others, jabba could clear it up in 10 words and let everyone know what is going on. Thanks for postings!!!!!
Agreed - although I think we all got the same info about October (Arf)
ibizacupra
19-10-2003, 22:15
Originally posted by Madmile
May be flogging a dead horse m8. I am on the warrender site looking at the cost+running cost of an Evo6.:) and modding potential
LOL Evo's eh?
They are just too slow mate...
:D
;)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
LOL Evo's eh?
They are just too slow mate...
:D
;)
Until Jabba pull there finger out they aint!!!!!. If Jabba pull there finger out :(
But i know where your coming from Bill!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:cheers:
I've long been on the list for this too - since early summer i think :)
TBH i'm happy to wait for them to get it right - i need the car to be reliable, economical as well as quick :) Besides, it gives me more time to save up and get my other mods done before hand (18"s and brembos)..
Dormouse
20-10-2003, 09:48
The issues is that Jabba (due to the great work they do) are victims of their own success.
Mike and crew are extremely busy and Elton's on holiday which puts more strain on them.
Still seeing as they are the only people (at the moment) that offer this service it's a case of waiting.
Good peeps doing excellent work at Jabba. Just not enough of them :(
Dor.
i am ment to be No 2 on the list - jabba are looking to get a intercooler done with pace, as pace are ment to be using my car make one, but as the man at pace has been off for 2 weeks theres not much i can do at the mo. will be speaking to him today hopefully and trying to get my car booked in with them.
At one point I too was working with Pace (Wayne) to get an FMIC done, but nothing came of that.
The issues is that Jabba (due to the great work they do) are victims of their own success.
Mike and crew are extremely busy and Elton's on holiday which puts more strain on them.
Still seeing as they are the only people (at the moment) that offer this service it's a case of waiting.
Good peeps doing excellent work at Jabba. Just not enough of them
Dor.
TSR have done a 300+bhp upgrade for the Ibiza for over 2 years! However I personally would prefer to wait for the Jabba one.
When I was at Jabbasport a couple of months ago they mentioned that they might be moving and I feared that this could affect the date that they release the kits... looks like I might be right. :(
Ben
I'm hoping Jabba sort an intercooler out for me too as it'll be a heck of a lot less hassle. Don't really want to try and run an IHI with stock intercooling (even the Rs twin ICs are too weedy) :)
ibizacupra
20-10-2003, 14:41
Originally posted by BenS1
TSR have done a 300+bhp upgrade for the Ibiza for over 2 years!
Ben
Have they?
Never ever heard of one tho.
Yep TSR will give you an IHI 300bhp upgrade as well. And I was told a K04 upgrade with revo/sps3, 4bar fp and uprated Injectors and other bits and bobs should see 260-270bhp with 280lbs ft of torque for £2500 roughly.
CustardCupra
20-10-2003, 15:52
Spoke to Jabbasport today and all was explained .
Mike is drafting up a statement to be posted up on Seatcupra.net
which will explain whats going on.
Pace ARE making a FMIC to cope with 350 bhp .
Also problems have been experienced with the downpipe on the IBIZA as not alot of room available .
Jabba are also moving premises .
More info from mike coming soon .
IHI will probably commence FEB 2004 .
Jools
i have set a date with pace and am dropping my car off this friday
they said they will need the car for a few weeks which is fine as im at uni. no mention of cost yet but i would expect around £500??
this is for all the pipe work and hoses needed i think, but will try and get pace to put what it includes when its done.
let you know how its going.
Also spoke to jabba and they said the same they are putting up some info in the next few days.
doesn't the TSR conversion involve taking the block out to 2ltrs?instead of 'just'bolting a new turbo on and mapping it:cheers:
ibizacupra
20-10-2003, 16:50
Originally posted by Madmile
Yep TSR will give you an IHI 300bhp upgrade as well. And I was told a K04 upgrade with revo/sps3, 4bar fp and uprated Injectors and other bits and bobs should see 260-270bhp with 280lbs ft of torque for £2500 roughly.
I can't see that coming out of an Ibiza....
If TSR would do an IHI wonder who the source is? :p
i'm no 3 on the list for a stage 3 .. been put off countless times ( sure its not all their fault )but a premises move would be easily funded by selling half a dozen kits ...less storage , more money !! business sense ?!?:think: !?! i'm not askin em to fit it .. just supply and i'll take my own chances
ibizacupra
20-10-2003, 17:23
Originally posted by custard cruiser
i'm no 3 on the list for a stage 3 .. been put off countless times ( sure its not all their fault )but a premises move would be easily funded by selling half a dozen kits ...less storage , more money !! business sense ?!?:think: !?! i'm not askin em to fit it .. just supply and i'll take my own chances
Patience my man. :)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Patience my man. :)
if i had a penny fot everytime u said that !!!
ok here is the deal .. gimme de golf until jabba stop faffin about and i promise to stop goin on about it !!!! DEAL? .. and dont come back with 'u couldn't handle the power' cos i been thrashin about in a maserati spider today .. 500 monstorous BHP!! eat that ibiza boy!
ibizacupra
20-10-2003, 17:57
Originally posted by custard cruiser
if i had a penny fot everytime u said that !!!
ok here is the deal .. gimme de golf until jabba stop faffin about and i promise to stop goin on about it !!!! DEAL? .. and dont come back with 'u couldn't handle the power' cos i been thrashin about in a maserati spider today .. 500 monstorous BHP!! eat that ibiza boy!
:laff:
I laugh in the face of mere Masererati's...
Eat my dust :p :D ;)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
:laff:
I laugh in the face of mere Masererati's...
Eat my dust :p :D ;)
a nervous laugh!! http://smilies.crowd9.com/contrib/edoom/fart.gif
ibizacupra
20-10-2003, 18:28
Originally posted by custard cruiser
a nervous laugh!! http://smilies.crowd9.com/contrib/edoom/fart.gif
hehe :)
Spoke to Custardcupra tonight and after he told me what was said i now feel a lot better about the IHI saga. Just glad to hear that it is going ahead and Jabba have explained the situation and the problems they have encountered. Now i know it is going to happen i can now just sit back and wait.:cheers: :D .
And it means i dont have to buy an Evo, i can now still have a stealthy IHI to do what i wanted it for. Not to join the evo posse but leave em for dead!!!!!!!!!!!!!.:p
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Have they?
Never ever heard of one tho.
Yes, its in the same catalog that they list something called "Badger 5 Throttlebodies", whatever they are! ;) :p
I picked up the catalog at GTI International LAST year, so they have actually been doing the conversion longer than Jabbasport!
AFAIK its a Garrett turbo and they bore your engine out to 2 litres and flow the head, amoungst other things.
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by CustardCupra
Spoke to Jabbasport today and all was explained .
Mike is drafting up a statement to be posted up on Seatcupra.net
which will explain whats going on.
Pace ARE making a FMIC to cope with 350 bhp .
Also problems have been experienced with the downpipe on the IBIZA as not alot of room available .
Jabba are also moving premises .
More info from mike coming soon .
IHI will probably commence FEB 2004 .
Jools
nice to know that a statement will be released soon... who tipped them off about people getting impatient (Looking in Bills direction :D)?
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
20-10-2003, 21:42
Originally posted by BenS1
who tipped them off about people getting impatient (Looking in Bills direction :D)?
Cheers
Ben
:dunno: :wave:
not spreading rumours are we Mr Badger!!http://smilies.jeeptalk.org/otn/wink/smily012.gif
Dormouse
21-10-2003, 11:40
Originally posted by custard cruiser
if i had a penny fot everytime u said that !!!
You'de have enough money for a deposit on a cheese straw :p
Dor.
jabbasport
24-10-2003, 10:11
Firstly we apologies for the delay & confusion.
Yes, the kit is alive & well, the only problems experienced where fuel pump & relief valve related, now sorted with vastly upgraded versions, we will not accept anything other than 100% reliability under all conditions.
It has taken longer than anticipated to get all the many components produced to our standard i.e. (castings, machined parts etc).
The Ibiza down pipe with it’s very limited space has been a real nightmare, originally made by us, (8 hours to make), is now being produced from multiple stainless pressing, to be jigged up in 2 weeks time on our car. The cast outlet / Downpipe for Golf’s, Leons, Octavia’s, A3, TT & S3 is now in production with various cat options to follow.
We are a relatively small company of six people & growing rapidly. Having out grown our existing premises 9 months ago, we where initially looking at extending our existing building, but this we felt would still limit us with future further expansion, so we opted to move. Trying to find new premises has been a real challenge, having found a very suitable place still in Crowland, the proceedings have been thwarted by various council planning & highways authorities’ related issues. Now all finally sorted, we are at last looking to move in December.
Our custom method of remapping is also very “time” consuming, but fits in with our everything must be right philosophy. We only feel happy to offer generic software on diesels, as there are none of the possible boost / detonation & heat related problems. Though we are now able to offer serial port programming for all the current 1.8t’s, we may offer this as an option in the near future, on some models, but only with a full check over.
Intercoolers / Charge coolers
Again the Ibiza has been a problem with its lack of space. The 2-core charge cooler on our Ibiza works well under 95% of conditions. Its main problems being price & efficiency under sustained full load in hot conditions, with the added possibly of pump failure or coolant loss this also would cause very high charge temperatures & potential damage. Again, it must be 100% reliable in all conditions for us to release to the general public, so we are therefore resuming the intercooler route again, but some bumper mods will be required.
Due to our immanent move & the Ibiza packaging problems it’s realistically going to be January before all the production parts will be fully available, again sorry for the delay, but we are selling it as the best kit & that’s exactly what you get bar none..!
The plans are already laid for later next year when we will release further stages. These will require internal mods e.g. pistons, rods etc up to 410Bhp & two more stages 450 & 500Bhp with a much larger IHI turbo. The 500Bhp will get a billet longer stroke crank & larger bore giving a swept volume of 1950cc along with a huge list of other parts. But inevitably this will be expensive, not recommended for the Ibiza, due to it needing the O2M 6 speed box to stand a chance of coping with the torque & would probably rip the front end off the car if it ever gripped. :yikes:
The Jabba Team
Wow thanks for the heads up Mike and evil friends :)
Sounds like you're having/had some real fun and games. Still in crowland then? Was worried you'd move further away so suits me!
Again, great to see the philosophy of 100% reliability and drivability coming through! One of the reasons i'm happy to risk my primary car with the IHI conversion.
See you next year when i get that phone call that'll change my world :) Well, providing the missus doesn't kill me..
:cheers:
Shock_Xe
24-10-2003, 10:41
Originally posted by jabbasport
The plans are already laid for later next year when we will release further stages. These will require internal mods e.g. pistons, rods etc up to 410Bhp & two more stages 450 & 500Bhp with a much larger IHI turbo. The 500Bhp will get a billet longer stroke crank & larger bore giving a swept volume of 1950cc along with a huge list of other parts. But inevitably this will be expensive, not recommended for the Ibiza, due to it needing the O2M 6 speed box to stand a chance of coping with the torque & would probably rip the front end off the car if it ever gripped. :yikes:
The Jabba Team
Bill you got yer name on the list for 500bhp yet????
ibizacupra
24-10-2003, 11:45
Originally posted by Shock_Xe
Bill you got yer name on the list for 500bhp yet????
:D ;)
Yea but in an Ibiza..... LOL (did I just hear mike faint :D :p)
Getting me a 'spare' motor to build up over the winter... which will be a higher internal spec.. who knows.. its an addictive thing all this power. you can't have enough. (can you? )
Dormouse
24-10-2003, 13:16
Originally posted by ibizacupra
:D ;)
Yea but in an Ibiza..... LOL (did I just hear mike faint :D :p)
Getting me a 'spare' motor to build up over the winter... which will be a higher internal spec.. who knows.. its an addictive thing all this power. you can't have enough. (can you? )
LMAO
Badger Car Lot :p
Dor.
Thanks for the update Jabbasport.
Can't wait to get mine done.... but now I want one of the higher stages! :D
Can the Stage 3 350bhp be upgraded at a later date without throwing away a significant number of components?
(Ramblings of a mad person, thinking out loud:
"I'd seriously consider a 4wd conversion on my little Ibiza and 500bhp... I've already spoke to Alan at AutoTechniks and he said that he could do a 4wd conversion! :D")
I seriously hope there will be a big SeatCupra.net trackday next year... with all these SuperBeezas it could be amazing!
I'm getting all excited now! ;) :D
:cheers:
Cheers
Ben
PS. Jabbasport.... how much money would it take to bribe you to make me one of the first on the list? ;)
Originally posted by BenS1
PS. Jabbasport.... how much money would it take to bribe you to make me one of the first on the list? ;)
Oi!!!!!!!!
;)
Originally posted by dangel
Oi!!!!!!!!
;)
Maybe it would of been best if I sent that as a PM to them! ;)
Alternatively, how much would is cost to get the guy at position 1 in the list to swap with me. ;)
Ben
CustardCupra
24-10-2003, 15:17
Thanx Jabbasport will see you early next year .
Jools
ibizacupra
24-10-2003, 15:31
Originally posted by BenS1
Can the Stage 3 350bhp be upgraded at a later date without throwing away a significant number of components?
(Ramblings of a mad person, thinking out loud:
"I'd seriously consider a 4wd conversion on my little Ibiza and 500bhp... I've already spoke to Alan at AutoTechniks and he said that he could do a 4wd conversion! :D")
:laff:
I think we have a new 'king looney' in the house. :)
Who me? I bet you get it before I do!!! ;) :p
I'll certainly start with the 350bhp conversion, but may well go for the uprated rods/pistons for the extra saftey margin and lower compression ratio.... then I imagine it'll only be a small step up to 410bhp (Any idea if it keeps the same turbo).
The step from 410 to 450/500 is probably a bigger one due to all the internal engine mods and the fact that you have to bin your IHI as they use an even bigger one!
Anyway, lets see how I get on with 350bhp for now. :D
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
24-10-2003, 16:17
Originally posted by BenS1
Who me? I bet you get it before I do!!! ;) :p
I'll certainly start with the 350bhp conversion, but may well go for the uprated rods/pistons for the extra saftey margin and lower compression ratio.... then I imagine it'll only be a small step up to 410bhp (Any idea if it keeps the same turbo).
The step from 410 to 450/500 is probably a bigger one due to all the internal engine mods and the fact that you have to bin your IHI as they use an even bigger one!
Anyway, lets see how I get on with 350bhp for now. :D
Cheers
Ben
I can't quite see how 350bhp will be achieved on an AYP motor without a CR drop. Mine did'nt do it before - head off and the pistons machined/ceramic coated, ported head etc..
MKIV turbo power delivery is nice but brutal. Traction in the Ibiza will be worse I believe, and high rpms from a largeport head (must have for that power) will also mean gearbox gearchange probs. VAG synchro's just don't like revs >6K rpm
Mad tho... One day maybe... or better still start with an Audi A3 1.8T quattro and do all this to that :D Aha.... thats what Mike is doing :p ;)
Bill
Thanks for the update Jabba!!!!:cheers:
I'd be interested to see if a couple of these IHI turbos are a viable replacement/upgrade for the K0-4's on an Audi RS4 or the K0-3's on an S4 ?
Originally posted by ibizacupra
I can't quite see how 350bhp will be achieved on an AYP motor without a CR drop. Mine did'nt do it before - head off and the pistons machined/ceramic coated, ported head etc..
MKIV turbo power delivery is nice but brutal. Traction in the Ibiza will be worse I believe, and high rpms from a largeport head (must have for that power) will also mean gearbox gearchange probs. VAG synchro's just don't like revs >6K rpm
Mad tho... One day maybe... or better still start with an Audi A3 1.8T quattro and do all this to that :D Aha.... thats what Mike is doing :p ;)
Bill
Well Jabbas website still states that stage 3 is 340-350bhp and doesn't include a compression ratio drop. I can't see people being happy if they buy the stage 3 kit but only achive stage 2 performance on the rollers!
Anyway, I AM likely to get the compression ratio lowered, but may as well go straight for the forged pistons/rods rather than machining the standard pistons.
I done the maths on the A3 quatro and even with the 410bhp conversion the A3 would have a lower power to weight ratio than the Ibiza.
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
24-10-2003, 18:57
Originally posted by BenS1
I done the maths on the A3 quatro and even with the 410bhp conversion the A3 would have a lower power to weight ratio than the Ibiza.
Cheers
Ben
Except it would have f*cked off up the road from a standing start whilst you sat spinning :p
I am looking forward to having a go in Mikes A3 quattro thats for sure.
:D :D :D :D
ibizacupra
24-10-2003, 18:58
Originally posted by Glenn
I'd be interested to see if a couple of these IHI turbos are a viable replacement/upgrade for the K0-4's on an Audi RS4 or the K0-3's on an S4 ?
Best speak to Keith @ Dylinx then... :)
Bullet TT......
Fab'd manifold or adaptor plate.. not sure. Wears IHI's now tho I believe on its 2.7 bi-turbo... after K04's popped!
Awesome bit of kit.
Bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Except it would have f*cked off up the road from a standing start whilst you sat spinning :p
I am looking forward to having a go in Mikes A3 quattro thats for sure.
:D :D :D :D
do i sense the demise of the ibiza ?!?!!:eek:
To be honest as long as i make over 300bhp@fly i aint bothered 301-320bhp would do me fine!!!!!.
Not satisfied with the K04 Madmile???
IhI is the way to go i think, to be honest i cant believe how much quicker the car is in the colder weather 6oc tonight compared to the summer is is quite a bit quicker.
Originally posted by Madmile
To be honest as long as i make over 300bhp@fly i aint bothered 301-320bhp would do me fine!!!!!.
Really?
The stage 2 is 300-310bhp, the stage 3 is 340-350bhp... if you payed for a stage 3 but got 301bhp then I'd be pretty unhappy!
Except it would have f*cked off up the road from a standing start whilst you sat spinning
I am looking forward to having a go in Mikes A3 quattro thats for sure.
Obviously, but surely you know better than most that your standing start performance isn't a good indication of the cars overall performance.
I think 350bhp Ibiza Vs a 410bhp A3 on a track would be fairly close, but i think the Ibiza would win due to the slightly better power to weight ratio, and the fact that in theory because its lighter it should be able to corner faster... alhtough the A3s 4wd system may help it claw back some of that time.
Cheers
ben
I was possibly thinking of running 310/320 bhp Ben with a stage 3 to keep everythin v-safe, but nothing is set in stone until the cars start to happen i will have a better idea then!!!:cheers:
ibizacupra
25-10-2003, 07:46
Originally posted by BenS1
Really?
The stage 2 is 300-310bhp, the stage 3 is 340-350bhp... if you payed for a stage 3 but got 301bhp then I'd be pretty unhappy!
Obviously, but surely you know better than most that your standing start performance isn't a good indication of the cars overall performance.
I think 350bhp Ibiza Vs a 410bhp A3 on a track would be fairly close, but i think the Ibiza would win due to the slightly better power to weight ratio, and the fact that in theory because its lighter it should be able to corner faster... alhtough the A3s 4wd system may help it claw back some of that time.
Cheers
ben
Stick me in a 410bhp A3 Quattro and my 350bhp Ibiza and I would expect to go about the same speed. It is'nt that heavy... not talking S3 here, just 1.8T A3 quattro like mikes got.
Round Castle Combe... Ibiza did 1m18s where the MKIV did 1m20s laps (ibiza~350, golf ~380 on that day), ibiza on sticky tyres, golf on road eagle gsd3's... tyres are worth 2 sec a lap minimum @ Combe.
regars
bill
ibizacupra
25-10-2003, 07:50
Originally posted by Madmile
I was possibly thinking of running 310/320 bhp Ben with a stage 3 to keep everythin v-safe, but nothing is set in stone until the cars start to happen i will have a better idea then!!!:cheers:
The stage 2 (i think) was where i started.... 325bhp out of the box and 280lb/ft torque. All from bolt on bits, and with stock IC also! 15psi boost max from memory on highest setting, 9psi on lowest.
That had better pickup than I have now.... and higher low end torque than I now have. (ported head now... not a step forward IMHO)
More than that boost and you will need to address the CR and intercooling. Based on the experience gained from mine. Real world, several 1000 miles later.
Bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
The stage 2 (i think) was where i started.... 325bhp out of the box and 280lb/ft torque. All from bolt on bits, and with stock IC also!.
Bill
That would do me, should still be very fast!!!!!!!.
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Stick me in a 410bhp A3 Quattro and my 350bhp Ibiza and I would expect to go about the same speed. It is'nt that heavy... not talking S3 here, just 1.8T A3 quattro like mikes got.
Round Castle Combe... Ibiza did 1m18s where the MKIV did 1m20s laps (ibiza~350, golf ~380 on that day), ibiza on sticky tyres, golf on road eagle gsd3's... tyres are worth 2 sec a lap minimum @ Combe.
regars
bill
Interesting. So even though the Ibiza had a much better PWR you are saying that if the Golf had been on sticky tyres it would of given about the same lap time as the Ibiza. Does the Golf handle much better than the Ibiza then (Ibiza having loads of handling mods and the Golf probably not having quite so many, yet?)?
More than that boost and you will need to address the CR and intercooling. Based on the experience gained from mine. Real world, several 1000 miles later.
Well Jabba obviously are dealing with the intercooling at the moment, but it would be interesting to hear what Jabba have to say about the CR as its not listed as required on their 350bhp stage 3 conversion! Even so, I'll still be going for the lower CR for the extra piece of mind, and scope for more power in future.
So, you advise not to get the flowed head? Will this not become a problem if I decide to go for even more power?
:cheers:
Cheers Bill,
Ben
CustardCupra
25-10-2003, 11:47
AS long as it gets the ihi anything is better than KKK03 200 bhp .
Wouldn't the FMIC Jabba are getting done with pace give the 350 bhp figure ???
Can't see jabba giving you 350 bhp on stock intercooler 'cos of the Heat Issues especially as mike want's this product 100% satisfactory before anyone gets it .
Jools
ibizacupra
25-10-2003, 12:36
Originally posted by BenS1
Interesting. So even though the Ibiza had a much better PWR you are saying that if the Golf had been on sticky tyres it would of given about the same lap time as the Ibiza. Does the Golf handle much better than the Ibiza then (Ibiza having loads of handling mods and the Golf probably not having quite so many, yet?)?
Well Jabba obviously are dealing with the intercooling at the moment, but it would be interesting to hear what Jabba have to say about the CR as its not listed as required on their 350bhp stage 3 conversion! Even so, I'll still be going for the lower CR for the extra piece of mind, and scope for more power in future.
So, you advise not to get the flowed head? Will this not become a problem if I decide to go for even more power?
:cheers:
Cheers Bill,
Ben
The Golf stopped very well unlike the Ibiza (Wilwoods and rubbish ABS system). It is a fine handling car, but not as chuckable as the Ibiza. Not a lot in it.. More brute force with the Golf, but slightly dulled by the extra baggage it has to carry. Golf reminds me of the Jetta. Does what you ask of it. Ibiza is not as user friendly yet. (brakes are my personal problem... not as confident in them as I am in the Golf)
Ported small port head is still going to be limited to to high 300's, so if chasing >400bhp, you would need to run an early large port head (ADR etc) - Like the Golf has.
I have a RR tomorrow @ Interpro, so will be interested in what figures are measured then. Northampton RR was'nt up to the Ibiza so I don;t know what its kicking out currently. Running a different chip in since then, and nudged the boost up a smidge more also. :p
Bill
ibizacupra
25-10-2003, 12:39
Originally posted by CustardCupra
AS long as it gets the ihi anything is better than KKK03 200 bhp .
Wouldn't the FMIC Jabba are getting done with pace give the 350 bhp figure ???
Can't see jabba giving you 350 bhp on stock intercooler 'cos of the Heat Issues especially as mike want's this product 100% satisfactory before anyone gets it .
Jools
Nope... Never said you would.
325bhp was with the stock IC tho.. and a little more with the Forge SMIC. Pushing over a bar boost and heatrise is greater.
Remembering... From the Stealth RR beginning of this year, mine was just Jabba'd, and ran 326bhp, 280lb/ft on the stock IC. Induction temps during the run were 70'C however, but many chipped K03 cars also got 70'C induction temps from their 200bhp power.
Airflow is massive... boost is'nt when running 325bhp level. (still a very fast little car)
Bill
To run the 320bhp what stage IHI did you have Bill, were you using the sports cat, what spec was your car at the time????.
ibizacupra
25-10-2003, 17:05
Originally posted by Madmile
To run the 320bhp what stage IHI did you have Bill, were you using the sports cat, what spec was your car at the time????.
I would guess what I started with is whats referred to as a stage 2. (Did'nt have stages back then)
It included, IHI, Jabba exhaust manifold, downpipe, cat, larger MAF, injectors, S3 ECU (not sure if this req'd now), intake pipe, induction kit, various oil & water lines for the turbo.
In that guise it produced a healthy and reliable 325bhp, 280lb/ft torque from 15psi boost.
regards
bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
I would guess what I started with is whats referred to as a stage 2. (Did'nt have stages back then)
It included, IHI, Jabba exhaust manifold, downpipe, cat, larger MAF, injectors, S3 ECU (not sure if this req'd now), intake pipe, induction kit, various oil & water lines for the turbo.
In that guise it produced a healthy and reliable 325bhp, 280lb/ft torque from 15psi boost.
regards
bill
I have a sales sheet which was gven to me at the PowerStation RR day about a yeat before you got your IHI convertion listing all the stage upto stage 8 with 476bhp! :D
As for the S3 ECU, I asked for this but they said that they ould no longer offer this as an option! :( Guess I'll have to put up with the crappy Ibiza TCS! :(
Cheers
Ben
CustardCupra
26-10-2003, 16:09
No mention of Induction kit upgrade either on Jabbas list for IHI ,
Will this be an optional extra or part of the kit ???
Can't imagine stock airbox coping with 320 - 350 bhp .
Jools
Anybody have any news on the fmic from Pace yet????????.
Or any news in general about the IHI program.:cheers:
Originally posted by Madmile
Anybody have any news on the fmic from Pace yet????????.
Or any news in general about the IHI program.:cheers:
fmic or chargecooler??
FMIC!!! i am sure i mentioned the fmic in my post!!!!!!!!!!!
FMIC not Chargecooler
ibizacupra
07-11-2003, 07:20
Latest I know...
their Ibiza has gone for downpipe and exhaust manufacture as an IHI kitted complete system. This then makes the pattern for a nice stainless downpipe arrangement.
Ibiza install is nasty for the clearance on the outlet elbow compared to MKIV based cars.. Ibiza is essentially MK2/3 Golf up front. Rear engine mount is really close to turbo outlet, which makes the elbow a tricky component to make (ecconomically)
The rest of the kit (bar FMIC) is plain jane Jabba IHI.
You could call them and ask maybe?
Bill
Originally posted by custard cruiser
fmic or chargecooler??
FMIC. Jabbasport and Pace are working together to make a FMIC for the Ibiza that is suitable for the IHI conversion.
LEt me know if you find out any more info... I'm not gonna call as I have called so many times I think I'll start to p them off soon. :(
Cheers
Ben
PACE have decided that a front mounted intercooler large enough for IHI will not fit, so are working on a 4 core chargecooler with a large pre-rad. they are using an existing kit from a 400BHP cosworth kit car so it should have enough cooling.
will have more news tue/wed and hope to pick up the car at the weekend. fingers crossed.
Thanks for the update.
I wonder how much Jabba will charge for the 4 core system... when I phoned Pace directly about 6 weeks ago they said they could make me a bespoke 4 core system (Complete with large prerad, pump, controller etc) for £650 all in.
Cheers
Ben
CustardCupra
09-11-2003, 16:55
Originally posted by BenS1
Thanks for the update.
I wonder how much Jabba will charge for the 4 core system... when I phoned Pace directly about 6 weeks ago they said they could make me a bespoke 4 core system (Complete with large prerad, pump, controller etc) for £650 all in.
Cheers
Ben
£ 650 is half the price Jabba wanted for their 2core chargecooler ( £1200 ).
Bring it on PACE ;)
Pace said they'd make me a 2 core system for £550.
Thats a system to my exact spec... which included a pre-rad the same size as the GRS FMIC. :)
I don't want to do Jabba out of any business but their mark up on the CCs is a bit excesive IMHO.
Cheers
Ben
CustardCupra
09-11-2003, 17:26
Originally posted by BenS1
Pace said they'd make me a 2 core system for £550.
Thats a system to my exact spec... which included a pre-rad the same size as the GRS FMIC. :)
I don't want to do Jabba out of any business but their mark up on the CCs is a bit excesive IMHO.
Cheers
Ben
I feel a group buy coming on ,
Would rather give PACE £650 than Jabba £????? for the same product .
CustardCupra
09-11-2003, 17:32
Peeps are still miffed with Jabba over the delays ,
think they could shoot themselves in the foot with this one if the price isn't competative .
IHI pricing just seems to be spiralling with every brick wall they hit to achieve the offered stage 3 350bhp figure .
Time will tell, not to much time i hope!!!!. But costs do seem to be going up and up with less and less power to show for it!!!!. Lets just hope i all comes together soon.
thats about the price Wayne was saying for the chargecooler so its not too bad.
personally I don't mind paying Jabba a bit more that the direct from Pace price.... call it development and testing costs. But I wouldn't really be too happy about paying more than double the Pace price.
A group buy would be good if it comes with a discount.
Personally though I don't want to do anything to p1ss Jabbasport off, they are a great bunch and they make great products. If someone tells me that Jabbasport have no problem with us getting CC's directly from Pace then I'll be up for it.
The delays have been a little diappointing but now that they have given a statement I accept the wait and look forward to a call around January time. If however there are more delays beyond January without further feedback then I expect people will start to get a little unhappy again.
To be honest I'm not seeing the delays as a big problem for me yet as the earliest I'd be ready for the kit is the end of December (Getting Quaife and Clutch upgrade in December). Then much of the kit will be paid for on the credit card, and so the longer I have to wait the more money i will have and the less I'll have to buy on credit!
As long as I have the upgrade before the 2004 trackday season starts (For me) around March time I'll be smiling ear to ear. :D
Cheers
Ben
Dormouse
09-11-2003, 21:15
Dunno why you lot are moaning about cost, as soon as you start seriously using the added power you'll be spending on repairs and broken bits from here to eternity anyway.
Oops, I think i just made a few enemies :p :p
Dor.
Originally posted by Dormouse
Dunno why you lot are moaning about cost, as soon as you start seriously using the added power you'll be spending on repairs and broken bits from here to eternity anyway.
Oops, I think i just made a few enemies :p :p
Dor.
Very funny... NOT! ;)
Lets hope not!
However, if my gearbox dies like Bills did then I may seriously consider a 4wd conversion! :D
Cheers
Ben
Dormouse
09-11-2003, 21:45
Originally posted by BenS1
Very funny... NOT! ;)
Lets hope not!
However, if my gearbox dies like Bills did then I may seriously consider a 4wd conversion! :D
Cheers
Ben
Can I have some of your money? :D
Dor.
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 08:10
Originally posted by BenS1
Very funny... NOT! ;)
Lets hope not!
However, if my gearbox dies like Bills did then I may seriously consider a 4wd conversion! :D
Cheers
Ben
Its called an audi A3.. ;)
Shock_Xe
10-11-2003, 08:45
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Its called an audi A3.. ;)
Andy done some damage! :D he coverted you!! :p
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 10:00
Originally posted by Shock_Xe
Andy done some damage! :D he coverted you!! :p
Aye... the Dark side is calling me.... :p:devil:
Haldex..... Quattro....... traction...... and an IHI... :D
Hmmmm.
It is a nice motor. 3dr version for me tho.
Well screwed together.... 70K miles and no rattles. :)
regards
Bill
How did you get on against the Evo's bill at Cadwell?????????.
Shock_Xe
10-11-2003, 10:09
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Aye... the Dark side is calling me.... :p:devil:
Haldex..... Quattro....... traction...... and an IHI... :D
Hmmmm.
It is a nice motor. 3dr version for me tho.
Well screwed together.... 70K miles and no rattles. :)
regards
Bill
yea definatly. Andy is turning into an old man with his 5 door tho! baby seat next for him me thinks! :p :D
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 10:39
Originally posted by Madmile
How did you get on against the Evo's bill at Cadwell?????????.
:) :D
Not many on track to be honest.
Nothing that I did'nt pass easily.
Escort was v.quick on that day... good fun, but not much 'fast' traffic. None EVO on my laps any how.
next time.
:)
Bill
At the vmax event what power do you think you were running Bill, and how did the ibiza compare against the other cars once rolling on the straights.????? Questions, Questions, Questions...
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 11:42
Originally posted by Madmile
At the vmax event what power do you think you were running Bill, and how did the ibiza compare against the other cars once rolling on the straights.????? Questions, Questions, Questions...
{edit} Vmax.... you mean brunters?
0-150 in the ibiza was faster than a lot but not all. (Ferrari 360 :D Hehehe)
At Cadwell-->
Down the straights faster than everything I was on track with.
corner speeds and braking were my let down vs a Catherham and that old skool escort.
A White Nizzan 300ZX thing, caged and stripped out etc.... claimed 450bhp, was passed with ease down the straight... which amused me but not him.
:D
My power then was as now... ~350bhp, 320lb/ft (ish)
regards
bill
Can I have some of your money?
Dor.
You can have some of by debt! ;)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Its called an audi A3.. ;)
I have looked at the A3 but its just too heavy. :(
I was also looking at the Daronda. Its a kit car (Think Caterhams/Westfields) but built around a Audi 1.8T engine. The engine is only running at 200bhp but the performance is amazing (Similar to an R500 superlite).... so I was thinking about getting one and getting Jabba to IHI it upto 350-410bhp! :D
Now that would MOVE!!!
At the vmax event what power do you think you were running Bill, and how did the ibiza compare against the other cars once rolling on the straights.????? Questions, Questions, Questions...
Theres a lot of info on this in the Trackdays section, but basically Bill kicked some seriously expensive ar$e! :D
Ben
hopkinsgm
10-11-2003, 12:10
Originally posted by BenS1
...Very funny... NOT! ;) ...Lets hope not!...
Sad fact of life but when you start trying to subject existing components to in excess of twice the design load, things will break. And those that don't break in a messy kinda way are likely to be subjected to accelerated wear and tear. Sure, loads of components will have safety factors designed in but it's rare to design something to handle twice the load as a sustained thing...
You may well find that running costs increase significantly - and i'm not just talking the "obvious" items like fuel costs and lunched tyres here...
Boost controller should help, mine will only but turned upto 350bhp when the situation arises.:)
Originally posted by Madmile
Boost controller should help, mine will only but turned upto 350bhp when the situation arises.:)
Yes mine too.
Sad fact of life but when you start trying to subject existing components to in excess of twice the design load, things will break. And those that don't break in a messy kinda way are likely to be subjected to accelerated wear and tear. Sure, loads of components will have safety factors designed in but it's rare to design something to handle twice the load as a sustained thing...
You may well find that running costs increase significantly - and i'm not just talking the "obvious" items like fuel costs and lunched tyres here...
Yeah I know and accept that. But I'm hoping that things like the gearbox will handle the power... it parts may wear but I don't want the risk of it going bang each time I put my foot down. Bills lasted with over 320lb/ft for quite a while, so hopefully mine will cope with the 280lb/ft the stage 3 kit is quoted as putting out.
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 13:41
Originally posted by BenS1
I was also looking at the Daronda. Its a kit car (Think Caterhams/Westfields) but built around a Audi 1.8T engine. The engine is only running at 200bhp but the performance is amazing (Similar to an R500 superlite).... so I was thinking about getting one and getting Jabba to IHI it upto 350-410bhp! :D
Now that would MOVE!!!
Ben
How about a Shelsley T2
It is Jabba IHI'd and will have 350+bhp in 550Kg's.
Rolling protype has been mapped by Mike already.. :D
Daronda are very overdue with their car tho...
I am on their emiling list... and test drive list.
Bill
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 13:57
Originally posted by BenS1
Bills lasted with over 320lb/ft for quite a while, so hopefully mine will cope with the 280lb/ft the stage 3 kit is quoted as putting out.
Cheers
Ben
It did'nt last that long mate... :(
2 months... on high boost.
Bill
ANDY BLUNT
10-11-2003, 17:06
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Aye... the Dark side is calling me.... :p:devil:
Haldex..... Quattro....... traction...... and an IHI... :D
Hmmmm.
It is a nice motor. 3dr version for me tho.
Well screwed together.... 70K miles and no rattles. :)
regards
Bill I new this would happen,actually it's got 80'000 miles and still tight.5drs will make it more of a Q car ,right colour too and it doesn't half shift since Revod as Rog (Leon R) found out .Tried high settings on sps3 and it flys.Now whats next to do,17"wheels,dv,fmi/c,brembos,IHI :devil: 1.6 badge:D PS Bill think u owe me about 3,000 miles worth of pads judging by the smell when u brought it back,or was that the clutch ,i thought the Stig was in it.:yikes: :cheers: Andy
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 18:07
Originally posted by ANDY BLUNT
.......PS Bill think u owe me about 3,000 miles worth of pads judging by the smell when u brought it back,or was that the clutch ,i thought the Stig was in it.:yikes: :cheers: Andy
Opps. :redface:
They did smell pretty bad...
That was driving pretty easily with so much traffic about.
Sorry mate... Brembos at discount for you mate... (fitted on Mike's A3 quattro a treat I'm told)
I would hate to think what it would smell like when actually going for it properly.... I thought I was being easy, but the smell did'nt seem that way! EAK! Sorry mate. :rolleyes: :eek:
Quattro... Hmmmm. Got me thinking. :)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
How about a Shelsley T2
It is Jabba IHI'd and will have 350+bhp in 550Kg's.
Rolling protype has been mapped by Mike already.. :D
Daronda are very overdue with their car tho...
I am on their emiling list... and test drive list.
Bill
Got any piccies or details of the Shelsley thing.... that sounds amazing! RWD I presume, not 4WD?
Also, I can't find any of the stuff I had on the Daronda, have you got a link for them too?
It did'nt last that long mate...
2 months... on high boost.
Bill
True but its lasted ages with over 300lb/ft hasn't it?
Have you made a final decision on what you are going to do about a gearbox yet?
I say strip the Ibiza out and 4wd it! ;)
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Quattro... Hmmmm. Got me thinking. :)
If you're going to go down the 4WD route Bill, how about the Audi S4? With twin IHI's, you get monstrous power (a la Dialynx BulleTT ?) and that V6 noise you like. They're not that expensive either, £11K-£15K? ;)
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 20:24
Originally posted by BenS1
Got any piccies or details of the Shelsley thing.... that sounds amazing! RWD I presume, not 4WD?
Also, I can't find any of the stuff I had on the Daronda, have you got a link for them too?
True but its lasted ages with over 300lb/ft hasn't it?
Have you made a final decision on what you are going to do about a gearbox yet?
I say strip the Ibiza out and 4wd it! ;)
Cheers
Ben
Shelsley is RWD yea. Should be fun.
The g'box lasted 2 months Ben on 300+lb/ft - Not ages at all mate.
Cadwell probably fatigued it jumping over the mountain session.
2nd gear is toothless :p Plain hub now :( Needs some serious denture care to stick it back together! :laff:
2WD Ibiza...
4WD is A3 Quattro for me
Bill
ibizacupra
10-11-2003, 20:28
Originally posted by Glenn
If you're going to go down the 4WD route Bill, how about the Audi S4? With twin IHI's, you get monstrous power (a la Dialynx BulleTT ?) and that V6 noise you like. They're not that expensive either, £11K-£15K? ;)
Now that is heavy!
S4..... needs loads power to get it quick... then brakes...
Slippery slope.
Nice idea tho.
Better still is an Audi UR Quattro fitted with a bi-turbo 2.7V6 running twin IHI's - Now that motor I want! :D
you be better off buying a jet fighter . might be cheaper too !
Originally posted by BenS1
Pace said they'd make me a 2 core system for £550.
Thats a system to my exact spec... which included a pre-rad the same size as the GRS FMIC. :)
I don't want to do Jabba out of any business but their mark up on the CCs is a bit excesive IMHO.
Cheers
Ben
u got paces number and the chappie u spoke too ?
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Shelsley is RWD yea. Should be fun.
The g'box lasted 2 months Ben on 300+lb/ft - Not ages at all mate.
Cadwell probably fatigued it jumping over the mountain session.
2nd gear is toothless :p Plain hub now :( Needs some serious denture care to stick it back together! :laff:
2WD Ibiza...
4WD is A3 Quattro for me
Bill
I know you cranked up the power a couple of months ago ut i thouht you have had ove 300lb/ft pretty much since you had the chargecooler?
Do you not think the weight of the A3 will be an issue? At nearly 1400Kg you'd need about 440bhp to get a comparable power to weight ratio to the Ibiza with 350bhp! And then it'll suffer in the corners too with that weight.
Shelsley sounds interesting though.
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by custard cruiser
u got paces number and the chappie u spoke too ?
The Pace website is www.paceproducts.co.uk (http://www.paceproducts.co.uk)
Their phone number is (0)1440 760960
When i phoned i asked to speak to Wayne, but he was on holiday at the time so they ut me through to someone else, but unfortunately i can't remember their name (I might have it written on a pad at work). I phoned again a few weeks later and I 'may' of spoken to Wayne that time.
Anyway, when you get through to the main area of the website goto the "Radiators/Intercoolers/Chargecoolers" menu, then select "Bespoke Chargecoolers" and then "2 core chargecooler" or "4 core charge cooler" as you desire.
Heres the direct link to the 4 core page:
http://www.paceproducts.co.uk/ricc/4core.htm
And heres the link to the 2 core page:
http://www.paceproducts.co.uk/ricc/2core.htm
You can choose you exact pre-rad size from here:
http://www.paceproducts.co.uk/ricc/core%20prices%202003.htm
As a general guide I got a quote for a COMPLETE system including 4 cores with custom end tanks, all pipework, pump, controller and I specced the pre-rad to be roughly the same size as the GRS FMIC (As I know thats the biggest that will fit) and the total price came to roughly £650! Bargin!
if you call them then please let me know how you get on.
Cheers
Ben
ANDY BLUNT
10-11-2003, 21:55
Doesn't the haldex have a torque limit,if it does Bill you might have to detune:D :cheers: Andy
Originally posted by ANDY BLUNT
Doesn't the haldex have a torque limit,if it does Bill you might have to detune:D :cheers: Andy
Possibly a valid point, however it should be fairly simple to replace the Haldex diff with a traditional viscous diff or a torsen diff.
Note that the 4wd system on the A4 does not actually use the Haldex system and has no computer control at all, purely mechanical and so it may be possible to change the A3's Haldex Diff with the one from the A4.
Bill, have you decided that you are going to get an A3 then? Still keeping the Ibiza and Golf?
Cheers
Ben
ANDY BLUNT
10-11-2003, 22:15
Keep the beeza ,swap all the bits from golf to a3 and sell the golf standard.Job done ,go on you know it makes sense (to get another sensible road car):p then you have a wet weather track car .If not i'll swap u for the beeza :D Andy.
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 08:12
Originally posted by BenS1
I know you cranked up the power a couple of months ago ut i thouht you have had ove 300lb/ft pretty much since you had the chargecooler?
Cheers
Ben
No mate...
Was running 280lb/ft after CC. Only recently tweeked it up again on new version chip to the >300lb/ft level.
It is still only about 350bhp max tho despite the boost.
Power vs weight vs competant chassis.... there's more to speed than power to weight.
Quattro is nice. :)
regards
bill
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 08:18
Originally posted by BenS1
As a general guide I got a quote for a COMPLETE system including 4 cores with custom end tanks, all pipework, pump, controller and I specced the pre-rad to be roughly the same size as the GRS FMIC (As I know thats the biggest that will fit) and the total price came to roughly £650! Bargin!
if you call them then please let me know how you get on.
Cheers
Ben
Speaking with Jabba yesterday, I would confirm these prices if I were you.
They don't seem to add up.
Get a firm quote for full spec if I were you, suitable for IHI pipework etc.
Bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Speaking with Jabba yesterday, I would confirm these prices if I were you.
They don't seem to add up.
Get a firm quote for full spec if I were you, suitable for IHI pipework etc.
Bill
How do you mean they don't add up? The links I sent clearly show that the price for a full system is below £650... its there in black and white.
Admittedly I didn't give any details of the IHI pipework, as I don't know the details myself. Is this likely to up the price a lot?
I'd guess that Jabba are looking at £2k for a 4 core system?
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Power vs weight vs competant chassis.... there's more to speed than power to weight.
Quattro is nice. :)
regards
bill
I know I'm gonna get flamed for this but the A3 is known to have a pretty poor chasis! The handling is meant to be very crude compared to setups like that on the Focus (Never driven one, its just what all the reviews said). And recently even VW and Audi admitted the poor handling charactistics of that platform, which have now been massively improved with the new version of the platform... which apparently uses a very similar suspension setup to that on the Focus.
Cheers
Ben
PS. I hope I haven't offended anyone... its just what I have read time after time.
Shock_Xe
11-11-2003, 12:30
Originally posted by BenS1
I know I'm gonna get flamed for this but the A3 is known to have a pretty poor chasis! The handling is meant to be very crude compared to setups like that on the Focus (Never driven one, its just what all the reviews said). And recently even VW and Audi admitted the poor handling charactistics of that platform, which have now been massively improved with the new version of the platform... which apparently uses a very similar suspension setup to that on the Focus.
Cheers
Ben
PS. I hope I haven't offended anyone... its just what I have read time after time.
but as i see it you can outwiegh that with the quattro and extra grip you get. And dont forget about the ibiza stock setup! Its narrower at the back and comes with the Review "handling is suspect at speed"
Originally posted by Shock_Xe
but as i see it you can outwiegh that with the quattro and extra grip you get. And dont forget about the ibiza stock setup! Its narrower at the back and comes with the Review "handling is suspect at speed"
Agreed on the Ibiza handling, and I'm sure you could make the A3 handle excellently if you spend the same amount on it that I had to on my Ibizas handling.
Just to make one thing clear, I suspect that a stock A3 handles better than a stock Ibiza.
The thing is, I'm thinking from a personal point of view, and I have quite a lot of handling mods on my Ibiza. So, if you took my Ibiza and gave it 300bhp/ton and took a stock A3 and modded it to 300bhp/ton I suspect my Ibiza would be quicker around a track. Its handling mods and light weight mean that I suspect it will corner faster than the A3 (Note: 4wd does NOT increase you max cornering speed! It does however allow you to exit at a faster speed).
To look at it another way. Say I have 8k to spend, and pretned that I own a stock A3Q and my modded Ibiza. I want to get as fast a track car as possible.... so, I could:
A) Spend 8k on getting the Ibiza upto 410bhp (=366bhp/ton)
B) Spend 5k on getting the IBIZA upto 350bhp (=312nhp/ton) and 3k on making it 4wd!
C) Spend 8k on getting the A3 upto 410bhp (=292bhp/ton)
D) Spend 5k on getting the A3 upto 350bhp (=250bhp/ton) plus 3k on sorting the handling.
Out of the above I think A will be the quickest track car, followed by B, then C then D. Yes the handling and 4wd come into it, but I doubt they can make up the massive differences in power to weight ratio.
Yes the A3 probably has more potential if you grow money trees, but performance per pound I think I'd be better off with the Ibiza.
Cheers
Ben
Shock_Xe
11-11-2003, 13:49
very true, but from a starting point an A3 probably would have been better! However they do cost more to start with
ANDY BLUNT
11-11-2003, 15:00
Cost me a lot less,antiroll bars are cheap ,easily available from Audi s3,tt ,golf v6 4 motion and in different diameters £45 each end.This will make chassis tweaking easy and stock suspension is not bad,firm but absorbs bumps.You wouldn't need to spend 3k to get it to handle,wheels and tyres from a tt are cheap ,transform the handling and brembos fit easily.I want a cheap Q-car ,only paid £7500 for car so thats a good starting point , the car is more comfortable and practical.I still think the beeza is a cracking car,i just needed something more grown up cause i'm a old fart:D :cheers: Andy PS Ben drive one don't beleive all the reviews, they are not interested in day to day drivers ,they just want to sling them round the track and its no impreza which is the benchmark.
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 15:10
Originally posted by BenS1
How do you mean they don't add up? The links I sent clearly show that the price for a full system is below £650... its there in black and white.
Admittedly I didn't give any details of the IHI pipework, as I don't know the details myself. Is this likely to up the price a lot?
I'd guess that Jabba are looking at £2k for a 4 core system?
Cheers
Ben
fitment is the issue to suit an IHI.
Unless its generic, and it could well be in the OE position.. it needs checking.
If OE position then it should be OK. mine started life with OE intercooler an dpipework.
Prices on cores and pre-rad don't match the actual charged prices from Pace. Thats my point.
bill
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 15:13
Originally posted by BenS1
I know I'm gonna get flamed for this but the A3 is known to have a pretty poor chasis! The handling is meant to be very crude compared to setups like that on the Focus (Never driven one, its just what all the reviews said). And recently even VW and Audi admitted the poor handling charactistics of that platform, which have now been massively improved with the new version of the platform... which apparently uses a very similar suspension setup to that on the Focus.
Cheers
Ben
PS. I hope I haven't offended anyone... its just what I have read time after time.
...Read... by motoring journalists.... well known guru's of motoring expertise. :laff:
You need to Drive Ben... not read. ;) and make your own mind up.
If A3 is poor that makes ibiza extremely poor.
Comparing std for std, which we know is'nt the case either.. with our modded motors.
A3 felt very competant.
Golf IV platform is also extremely competant, and significantly nicer than the ibiza.
bill
ANDY BLUNT
11-11-2003, 15:24
Car is also on cheap tyres,good tread but cheap,on F1's would be even better.I am not a great driver ,good but not great ,thats why wanted Stig ,sorry Bill to drive it for another opinion .Sorry if i'm preaching but this car surpised me so much.:cheers: Andy.
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 15:56
Originally posted by ANDY BLUNT
Car is also on cheap tyres,good tread but cheap,on F1's would be even better.I am not a great driver ,good but not great ,thats why wanted Stig ,sorry Bill to drive it for another opinion .Sorry if i'm preaching but this car surpised me so much.:cheers: Andy.
Do your brakes still smell? :p :rolleyes:
A3 1.8T Quattro was a nice package....
I did like it.....
Deffo wanna try Mike's when its running.
Sensible Road Car.
Originally posted by ANDY BLUNT
Cost me a lot less,antiroll bars are cheap ,easily available from Audi s3,tt ,golf v6 4 motion and in different diameters £45 each end.This will make chassis tweaking easy and stock suspension is not bad,firm but absorbs bumps.You wouldn't need to spend 3k to get it to handle,wheels and tyres from a tt are cheap ,transform the handling and brembos fit easily.I want a cheap Q-car ,only paid £7500 for car so thats a good starting point , the car is more comfortable and practical.I still think the beeza is a cracking car,i just needed something more grown up cause i'm a old fart:D :cheers: Andy PS Ben drive one don't beleive all the reviews, they are not interested in day to day drivers ,they just want to sling them round the track and its no impreza which is the benchmark.
The trouble is that all the bits you mention are off of cars on the same platform which again don't perform that well. The S3 and TT arn't great handling cars. You want BETTER anti-rollbars than those on the TT/S3/4Motion... better than stock suspension, better than TT wheels and tyres.
It sounds to me like you want to get it handling like and S3, whereas I would want it handling much better than an S3.
Also, I too am not interested in day to day driving... I want it to handle on track as best as it possibly could.
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by ibizacupra
...Read... by motoring journalists.... well known guru's of motoring expertise. :laff:
You need to Drive Ben... not read. ;) and make your own mind up.
If A3 is poor that makes ibiza extremely poor.
Comparing std for std, which we know is'nt the case either.. with our modded motors.
bill
I have driven A3s and S3s quite a few times... not on track but given a bloody good thrashing through A, B and country roads. Just feels heavy to me.
If A3 is poor that makes ibiza extremely poor.
Comparing std for std, which we know is'nt the case either.. with our modded motors.
Yes, but the Ibizas handling in standard form is very poor... even dangerous.
I think I'm beginning to sound a bit anti A3 here... I'm not. They are very nice cars. If I had 15k to spend on mods then I'd start with an A3Q but as I don't I know that for £X spent on the Ibiza I will get a faster car than if I spent £X on an A3.
Cheers
Ben
Shock_Xe
11-11-2003, 16:43
Originally posted by BenS1
The trouble is that all the bits you mention are off of cars on the same platform which again don't perform that well. The S3 and TT arn't great handling cars. You want BETTER anti-rollbars than those on the TT/S3/4Motion... better than stock suspension, better than TT wheels and tyres.
It sounds to me like you want to get it handling like and S3, whereas I would want it handling much better than an S3.
Also, I too am not interested in day to day driving... I want it to handle on track as best as it possibly could.
Cheers
Ben
when he says s3/TT/4 motion, I think he means because they are all the same platform you can buy an UPRATED bar for any 1 of these cars and it will bolt onto an A3 so due to the vast number of options available and the competition for this area/platform of the market prices are low in comparison to the ibiza ones which are 3x/4x the price
You say you want it brill on a track but tbh how much are you gonna be on track compared to the road?? But each to their own!
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 18:06
Originally posted by BenS1
I have driven A3s and S3s quite a few times... not on track but given a bloody good thrashing through A, B and country roads. Just feels heavy to me.
Cheers
Ben
'heavy' or planted?
Sorry bud I do do disagree with you on this one.
S3/A3 quattro, give it some power and it will be a whole lot more competant than the Ibiza...
Along the same lines as the MKIV is more competant than my Ibiza. Is the MKIV faster? In some respects yes. (real roads for example) - On track, nope. but not too far behind.
the more user friendly is the mkiv platform car.
Ultimate track attack favour the ibiza.
Question is tho.... where do these cars spend most of their time? ;)
I look forward to seeing what Mikes A3 quattro with IHI drives like. I suspect I know the answer and I suspect I know what I may want shortly afterwards too as a road car.
Ibiza 'feels' faster and is more nervious a car. S3/A3/Golf IV just gets on with it and does the business without fuss. B-road blat would be night and day different between you in your Ibiza (IHI'd) and me in the MKIV, with you having a higher power to weight.
Its a preference thing... I guess.
The Ibiza is'nt a great place to start from to make an ultimate track toy.
regards
bill
IHI in an ibiza in my opinion is all well and good but if i was looking for a track car i would look at lots of other cars before the ibiza. I want a reasonably quick road car, which will look and have all the cabin internals of a stnd ibiza, but underneath will be a match for most road going cars. A chipped ibiza is okay but for me it falls into no-mans land. Its above the likes of vts/106gti's 172 clio's, in terms of performance (straight line) but it falls short of most good Scoobs, Evo's chipped rs focus and modded cossies. Theres always a car faster that can brake and handle better than yours, but i would hope a 300bhp would be able to hold its own against the above mentioned cars in most general cases. :cheers:
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 19:51
Originally posted by Madmile
IHI in an ibiza in my opinion is all well and good but if i was looking for a track car i would look at lots of other cars before the ibiza. I want a reasonably quick road car, which will look and have all the cabin internals of a stnd ibiza, but underneath will be a match for most road going cars. A chipped ibiza is okay but for me it falls into no-mans land. Its above the likes of vts/106gti's 172 clio's, in terms of performance (straight line) but it falls short of most good Scoobs, Evo's chipped rs focus and modded cossies. Theres always a car faster that can brake and handle better than yours, but i would hope a 300bhp would be able to hold its own against the above mentioned cars in most general cases. :cheers:
In a straight line. :)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
'heavy' or planted?
Sorry bud I do do disagree with you on this one.
S3/A3 quattro, give it some power and it will be a whole lot more competant than the Ibiza...
Along the same lines as the MKIV is more competant than my Ibiza. Is the MKIV faster? In some respects yes. (real roads for example) - On track, nope. but not too far behind.
But again you are comparing you 400+bhp Golf to the 350bhp Ibiza. I'm sure you agree that if both the Ibiza and the Golf had 350bhp, or both had 400bhp then the difference would be even greater than it is now?
Ibiza 'feels' faster and is more nervious a car. S3/A3/Golf IV just gets on with it and does the business without fuss. B-road blat would be night and day different between you in your Ibiza (IHI'd) and me in the MKIV, with you having a higher power to weight.
Yeah, but then again I'm sure that if we then got out and swapped you'd win in the Ibiza over me driving the Golf.... you're a nutter! :D
Remember, I'm comparing performance per unit price. And as 350bhp costs the same in the ibiza as the A3 you have to compare like for like power... you can't compare 350bhp in one with 400+bhp in another.
I really would love a 450bhp A3Q, but then I'd be thinking "Hmmm, but a 450bhp Ibiza would be even faster for the same price!".
Cheers
Ben
Theres always a car faster that can brake and handle better than yours, but i would hope a 300bhp ibiza would be able to hold its own against the above mentioned cars in most general cases.
Remember Bill, where me and custardcupra live its r-about to r-about stuff with at least a madmile in between each R-about. Its not Lotus Elise country around here mate. Plus i iz got big swollocks!!!. Its mostly 40mph to however fast you can/dare go m8.
:devil:
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 20:48
Originally posted by BenS1
But again you are comparing you 400+bhp Golf to the 350bhp Ibiza. I'm sure you agree that if both the Ibiza and the Golf had 350bhp, or both had 400bhp then the difference would be even greater than it is now?
Yeah, but then again I'm sure that if we then got out and swapped you'd win in the Ibiza over me driving the Golf.... you're a nutter! :D
Remember, I'm comparing performance per unit price. And as 350bhp costs the same in the ibiza as the A3 you have to compare like for like power... you can't compare 350bhp in one with 400+bhp in another.
I really would love a 450bhp A3Q, but then I'd be thinking "Hmmm, but a 450bhp Ibiza would be even faster for the same price!".
Cheers
Ben
The Golf is'nt 400bhp.. It runs ~380bhp. I have never ran it at max boost that Mike got the over 400bhp figure from. Intercooling is too poor for that in any sustained manner. Its broken now don't forget! :(
I am comparing power and weight vs chassis capability. Forget the money... LOL :)
Getting an Ibiza to handle the power is more difficult and expensive than the MKIV based platform.
A 450bhp Ibiza would be your coffin. :( :no:
450bhp! These figures are all well and good for pub talk and bragging rights etc.... but you will find the limit of usable power and usable power delivery well before then. trust me on this.:spin:
Best stock up on some spare driveshafts, CV's g'boxes and brakes. You're going to need them all mate.
Step by step and see how far you actually want to go with a road car.
Bill
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 20:49
Originally posted by Madmile
Theres always a car faster that can brake and handle better than yours, but i would hope a 300bhp ibiza would be able to hold its own against the above mentioned cars in most general cases.
Remember Bill, where me and custardcupra live its r-about to r-about stuff with at least a madmile in between each R-about. Its not Lotus Elise country around here mate. Plus i iz got big swollocks!!!. Its mostly 40mph to however fast you can/dare go m8.
:devil:
Always a faster car - abso bloody lutely :D
Big cahoonas :)
Yep... got me some of them too ;)
Me and jools custardcupra have talked and looks like we are both going for the 300bhp-310bhp IHI kit.:) . Gonna try a have some form of reliability.:p
I don't actually plan on taking the Ibiza upto 450bhp... in fact given your gearbox problem I will probably stick to 320bhp... or at least for now.
Ok, how can I put it another way. Say I get the Ibiza IHI'd upto 350bhp and after a while i decide that I want more power but the Ibiza isn't up to it, so I decide to get an A3Q. I sell the Ibiza, buy an A3Q, spend £5+k getting it a stage 3 IHI and then find that its actually slower than the Ibiza was (Which it would be). I'd then have to goto approx Stage 5 (450bhp) before the A3 would out perform the Ibiza... and I guess that you are looking at over £10k for the stage 5 kits!
I'd love it, but if I had 10k spare then there are other things I'd have to spend it on (Probably put it towards a deposit on a 2nd house that I'd rent out.).
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by Madmile
Me and jools custardcupra have talked and looks like we are both going for the 300bhp-310bhp IHI kit.:) . Gonna try a have some form of reliability.:p
That sounds sensible to me. I can't remmeber exactly what the difference is in the spec of the stage 2 and stage 3, do you know? Also, what is the price difference?
Even though stage 2 would be the sensibe option I'm sure I'll go for the stage 3. I have not sense!
Ben
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Always a faster car - abso bloody lutely :D
Big cahoonas :)
Yep... got me some of them too ;)
Jools saw the size of my cahoonas on Sunday afternoon going down the madmile (145mph+), we then both braked for the r-about (both have Your Brembo kit) all i can say is it would be impossible to brake any later or harder and get the car to squirm anymore than it did, Jools watched my car from behind under v-hard braking. Never again, i had to go home and change my y-fronts. And another thing. Jools stop looking at my cahoonas.
Using public roads is not big or clever for testing your brakes out on, BUT i own that particular piece of private road so its okay.
Originally posted by BenS1
I really would love a 450bhp A3Q, but then I'd be thinking "Hmmm, but a 450bhp Ibiza would be even faster for the same price!".
Cheers
Ben
FFS Ben, get a sports bike or a Caterfield! :D
FWIW, I agree with Bill on the planted bit. My Corrado can sit at 140mph+ in near serenity, the Ibiza is scary above 110mph even with my suspension, wheels, spacers, etc. The Corrado also trounces the Ibiza & A3-platform cars for handling & steering feel, like for like.
I know I'd be faster in the Corrado around any circuit than I would in my Ibiza, even if they were identical power, such is the confidence I have in it over the Ibiza. It's the main reason that I'm torn between going for the IHI or just getting the Ibiza chipped and putting the money into the Corrado instead as that's meant to be my track car with the Ibiza as nippy daily driver and Fireblade for REAL acceleration.
It's Bill's fault, he put this IHI idea in my head - LOL!
ibizacupra
11-11-2003, 21:15
LOL
Sorry 'bout that.
IHI? never heard of it... them.... him... who?
:jog:
The different 'Stages' being quoted leaves me confused to be honest.
325bhp & 280lb/ft from the manifold equipped conversion which seems a reasonable and reliable 1st (2nd) stage.
I ran this initially.
Stock IC then. 15psi boost max.
Super torque delivery from 3K and up.
Getting higher than this from an otherwise stock engine (IC, Compression etc) is a question of more boost and having sufficient sized injectors to go with it. (and fuel pump)
Smallport head will be the restriction on top end power. Largeport seems to be very hjigh revving, which in turn, amplifies the weakness in the g'box synchos.. Where will it all end :eek:
Looking into transmissions which may cope with the torque and track use... going to be the thick end of a few grand... :( :( :(
Let us know how you get on with the gearboxes Bill.
Glenn, my Ibiza feels fine at 110mph, in fact it feels fine at over 140bhp... no problem or twitchness at all. In fact, my mates with the Civic Type R and another mate with an RX-7 both say how well my car handles now with all the mods... when I took the CTR owner out as a passenger at a trackday recently he commented as I went around a corner something along the lines of "Bloody hell, if I had taken the corner at that speed in my CTR then I'd of been in the midle of that field!", and used phrases like "Go-kart like handling". The CTR is meant to be a pretty good handling car itself.
I know that standard Ibiza handles like poo. And I'm not sure what handling mods Jabba have done to their demo Ibiza but its bloody scarey taking it out for a test drive... it bounces around so much that i think it spent more time in the air than on the road. It was a real handful to keep it on the road!!!
Cheers
Ben
CustardCupra
13-11-2003, 17:21
Have settled on STAGE 2 purely for reliability as my car isn't a track car ( YET ;) ).
In straight line acceleration from 40 mph - 160 mph, What would be the distance in car lengths Between stage 2 & 3 ??????
spoke to jabba today all being well i should have my kit within the month . a good friend of mine is fitting it then drive up to jabba for the mapping . only prob i have at the mo is the i/c . going over to 2 1/2 " pipe tomorrow and then on the rollers on sat , with a bit of luck this should/might help the preasue drop ? if not then maybe a roof mounted intercooler :) thats gotta work :) damm a/c :devil:
Within a month! Really! :D
Does that mean I might have mine as a Christmas present? :D
I presume there no reason why this applies only to you?
I thought you had given up on the 2.5" pipework for the I/C?
Can't wait!
:)
Ben
not given up mate just gona try a twin pass on 2 1/2" pipe . as far as im aware you can have the kit soon as the down pipe is sorted !only going for stage 2 (at the mo) with boost controller . want to hang on to my gear box for as long as poss :). give elton a bell and see what he says .
When you say that the kit is ready, does that also mean that they are ready for fitting them?
I may well give them a call... but don't want to p them off with too many calls!
Cheers
Ben
hopkinsgm
14-11-2003, 08:18
Originally posted by BenS1
...Also, I too am not interested in day to day driving... I want it to handle on track as best as it possibly could...
Off topic and not wishing to get anybody's back up here but if you're not interested in day to day driving, why are you so bothered about retaining useable rear seats if you put a roll cage in?
Surely one of your many books has at least hinted that trying to remove as much weight as possible is a "good" thing - not only does it result in a more favourable power to weight ratio, but it means there's less mass for your suspension to try and control. A roll cage such as those we have discussed in the past is likely to be substantially heavier than a conventional one, and then theres the weight of the seats themselves... Not to mention that such a cage would likely not reduce body flex to the same extent that a conventional one would...
Originally posted by BenS1
When you say that the kit is ready, does that also mean that they are ready for fitting them?
I may well give them a call... but don't want to p them off with too many calls!
Cheers
Ben i was told i can have a kit (stage 2) within a few weeks , as for fitting im doing it with a friend .
CustardCupra
14-11-2003, 15:03
BEN m8 ,
IMO those of us wishing for jabba to fit the kit are still going to be looking at JAN-FEB 2004 .
Personally i can wait till then , but hey , sooner the better ;)
Cash has been sat there since early this year and is starting to burn a rather large hole in my pocket .
Route i'm taking is Stage 2 ( 300-310 bhp) Boost controller and race cat,
then strip the car out and possibly ditch the A/C .
This should give the same PWR as stage 3 ,
Also by ditching the Aircon it frees alot more room for a LARGE FMIC .
Yeah, Jan/Feb will still be fine, but Decemeber would be an excellent Christmas pressy. :)
Cheers
Ben
I am well down the list, so i dont exspect to have mine done until april/May at best, but we will see what happens.
explain list . why not buy the kit and fit it yourself or get someone else to fit it and get jabba to map it ? might save you time if you are in need of it .:)
Originally posted by gillm
explain list . why not buy the kit and fit it yourself or get someone else to fit it and get jabba to map it ? might save you time if you are in need of it .:)
hmmmm am no 3 in Q for a kit ...no phone call from em as yet.. was told feb ..even for the kit !!
Originally posted by custard cruiser
hmmmm am no 3 in Q for a kit ...no phone call from em as yet.. was told feb ..even for the kit !!
Where has all this talk of Feb come from? The last i heard it was going to be January! If you are number 3 and expecting your in Feb then mine will be ages!
Madmile, do you know where you are on the list? When did you put your name down?
The reason I want to get mine fitted by Jabba is because I have had experiences before where I have bought a product and got someone else to fit it. It wasn't quite right and so I phoned the company that supplied it... they said that there was nothing wrong with the product and suggested it had been fitted incorrectly. The people that fitted it said that it was fitted correctly and that the problem was with the supplied product. Neither company would accept that it was their fault! If I had had it fitted at the place where I bought it then there were be no question about whos responsible!
So, I'd rather buy it and get it fitted at the same place.
Cheers
Ben
if there is nothing wrong with the product , which i belive there is not , then i will fit no questions asked , sure jabba will know a few tricks on fitting it but i have a very good friend who is a great mechanic and i have full trust in him and the product .
your are right , there are far too many monkeys out there with spanners in their hands . with myself being a aircraft mechanic i hope we have no problems :)
CustardCupra
16-11-2003, 14:53
Will be letting Jabba do all the work on my car as for the same reasons BENS1 has stated .
Was under the impression January was the start date too :confused: .
Even if you fit the kit yourself i can't see it getting done any quicker as you will still have to book it in for the remap ( waiting list ).
Would also think Jabba would charge an inspection fee for correct fitment of IHI prior to it going on the rollers .
nothing has been said about an inspection ? as for the re-map all i have to do is book it in and they said there should be no problems and i won't have to wait that long as it is only the mapping .
Im sure that i can cope with fitting a turbo and some injectors! It doesn't take brain surgery. I have done all the conversion work on my audi S2 including turbo, manifolds, injectors, plus loads of other things. It just a case of garage trust, and im glad Gillm has the trust in my work. He knows that when his car is in the garage it will get lookedafter the same way as i look after mine. Top notch. When this sort of work is done, there is no comprimise, it has to be done right! Try and skimp and it will go wrong.
ANDY BLUNT
16-11-2003, 22:37
Originally posted by gillm
if there is nothing wrong with the product , which i belive there is not , then i will fit no questions asked , sure jabba will know a few tricks on fitting it but i have a very good friend who is a great mechanic and i have full trust in him and the product .
your are right , there are far too many monkeys out there with spanners in their hands . with myself being a aircraft mechanic i hope we have no problems :) Aircraft engineer,snap,where do you work,i work in GE Wales on CFM56 compressors.:cheers: Andy
CustardCupra
17-11-2003, 10:15
Audiman & gillm , fortunately you guys seem to have the skill and resources to carry out this conversion ,
not everyone is this fortunate and living up here in the frozen N.East of England it is not worth the hassle of paying someone else to fit the IHI then p1ss about trailering the car down to Jabba for remap .
Hope it all goes well guys .
Its not a case of there being anything wrong with the kits design or a case of whether you are competant enough to fit it.
Scenario 1:
In my case, imagine I bought the kit and took it to a local garage. The garage fits it and when we test it I get no boost at all! They check it over and can't find anything wrong and so they say they think the Turbo is faulty!
I phone Jabba and they say they can look at the car (Potential waiting list here!) but if it turns out that the turbo isn't faulty then I'd have to pay for the investigation time.
Jabba check the car over and find the problem... something not fitted correctly. They fix it but bill me for the time. I go back to the garage that fitted it and try and get them to pay for it... they insist that Jabba must of replaced a fault component and that they HAD fitted it correctly.
Scenario 2:
I get the kit from Jabba, and get it fitted. It doesn't work (Worse still maybe the car wont run at all)... I contact Jabba and they say that they will refit and test the kit to try and find the faulty component, but this is 1 weeks work and so I'll have to join the waiting list (They can't magic up time from nowhere). So, I maybe have 1+ month with no working car and then I have to get it upto Jabba somehow.
Just to clarify, I'm not saying ANYTHING bad about Jabba here. None of the above has happened, and I have no reason to expect that it will except that if it happens to anyone then its bound to be me. :(
Fitting the kit is probably way beyond my ability, and the only garage I trust other than Jabba is AutoTechniks and they have a waiting list just as long as Jabbas (I ordered a Quaife and Clutch in May and the earliest they can fit it is December 15th!!!).
Cheers
Ben
andy i work for westlands as a fitter/inspector or as tommy (audiman)calls it "restlands" as he thinks i don't do anything .
ben like i said i belive jabbas kit is up to it but if you are not happy with other garages then thats a shame :( i know a few bad ones too but i have full trust in both myself tom oh and the kit :) just to clarify you can drive the car with out the map ,but there are a few little things to leave off .
p.s can't spell for shite
Impossible Performance will be able to offer T28 hybrid turbo conversion making 280bhp 270lbs ft of torque with a 500rpm rev limit above the stnd rev limit and also a 310/320bhp as above within the next couple of weeks. They turbo makes 1 bar of boost all the way upto the new rev limit. The cost for the 280bhp kit is £2000 all parts and labour, vat inclusive. The 310/320bhp kit is £2500 all parts, labour vat inclusive. This is what i was told from Impossible today. Sounds very intresting and a possible alternative to the Jabba conversion. I am not saying it is better/worse just an option for those who may be intrested. :cheers:
Originally posted by gillm
ben like i said i belive jabbas kit is up to it
Its not a matter of thier kit being up to it. You can get a dodgy unit in any batch, ie. if you bought 100 IHI turbos then I wouldn't be surprised if there were a couple of dodgy ones in there... it wouln't be Jabbas fault if one got passed onto you as they can't test each one before including it in the kit.
Gary,
The Impossible performance upgrade sounds interesting... but personally I'm definately sticking with Jabba. Its a proven and tested kit.
So, thats Jabba, TSR, Revo, Impossible and possibly APR that are all doing turbo upgrades for the Ibiza, taking the power close to or beyond 300bhp! Thats what i like to see. :D
Cheers
Ben
Tested on 2/3 cars Ben. HHHMMMMM!!!!!. Is that enough Impossible have already done some golfs, more than 2/3 i think.
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 18:42
Originally posted by Madmile
Impossible Performance will be able to offer T28 hybrid turbo conversion making 280bhp 270lbs ft of torque with a 500rpm rev limit above the stnd rev limit and also a 310/320bhp as above within the next couple of weeks. They turbo makes 1 bar of boost all the way upto the new rev limit. The cost for the 280bhp kit is £2000 all parts and labour, vat inclusive. The 310/320bhp kit is £2500 all parts, labour vat inclusive. This is what i was told from Impossible today. Sounds very intresting and a possible alternative to the Jabba conversion. I am not saying it is better/worse just an option for those who may be intrested. :cheers:
I'd like to see one running for a while first personally.
USA sourced? LHD biased? Previous offerings like this have been anything but easy to use.
Benefit of the doubt tho... So who's going to be first...? :D
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 18:43
Originally posted by Madmile
Tested on 2/3 cars Ben. HHHMMMMM!!!!!. Is that enough Impossible have already done some golfs, more than 2/3 i think.
Ibiza is NOT a Golf.
Not as easy to do on Ibiza...
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 18:44
Originally posted by BenS1
So, thats Jabba, TSR, Revo, Impossible and possibly APR that are all doing turbo upgrades for the Ibiza, taking the power close to or beyond 300bhp! Thats what i like to see. :D
Cheers
Ben
Know any Ibiza's running any of these?
Erm nope ! (or are there?)
Be interesting to see/hear how they go etc... reliable etc....
USA based explain more Bill, Please explain your worries over the conversion, as i am a tech dummy.
I am not writing any conversion off as of yet as the Jabba conversion it no more proven than any other. 2-3 cars are not enough to make a conclusive decision over Jabba's conversion as none have come from the more massed produced kits. Like i said not saying anyones is better or worse, but more and more options are popping up. Time will tell.:cheers:
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Know any Ibiza's running any of these?
Erm nope ! (or are there?)
Be interesting to see/hear how they go etc... reliable etc....
True. I'm sure Revos kit will be fairly popular IF priced correctly though.
BTW, i phoned Jabba up today to ask about their chargecoolers. I didn't really find much out,except that they confirmed that if they test OK then they will be going for them. No prices yet though.
The one interesting piece of info I did find out though is that I'm apparently about 4 or 5 on the list! :D I thought i was like 20 something!
Cheers
Ben
CustardCupra
17-11-2003, 18:59
Impossible 280 bhp /275lbft @peak revs £2000 All inclusive
Jabba 280bhp / 275 lbft @ peak revs £2800 all inclusive .
Impossible 310 -320 £2500 all in incl fmic
Jabba 300-310 £3800 all in
Sounds very tempting .
To go Jabba stage 2 your gonna need another £1200 ontop of stage 1
and another £1200 ontop of stage 2 for stage 3 .
So lets say i go to Jabba and opt for stage 1 and i get 280 bhp ,
Then someone else pays £1200 more than me for stage 2 and only gets 300 bhp , it starts to sound like a very expensive 20 bhp to me .
Same scenario
I get 310 bhp stage 2 and someone else pays for stage 3 and gets 340bhp....thats £1200more again for 30bhp .
Hope i'm making sense :p
You pays your money etc
CustardCupra
17-11-2003, 19:05
Originally posted by BenS1
The one interesting piece of info I did find out though is that I'm apparently about 4 or 5 on the list! :D I thought i was like 20 something!
Cheers
Ben
LOL how much did that cost :D
if youv'e gone from 20 something to 4 then me and madmile must be 1 & 2 on the list :p
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 19:16
Originally posted by Madmile
I am not writing any conversion off as of yet as the Jabba conversion it no more proven than any other. 2-3 cars are not enough to make a conclusive decision over Jabba's conversion as none have come from the more massed produced kits. Like i said not saying anyones is better or worse, but more and more options are popping up. Time will tell.:cheers:
There are more than 2-3 cars running IHI. Jabba have been running these for 3-4 years now on some race cars and their old demo Rallye Golf.
I know of no other as developed or tested setup anywhere this side of the Atlantic.
No such thing as mass produced. This is niche market and a very limited market at that. Not too many nutters around.. Present company accepted :D
Looking at Bill's car and spec. as it's evolved, I think it's highly unlikely that anyone will crack 330+bhp without dropping the CR.
Given Bills comments re: VW synchros at high revs (the point at which you'll be making 300+bhp), I very much doubt that you'll actually (be able to) use more than 270-280bhp on the road and perhaps even on track.
The only reason I'm interested in the Stage 2 is because it has a proper manifold, rather than an adaptor.
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 19:24
Originally posted by CustardCupra
Impossible 280 bhp /275lbft @peak revs £2000 All inclusive
Jabba 280bhp / 275 lbft @ peak revs £2800 all inclusive .
Impossible 310 -320 £2500 all in incl fmic
Jabba 300-310 £3800 all in
Sounds very tempting .
To go Jabba stage 2 your gonna need another £1200 ontop of stage 1
and another £1200 ontop of stage 2 for stage 3 .
So lets say i go to Jabba and opt for stage 1 and i get 280 bhp ,
Then someone else pays £1200 more than me for stage 2 and only gets 300 bhp , it starts to sound like a very expensive 20 bhp to me .
Same scenario
I get 310 bhp stage 2 and someone else pays for stage 3 and gets 340bhp....thats £1200more again for 30bhp .
Hope i'm making sense :p
You pays your money etc
Just ask yourself who has actually developed this kit in the UK, on an Ibiza. We know Jabba have done 2 or them, and both are ragged rotton. There is more to this upgrade than just sourcing manifold and turbo from somewhere and piecing together a kit of bits. Mapping to suit etc....
If you do enquire about the other options, ask for a tech sheet of what is or is'nt included.
Any dyno's or customers to back up the power claims on their spec sheets? It is'nt as simple as it seems... and writing specs is the easy bit.
USA sourced ATP manifolds for example are predominantly LHD fitment. I give you an example of a UK customer who bought a kit such as this from a UK source (I will not name here) and the parts did not add up to a kit at all. LHD derived kit did not just fit onto the RHD car. It got all legal and sueing in the end such was the frustration and delay. Buyer beware.
Check and ensure they are quoting you for a full on kit, and ask for references of a happy customer having run this for a while.
I do not see there being an actual market for the 280 Jabba kit personally.... as it will barely run any boost running those low levels.
Worth chasing to find the spec out for everyone tho if you are interested in this option. Just make sure its all that you imagined it to be.
Good luck
Bill
My personal opinion on this is that, why bother with the stage 1 kit? To get the best out of the turbo and engine, it needs to flow better. This is where the manifold is so important. Gillm has opted for the stage 2(i think he would get scared with more!), which is a far better overall package, the real reason for this is that its a daily driver and he cant afford to do the quaife gearbox thang! As we all know the ibiza box is not the strongest :)
If i owned an Ibiza, i would have to opt for stage 3. And just rebuild the gearbox each time it breaks. Or drive it gently in first and second.
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 19:47
Originally posted by audiman
If i owned an Ibiza, i would have to opt for stage 3. And just rebuild the gearbox each time it breaks. Or drive it gently in first and second.
LOL - you think?
when it failed it was on 1bar boost only, which is stage 2 level.
The damage was done at Cadwell tho I think.
Bill
tom has too much time on his hands and he loves playing with cars :)
Originally posted by ibizacupra
LOL - you think?
when it failed it was on 1bar boost only, which is stage 2 level.
The damage was done at Cadwell tho I think.
Bill
Thats settled it for me then, Stage 1 it is 270-280bhp, with some form of reliabilty and traction. I am sure a 280bhp Ibiza is still pretty quick even against evo's and good spec'd scoobs. I dont fancy engine, gearbox rebuilds and new clutch's every 6 months. I will just have to settle for less. I may use Jabba i may use impossible, at the end of the day i would just take my car to stealth after the conversion and get a power run to confirm.:cheers:
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 22:19
Originally posted by Madmile
Thats settled it for me then, Stage 1 it is 270-280bhp, with some form of reliabilty and traction. I am sure a 280bhp Ibiza is still pretty quick even against evo's and good spec'd scoobs. I dont fancy engine, gearbox rebuilds and new clutch's every 6 months. I will just have to settle for less. I may use Jabba i may use impossible, at the end of the day i would just take my car to stealth after the conversion and get a power run to confirm.:cheers:
Jabba's rollers match Stealths ad visa versa on my motor... except Stealths can;t measure mine these days... :laff:
Low boost on mine @ 9psi is 250bhp, and 12psi ran 286bhp so its going to be very unstressed. Mine lives on low boost most of the time on the road, and is plenty for day to day.
regards
bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
LOL - you think?
when it failed it was on 1bar boost only, which is stage 2 level.
The damage was done at Cadwell tho I think.
Bill
You havent seen me drive Bill! I would never nail my car in first or second :devil:
I have killed two gearboxes in the S2 now!! Suppose thats what tuning cars does to its internals! Nearly 400 bhp and about 550+Nm of torque is gonna do some damage somewhere along the line :D
Tom
ibizacupra
17-11-2003, 23:16
Originally posted by Madmile
Thats settled it for me then, Stage 1 it is 270-280bhp, with some form of reliabilty and traction. I am sure a 280bhp Ibiza is still pretty quick even against evo's and good spec'd scoobs. I dont fancy engine, gearbox rebuilds and new clutch's every 6 months. I will just have to settle for less. I may use Jabba i may use impossible, at the end of the day i would just take my car to stealth after the conversion and get a power run to confirm.:cheers:
Well here's some light reading for you... http://www.vwturbo.com/products/items/transverse18t.asp
manifold>> http://www.vwturbo.com/products/details.asp?id=20&cat=1
http://www.vwturbo.com/products/new.asp
MKIV based.
Left Hand Drive.
Bill
Impossible are hoping to have a right hand drive kit ready for the ibiza in the next couple of weeks.
Are impossible using the ATP kits then Bill, or do they use something else. Do you know!!!!!.:cheers:
Madmile,
i think you should have been finishing you k04 setup, as you already spent lots of time with it. BTW: would you sell your k04 exhaust manifold?! ;)
ibizacupra
18-11-2003, 11:18
Originally posted by Madmile
Are impossible using the ATP kits then Bill, or do they use something else. Do you know!!!!!.:cheers:
Sorry... Dunno mate.
other than ATP, or APR, I don;t know of any other cast manifold for 20VT's which accomodates upgraded or larger turbos.
Question for Mike @ Impossible me thinks.
Originally posted by CustardCupra
LOL how much did that cost :D
if youv'e gone from 20 something to 4 then me and madmile must be 1 & 2 on the list :p
I think I may still be 20 something on the overall list, but I think they are doing all the Ibizas first, in which case I', 4 or 5 on the Ibiza list. :D
Ben
Originally posted by audiman
If i owned an Ibiza, i would have to opt for stage 3. And just rebuild the gearbox each time it breaks. Or drive it gently in first and second.
Jabba were originally going to take a linear speed input signal into their boost controller so that at low speeds/rpm it would run less boost, thereby making it more controlable in 1st and 2nd.
When I phoned them the other day they said that they were no longer going to do that as they didn't have time. :(
I was thinking about having a go at it myself... shouldn't be too difficult I wouldn't of thought. Probably wont do it though.
Cheers
Ben
The impossible kit is based on the ATP kit, so the links Bill has put up gives you some idead of what is done and used...:cheers:
Looks like i may be going the Impossible route.
Originally posted by Sim
Madmile,
i think you should have been finishing you k04 setup, as you already spent lots of time with it. BTW: would you sell your k04 exhaust manifold?! ;)
What do you mean Sim :p ;) .
CustardCupra
18-11-2003, 16:19
Guidance needed Please .
Bill in your opinion then for someone who is only going to use the car for the road ............WHAT STAGE DO YOU RECOMMEND ????
I'm asking you as you are the only one on here who's had the pleasure of running the IHI for a while now :D
Originally i was going stage 3 but for the Queens highways i thought the car would never be used at the full potential,
So stage 2 was next but i can't justify spending an extra £ 1200 on it compared to stage 1 all for 20-30 bhp,
Especially as i allready have a MILLTEK cat fitted , this would be rendered useless on stage 2 but usable with stage 1.
ibizacupra
18-11-2003, 18:20
Originally posted by CustardCupra
Guidance needed Please .
Bill in your opinion then for someone who is only going to use the car for the road ............WHAT STAGE DO YOU RECOMMEND ????
I'm asking you as you are the only one on here who's had the pleasure of running the IHI for a while now :D
Originally i was going stage 3 but for the Queens highways i thought the car would never be used at the full potential,
So stage 2 was next but i can't justify spending an extra £ 1200 on it compared to stage 1 all for 20-30 bhp,
Especially as i allready have a MILLTEK cat fitted , this would be rendered useless on stage 2 but usable with stage 1.
If this helps... I drive mine on lowest boost 90% of the time... Track use gets full power (dry) unless its wet.
This is ~9psi and 250bhp. 280bhp is their stage 1 is it not?
Its plenty for real road driving IMHO. You cannot use 350bhp on the roads in the Ibiza... (ignore motorways here)
You will still harry M5's on motorways such is the torque delvery and spread of power.
You can always go back for remap and add ons if it turns out you want more.
Practicly tho, 280bhp in an Ibiza is going to be road friendly and still damned fast.
What would I reccomend? Prolly the kit which includes the exhaust manifold as the future potential is an easier step to make (IF) you wanted to go further. 325bhp with boost controller adjustment down to 250bhp for rainy days :p This setup only runs 1bar boost, does'nt create lots of heat, could retain the stock IC, and can always be tuned upward from there by Jabba's mapping.
Does this help?
Bill
Make BMW
Model M5
Production 2241
When Built 1998 - 1988
Layout Front engine / rear-wheel-drive
Body Style Saloon
Engine -
Engine Configuration 4941cc / V8 / Twin overhead camshaft per head
Power (hp/rpm) 400/6600
Torque (lb ft/rpm) 369/3800
Transmission 6-spd/-
Front Suspension Independent Coil springs
Rear Suspension Independent Coil springs
Steering Rack and pinion
Brakes Disc/disc
Tyres (in or mm/%) - wheels (in) 245/40-18/ 275/35-18
Length (in) 188
Weight (lb) 3872
Top speed (mph) 161
0-60 mph (sec) 5.3
Standing ¼ml (sec) 14.1
UK price (£) 59590
Originally posted by ibizacupra
If this helps... I drive mine on lowest boost 90% of the time... Track use gets full power (dry) unless its wet.
This is ~9psi and 250bhp. 280bhp is their stage 1 is it not?
Its plenty for real road driving IMHO. You cannot use 350bhp on the roads in the Ibiza... (ignore motorways here)
You will still harry M5's on motorways such is the torque delvery and spread of power.
You can always go back for remap and add ons if it turns out you want more.
Practicly tho, 280bhp in an Ibiza is going to be road friendly and still damned fast.
What would I reccomend? Prolly the kit which includes the exhaust manifold as the future potential is an easier step to make (IF) you wanted to go further. 325bhp with boost controller adjustment down to 250bhp for rainy days :p This setup only runs 1bar boost, does'nt create lots of heat, could retain the stock IC, and can always be tuned upward from there by Jabba's mapping.
Does this help?
Bill so that aims at the stage 2 kit then bill :) plus the controller . thats my plan anyway . wanna join the tsr of the clock club , felt left of on sat :jog:
ibizacupra
19-11-2003, 07:26
Originally posted by Madmile
Make BMW
Model M5
Production 2241
When Built 1998 - 1988
Layout Front engine / rear-wheel-drive
Body Style Saloon
Engine -
Engine Configuration 4941cc / V8 / Twin overhead camshaft per head
Power (hp/rpm) 400/6600
Torque (lb ft/rpm) 369/3800
Transmission 6-spd/-
Front Suspension Independent Coil springs
Rear Suspension Independent Coil springs
Steering Rack and pinion
Brakes Disc/disc
Tyres (in or mm/%) - wheels (in) 245/40-18/ 275/35-18
Length (in) 188
Weight (lb) 3872
Top speed (mph) 161
0-60 mph (sec) 5.3
Standing ¼ml (sec) 14.1
UK price (£) 59590
LMAO... how did I know this spec would appear after I said "M5" :laff:
3872lb ~ 1760Kg ~ 227bhp/tonne-M5
2462lb ~ 1119Kg ~ 250bhp/tonne-IHI 280bhp Ibiza
:D
Originally posted by ibizacupra
LMAO... how did I know this spec would appear after I said "M5" :laff:
3872lb ~ 1760Kg ~ 227bhp/tonne-M5
2462lb ~ 1119Kg ~ 250bhp/tonne-IHI 280bhp Ibiza
:D
The first thing Jools asked me was how fast is an M5. Well here is was the answer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.:D
Originally posted by Madmile
What do you mean Sim :p ;) .
How much do you want for the K04-23 exhaust manifold? :) Dealership quoted ~180GBP.
Originally posted by gillm
so that aims at the stage 2 kit then bill :) plus the controller . thats my plan anyway . wanna join the tsr of the clock club , felt left of on sat :jog:
the stage 2 kit + bits is only £160 less than a stage 3 at 350 bhp + bits. If you take stage 2 and go back for more later it will cost you a lot more. The stage 3 kit has more stuff included with the price.
Do take Bill's point though but for £160 extra when spending about £3,000 you may as well go the whole hog and keep the boost controller low depending on weather, track days etc.
ibizacupra
19-11-2003, 18:44
Originally posted by Jonah
the stage 2 kit + bits is only £160 less than a stage 3 at 350 bhp + bits. If you take stage 2 and go back for more later it will cost you a lot more. The stage 3 kit has more stuff included with the price.
Do take Bill's point though but for £160 extra when spending about £3,000 you may as well go the whole hog and keep the boost controller low depending on weather, track days etc.
I don't see how an Ibiza will get 350bhp without dropping the CR... It just aint going to happen.
325bhp from stage 2 if thats whats called stage 2 is the non internal mods level. More power takes more boost, and more intercooling etc.... and the CR drop is going to be req'd from there on in.
The drop in CR worked well for boost toleration on both Jabba's and my car.
Bill
CustardCupra
19-11-2003, 18:45
Cheers Bill for the info but nothing has been made clearer.
Madmile phoned Jabba who said even stage 1 will need their Race cat ...so bye bye Milltek .This was one of my main reasons for stage 1 as milltek Cat cost me £450 not too long ago ,
This puts me £££ wise into stage 2 ,but if i get stage 2 with race cat and boost controller i'm spending similar money as stage 3.
But stage 3 isn't available now unless you get a Chargecooler , Lower compression , Quaife , lsd and Oh! new gearbox.
So i think i will pay for stage 3 and have Jabba detune it to 325 bhp (Stock intercooler )and low boost 90% @ 250 bhp .
Jonah m8 £3K won't buy stage 2
Stage 3 is more like £4k all in
im going stage 2 as it is safier imho not that i can realy say . but it's just what i have heard . plus going for the controller so i can turn it down when the misses drives it "shush don't tell her " and in the crap weather we have it might be handy to lose some power . also i think it is a good leavel to go in at cos you have the manifold . for going further you would need this . if i win the lotto i would go stage 3 on a diffrent engine and box , but as that will not happen im sure this is more then enougth and hopefully hastle free . but only time will tell :)
When i spoke to Jabba stage 2 was 300-310bhp not 310+bhp. I am sure more will become clearer the sooner to the kits being supplied and fitted. When Jabba offer these kit do you think they will air on the side of caution when it comes to offered bhp (stage 2 300bhp was mentioned to me) and a lower rev limit. Jabba's car i hear has a 8000rpm limit customers may only be offered 7300rpm to 7400rpm. I say MAY all this is mainly speculation on my behalf. Time will tell i am sure!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.:cheers:
Originally posted by ibizacupra
I don't see how an Ibiza will get 350bhp without dropping the CR... It just aint going to happen.
325bhp from stage 2 if thats whats called stage 2 is the non internal mods level. More power takes more boost, and more intercooling etc.... and the CR drop is going to be req'd from there on in.
The drop in CR worked well for boost toleration on both Jabba's and my car.
Bill
See this confuses me Bill. I respect both you and Jabbasport as knowing what you are talking about... yet you say the CR drop is required (Which makes sense) yet theres no mention of it on Jabbas website and the stage 3 kit states 350bhp!
But stage 3 isn't available now unless you get a Chargecooler , Lower compression , Quaife , lsd and Oh! new gearbox.
Is this a fact? Have Jabba actually said this? Did they actually say you need a new gearbox?
Thanks for the info.
Cheers
Ben
Dormouse
19-11-2003, 19:57
Originally posted by BenS1
Is this a fact? Have Jabba actually said this? Did they actually say you need a new gearbox?
You KNOW you will need a new GB eventually so why ask if Jabba have mentioned it? It's not beyond the realms of thought to figure that much torque is beyond the design spec of the O2J.
Dor.
I think they will want you to have the CC before they give you max power. I would not exspect them to make you have a new G-box. I agree with Bill i cant see them giving you 350bhp on stg3. At a guess and i may be wrong, so dont shoot me when i am proven to be, but i reckon stg3 330bhp, stg2, 300bhp, stg1 270bhp + or - 10bhp on eack kit either way. But i reckon above figures, anyone else wanna stick there neck out with a guess.:cheers:
Originally posted by Dormouse
You KNOW you will need a new GB eventually so why ask if Jabba have mentioned it? It's not beyond the realms of thought to figure that much torque is beyond the design spec of the O2J.
Dor.
I agree M8. Order your new GB now!!!! LOL.
Originally posted by Dormouse
You KNOW you will need a new GB eventually so why ask if Jabba have mentioned it? It's not beyond the realms of thought to figure that much torque is beyond the design spec of the O2J.
Dor.
Well the stage 3 kit only runs 290lb/ft of torque, and Jabba told me that its perfectly safe at this level (Especially with my Quaife)... Bill had an extra 30lb/ft which proved to take it over the edge (But it still took 2 months). I'm hoping that the 30lb/ft margin will keep the gearbox reliable... also I'll wont run max power most of the time.
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by Madmile
I think they will want you to have the CC before they give you max power. I would not exspect them to make you have a new G-box. I agree with Bill i cant see them giving you 350bhp on stg3. At a guess and i may be wrong, so dont shoot me when i am proven to be, but i reckon stg3 330bhp, stg2, 300bhp, stg1 270bhp + or - 10bhp on eack kit either way. But i reckon above figures, anyone else wanna stick there neck out with a guess.:cheers:
But Jabba CLEARLY state the power figures on their website. If I pay out for Stage 3 and only get stage 2 performance I will go mental!!! They HAVE to delivery what they promise.... you wouldn't goto McDs and order a Big Mac, pay for a Big Mac but then accept a Cheeseburger would you?
I think we are speculating too much here... I think we'll only know for sure when we get that special phone call and start to talk about dates, prices and specs. :)
Cheers
Ben
I heard the g-box was good for 270lbs ft but i may be wrong!!!!
Originally posted by BenS1
But Jabba CLEARLY state the power figures on their website. If I pay out for Stage 3 and only get stage 2 performance I will go mental!!! They HAVE to delivery what they promise.... you wouldn't goto McDs and order a Big Mac, pay for a Big Mac but then accept a Cheeseburger would you?
I think we are speculating too much here... I think we'll only know for sure when we get that special phone call and start to talk about dates, prices and specs. :)
Cheers
Ben
The person with the most amount of info at the moment is Bill, he is the most accessable person to put questions to. He runs the car. I am far more relaxed about the whole situation now, i will get the power one way or another via Jabba or another company, more options come to light the longer Jabba take which can only help me make the best decission on how to get the power and the amount to spend, and the quality of kit. I think the Mrs has slipped me some calms in my drinking chocolate. ;) :)
Originally posted by BenS1
See this confuses me Bill. I respect both you and Jabbasport as knowing what you are talking about... yet you say the CR drop is required (Which makes sense) yet theres no mention of it on Jabbas website and the stage 3 kit states 350bhp!
Cheers
Ben
I wouldn't take anything on the Jabba site as a given. The specifications of the kits are still evolving as limitations/problems are discovered. Forget about Stages and power levels, look at Bill's car, what's been done to it to get where it is and use that as the yardstick.
Take a step back guys and let them finish the development as all we end up with at the moment is rumour and counter-rumour.
One thing is clear though, the IHI is not the cost-effective alternative to a K0-4 as was first mooted. As I suspected, BIG power does cost BIG money, even for turbo cars. For the amount that an IHI looks like costing, you could swap your Ibiza for a REVO/Jabba mapped LCR and have the extra margin (225 engine) should you need to go above 280bhp at a later stage.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Glenn
[B]I wouldn't take anything on the Jabba site as a given. The specifications of the kits are still evolving as limitations/problems are discovered.
Do you have inside info!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
ibizacupra
19-11-2003, 20:54
Originally posted by BenS1
But Jabba CLEARLY state the power figures on their website. If I pay out for Stage 3 and only get stage 2 performance I will go mental!!! They HAVE to delivery what they promise.... you wouldn't goto McDs and order a Big Mac, pay for a Big Mac but then accept a Cheeseburger would you?
I think we are speculating too much here... I think we'll only know for sure when we get that special phone call and start to talk about dates, prices and specs. :)
Cheers
Ben
Ben. Does the IHI Jabba speil mention engine specific? ie small port engines being different to large port engines?
I can't remember seeing any reference to it (may have overlooked it)... but this is an important point. Large Port early Golf for example can achieve higher top end power figures than small port. Our Ibiza engines run small port motors... and this takes more boost, which leave CR being a bit touch and go as to being 'customer' safe.
Jabba's AQX early Ibiza was much happier with more advanced ignition and higher boost than mine (pre CR drop) As a consequence mine was running much closer to the reliable limit than theirs was... and struggled to get near 340bhp. Detonation was a problem at one point and the mapping was reduced on mine compared to theirs. Mine would'nt take the same ignition for example. After Bruntingthorpe and the problems on the fuel pumps the engines were rebuilt with lower CR, which made one heck of a difference.. boost nor ignition have been any issue since, and mine has run 27psi boost briefly... with no Det !
I have asked Jabba to confirm and clarify some points... and offered to be an interface for them here... knowing how damned busy they are.
What I can say is 325bhp from 1 bar is still a really quick little car, believe me... :D
Originally posted by Madmile
I heard the g-box was good for 270lbs ft but i may be wrong!!!!
Yep, correct. The info is here (At the bottom):
http://www.jabbasport.com/tech.html
However it also says that the gearbox is good for 320lb/ft with a Quaife ATB diff, which I have (Being fitted in Decemeber).
Jonah m8 £3K won't buy stage 2
Stage 3 is more like £4k all in
Missed this first time round.
One of us needs to brush up on their maths (Could be me)... I worked it out at work earlier today and the price for the Stage 3 comes to £5200 all in! And thats without any compression ratio mods etc.
Also when you consider that I'm getting the Quaife ATB and Clutch/flywheel upgrade costing about £2000 on top this is all looking a bit pricey. :( Still going for it though. :D
Add on all the other mods I've already done and I think I've spent more on mods than the car actually cost from new!!! :o
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
19-11-2003, 21:01
Originally posted by Glenn
I wouldn't take anything on the Jabba site as a given. The specifications of the kits are still evolving as limitations/problems are discovered. Forget about Stages and power levels, look at Bill's car, what's been done to it to get where it is and use that as the yardstick.
The only thing a 225 motor has is lower CR... but sadly smaller wrist pins... and spindlier rods. Not an ideal match for higher boost if that was wanted.
My Ibiza is well catalogued in its development, and is as said by Glenn a yard stick... Ask why a regular Ibiza would produce 350bhp from just the kit, when mine and Jabba's needed a lower CR to comfortably achieve this. I have read the link you posted Ben and it does say those figures... to 350bhp.... but I would add the word 'up' before that personally. up to 350....
I will speak with Jabba tomorrow and either they or I will post something up here to confirm the 'how it is' word. We don't want any confusion or upsets if people are thinking they're goign to get something they might not actually get.. (does that make sense? I'm tired... :confused: )
The Ibiza kist will benefit from a refined intercooler system more than likely (PACE CC in OE position - nice :) ) and a productionised turbo outlet pipe and downpipe shortly.
regards
bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Ben. Does the IHI Jabba speil mention engine specific? ie small port engines being different to large port engines?
I can't remember seeing any reference to it (may have overlooked it)... but this is an important point. Large Port early Golf for example can achieve higher top end power figures than small port. Our Ibiza engines run small port motors... and this takes more boost, which leave CR being a bit touch and go as to being 'customer' safe.
Jabba's AQX early Ibiza was much happier with more advanced ignition and higher boost than mine (pre CR drop) As a consequence mine was running much closer to the reliable limit than theirs was... and struggled to get near 340bhp. Detonation was a problem at one point and the mapping was reduced on mine compared to theirs. Mine would'nt take the same ignition for example. After Bruntingthorpe and the problems on the fuel pumps the engines were rebuilt with lower CR, which made one heck of a difference.. boost nor ignition have been any issue since, and mine has run 27psi boost briefly... with no Det !
I have asked Jabba to confirm and clarify some points... and offered to be an interface for them here... knowing how damned busy they are.
What I can say is 325bhp from 1 bar is still a really quick little car, believe me... :D
No I don't think it mentions the difference between small port and large port engines.
Out of interest, how do you measure detonation? ie. how did you know there was no detonation at 27psi? Just by listening?
Thanks for being our interface to Jabba... much appreciated. I would owe you a pint, but you don't drink, so I'll drink it on your behalf! :D
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
19-11-2003, 21:12
Originally posted by BenS1
No I don't think it mentions the difference between small port and large port engines.
Out of interest, how do you measure detonation? ie. how did you know there was no detonation at 27psi? Just by listening?
Thanks for being our interface to Jabba... much appreciated. I would owe you a pint, but you don't drink, so I'll drink it on your behalf! :D
Cheers
Ben
A giant coke and big mac will do... erm.. scratch the big mac I'm supposed to trying to loose weight.
Diet Coke? :D :p
The det was listening yea... I previously had huge det.... and you could hear that big time.. (before CR drop and Jabba's Ibiza map in mine.. did'nt work at all in mine such are the 20VT AQX/AYP differences perhaps or build tolerances... who knows.) Knock (det) can also be logged with vag-com also... for info.
Masive 3rd gear wheel spin in the bone dry on power application @27psi.... We feared for the rods running that boost. :eak:
Needless to say it did'nt stay set that high.. LOL
regards
bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
A giant coke and big mac will do... erm.. scratch the big mac I'm supposed to trying to loose weight.
Diet Coke? :D :p
The det was listening yea... I previously had huge det.... and you could hear that big time.. (before CR drop and Jabba's Ibiza map in mine.. did'nt work at all in mine such are the 20VT AQX/AYP differences perhaps or build tolerances... who knows.) Knock (det) can also be logged with vag-com also... for info.
Masive 3rd gear wheel spin in the bone dry on power application @27psi.... We feared for the rods running that boost. :eak:
Needless to say it did'nt stay set that high.. LOL
regards
bill
If you can't have more power then your trying to loose weight... anything to improve your power to weight ratio! ;)
I WAS going to get the uprated rods and pistons (That gives even lower CR), but at £1600 + fitting I decided that it can wait. Out of interest, what sort of power do you think you were running at 27psi? More than the Golf on full 400+bhp boost? How did the Golfs rods handle that power?
Cheers
Ben
PS. What exactly is wrong with the Golf ATM? Or would you prefer not to say?
Originally posted by CustardCupra
Jonah m8 £3K won't buy stage 2
Stage 3 is more like £4k all in
agreed but like I say the diff between stage 2 and stage 3 with all the exhaust, boost controller etc is still only about £160.
ibizacupra
20-11-2003, 09:28
Originally posted by BenS1
If you can't have more power then your trying to loose weight... anything to improve your power to weight ratio! ;)
I WAS going to get the uprated rods and pistons (That gives even lower CR), but at £1600 + fitting I decided that it can wait. Out of interest, what sort of power do you think you were running at 27psi? More than the Golf on full 400+bhp boost? How did the Golfs rods handle that power?
Cheers
Ben
PS. What exactly is wrong with the Golf ATM? Or would you prefer not to say?
Golfy has steel rods already.. and runs less boost than ibiza.. :p
1.35bar on MKIV, 1.5bar on beezer
When Golfy returns it will have lower CR and will run 1.5bar all the time :D 400bhp zone then.
Ibiza was mad @ 27psi.... tear front off car mental... torque was huge, more than bhp wouldl have been. Small port cyl head remember.
bill
Jonah m8 £3K won't buy stage 2
Stage 3 is more like £4k all in
Right, heres an attempt to list the prices for the Stage 3 upgrade:
THe following parts are pre-requisites and most people will of done this already:
Suspension upgrade - eg. £1000 (Bilstein PSS9 kit)
Brake Upgrade - £450 (eg. Brembo upgrade)
The following is the MINIMUM you need for stage 3:
Turbo Kit - £2890
Fitting - £400
Remap - £475
Exhaust - £276
Boost Controller - £115 (Plus fitting)
Cat - £345 (I thought this was included in the kit, but its still listed as an extra?)
Chargecooler - £700 (ALthough I think it will cost a lot more)
Total = £5201
(Note: Some people may already have some bits such as 2.5" exhausts already)
In additiont o above you need to source an uprated clutch:
Uprated Clutch - £350 (Uprated CLutch and lightened Flywheel)
Optional extras:
Quaife Diff: £1200 fitted
Uprated Rods and Pistons (Includes lower CR): £1600 + a lot of fitting
Machining standard pistons for lower CR: £???
So, thats £5201 plus a clutch as a minimum really (£5551).
Or with all the options thats £8351 plus fitting for rods/pistons.
If starting from a stock car then with the brakes and suspension thats upto around £9801!!!! Now thats scarey!
Cheers
Ben
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Golfy has steel rods already.. and runs less boost than ibiza.. :p
1.35bar on MKIV, 1.5bar on beezer
When Golfy returns it will have lower CR and will run 1.5bar all the time :D 400bhp zone then.
Ibiza was mad @ 27psi.... tear front off car mental... torque was huge, more than bhp wouldl have been. Small port cyl head remember.
bill
How does the Golf produce more power than the Ibiza with less boost? Higher rev limit and larger port?
Cheers
Ben
monkeynuts
20-11-2003, 12:05
I can tellyou that i drove their dark blue cupra and it was seriously f ing quick 350ish i think.If i had one 270 seems more useable on the road for day to day useage,trouble is i didnt think the misses would approve!:D :D :D
Dormouse
20-11-2003, 12:30
Originally posted by steve jackman
I can tellyou that i drove their dark blue cupra and it was seriously f ing quick 350ish i think.If i had one 270 seems more useable on the road for day to day useage,trouble is i didnt think the misses would approve!:D :D :D
LOL.
270 only useable when you remove the masses of traffic in your way :D
Dor.
hopkinsgm
20-11-2003, 12:51
Bigger port means same volume will generate less pressure. Pressure = force per unit area... Pressure has a way of equalising itself within a given volume where flow is possible.
We've discussed this before with respect to how come the IHI runs low(ish) pressure boost but generates lots more power than K03's. Remember all those folks with big boost maps using K03's, running higher boost pressures than Jabba's IHI but developing significantly less power. Why? Because the turbo outlet of the K03 is smaller, meaning that the same pressure equates to less flow. Or to get the same flow, the pressure must be significantly higher - same situation, just turned on its' head... (With the K03, there's also the matter of being to sustain boost pressure as flowrates increase, but that's another matter entirely...)
Bigger port = more volume. Smaller port = less volume. Trying to fit the same amount of gas/vapour into less volume means applying a force to it - this is what a turbo is doing in the first place, remember - forcing more air into the engine so you can push more fuel in and still have it burn efficiently. Being of a compressible nature, this means it'll get compressed. Which develops more heat. Which isn't a good state of affairs...
Just like to point out that i'm not stating the above as how it works. It's all just theorising on my part. I'm no turbo expert. I've never owned a turbo car. I've never dabbled in turbo tuning (apart from hooking up a crude blower system on a mates' mom's car "just to see" in my teens). It does all seem to fit in with some stuff I learnt some years ago studying GCSE level physics, though...
Ben fitting from £400 so it could cost more the higher up the spec range you go.:cheers:
CustardCupra
20-11-2003, 16:02
Originally posted by BenS1
Is this a fact? Have Jabba actually said this? Did they actually say you need a new gearbox?
Thanks for the info.
Cheers
Ben
Jabba did not say this BEN , this is my own personal point of view .
If stage 3 is to be had i don't think it will be achieved without the mods i have stated.
Which in my opinion is poor marketing by Jabbasport.
All their stages and prices should reflect the complete price for a complete kit never mind ...
OPTIONAL EXTRAS .
Classic example is stage 1,
no mention of race cat being required in the price only as an EXTRA but you can't have stage 1 without it,
so it should be included in the kit and priced accordingly .
CustardCupra
20-11-2003, 16:11
Originally posted by BenS1
Yep, correct. The info is here (At the bottom):
http://www.jabbasport.com/tech.html
However it also says that the gearbox is good for 320lb/ft with a Quaife ATB diff, which I have (Being fitted in Decemeber).
Missed this first time round.
One of us needs to brush up on their maths (Could be me)... I worked it out at work earlier today and the price for the Stage 3 comes to £5200 all in!
Cheers
Ben
I didn't allow for the OPTIONAL EXTRAS.
hopkinsgm
20-11-2003, 16:19
Perhaps the problem is that Jabba are a victim of their own success - they start developing an upgrade that quite a few folks get wind of long before it is ready for release to the general public and so in an effort to actually spend some time completing development rather than answering phones all day, they stick some info up on their website. As development progresses, limitations come to light. Folks start wanting the upgrades and phoning asking "when, when" etc. meaning that they don't have time to either finish development or update the info on their website which may now be inaccurate. It's always a dicey business publishing info on a product which isn't fully developed as things inevitably change. That's what development is all about. Unfortunately, it's very much a balancing act between doing your R&D and keeping the published info up to date.
i spoke with mike today as i wanted to know something . there is alot of talk on here iand i wanted to clear something up .
when the kit is fitted they will NOT charge for a inspection , they will only charge for the fitment of injectors (can't drive the car up there with the new ones in)boost controller (as im not too sure on the fitment of it )and ofcourse the re-map . mike also said to wait for the exhuast and cat as it will be cheaper then going for the miltek and more suited to the ihi . also the kit does not come with a filter (invo is a extra) which is fine as it is not stated on the list . he will try and get a heat sheild made for me which is nice :)(i did try making on today at work but we have had a audit and it is soo hard to get anything out of our stores :( ) .
and he told me about the fuel pump , that i already knew about , he also said when i pick the kit up that he would explain on fitting the pump as it's a nightmare .
:devil:
i must say i found them very helpful , there are alot of companys out there that won't help , and just say "book it in" the kit should be ready in 3 weeks .
so mike and the others :cheers:
Originally posted by BenS1
The following is the MINIMUM you need for stage 3:
Turbo Kit - £2890
Fitting - £400
Remap - £475
Exhaust - £276
Boost Controller - £115 (Plus fitting)
Cat - £345 (I thought this was included in the kit, but its still listed as an extra?)
Chargecooler - £700 (ALthough I think it will cost a lot more)
Total = £5201
Despite the Cat listed as options it defo is part of the package as is the boost controller with fitting - so around £4,800 all in. Even though I have a Leon with more weight I think i'll stick to stage 1 or 2 at a push. Stage 3 with the chargecooler or uprated IC is just too much readies for me. (put the saved dosh towards quaife ATB perhaps?)
Originally posted by steve jackman
I can tellyou that i drove their dark blue cupra and it was seriously f ing quick 350ish i think.If i had one 270 seems more useable on the road for day to day useage,trouble is i didnt think the misses would approve!:D :D :D
cant beleive u thinkin about her !!!!! its all about boys n their toys .. missusses dont figure !!!!!
ibizacupra
20-11-2003, 20:36
Originally posted by BenS1
How does the Golf produce more power than the Ibiza with less boost? Higher rev limit and larger port?
Cheers
Ben
yes... and huge turbo helps :D
Originally posted by gillm
i spoke with mike today as i wanted to know something . there is alot of talk on here iand i wanted to clear something up .
when the kit is fitted they will NOT charge for a inspection , they will only charge for the fitment of injectors (can't drive the car up there with the new ones in)boost controller (as im not too sure on the fitment of it )and ofcourse the re-map . mike also said to wait for the exhuast and cat as it will be cheaper then going for the miltek and more suited to the ihi . also the kit does not come with a filter (invo is a extra) which is fine as it is not stated on the list . he will try and get a heat sheild made for me which is nice :)(i did try making on today at work but we have had a audit and it is soo hard to get anything out of our stores :( ) .
and he told me about the fuel pump , that i already knew about , he also said when i pick the kit up that he would explain on fitting the pump as it's a nightmare .
:devil:
i must say i found them very helpful , there are alot of companys out there that won't help , and just say "book it in" the kit should be ready in 3 weeks .
so mike and the others :cheers:
They said 3 weeks? Cool.... need to get me a chocolate advent calendar and in the number 25 will be a nice shiney turbo upgrade! :D The only trouble is that my car is at AutoTechniks on Dec 15th for 1 week having the Quaife and clutch upgrade done!
Jonah, glad to hear those bits are already included. Have you had this confirmed by Jabba?
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
20-11-2003, 20:40
Originally posted by hopkinsgm
Perhaps the problem is that Jabba are a victim of their own success - they start developing an upgrade that quite a few folks get wind of long before it is ready for release to the general public and so in an effort to actually spend some time completing development rather than answering phones all day, they stick some info up on their website. As development progresses, limitations come to light. Folks start wanting the upgrades and phoning asking "when, when" etc. meaning that they don't have time to either finish development or update the info on their website which may now be inaccurate. It's always a dicey business publishing info on a product which isn't fully developed as things inevitably change. That's what development is all about. Unfortunately, it's very much a balancing act between doing your R&D and keeping the published info up to date.
BING! WE have a Winner !
CustardCupra
21-11-2003, 17:17
Originally posted by ibizacupra
BING! WE have a Winner !
Totally agree but lets not lose sight that this kit has been in development now for 3-4 years and Jabba posted it up on there site with pressure from no one .
I would like to see this kit 100 % tested and tried before its put on sale to the public same as everyone else .
The annoying thing for me was being told back in June the kits were ready and my car would be done for OCTOBER.
I have not been camped out on the phone every week pestering them and am willing to wait as long as it takes .
My issues have been over the confusion of STAGES /BHP and £££
Rant over :p
Bring it on JABBASPORT :D
Originally posted by BenS1
Jonah, glad to hear those bits are already included. Have you had this confirmed by Jabba?
Yeah Elton confirmed it a few months ago so unless it's changed since then - strange they never mentioned about upgrade to IC when I originally went on the list for the stage 3 - did when I called them yesterday.
It's really diffcult to decide what to do here. Stage 1 at worst will be 270bhp. Stage 2 at best will be 310bhp. Therefore I would pay the extra wedge. BUT like someone else has said on here you are in danger of forking out about £600 more (if you include all the bits with both kits)for potentially only 20bhp more if you only get 300bhp in stage 2 but could have got 280bhp with stage 1 which just isn't worth it. WHAT THE HELL TO DO!!!!!!!!!1
after the phone call yesterday , i think i will go stage 3 as i want stage 2 with boost controller + cat . but i will ask to have the mapping brought down a bit to keep it safer . this way i have all the bits for latter in the cars life . say re-map to around 320 bhp . then when i have saved some more i might lower the compresion ratio , and a few other bits . :)
ibizacupra
21-11-2003, 17:51
Originally posted by CustardCupra
......... and Jabba posted it up on there site with pressure from no one .
Well it was quite the reverse in reailty...
Lots of pressure by phone calls from many people...
The website relaunch included the 1st officially released information on the kits, but this is'nt definative or all encompasing...
Its getting there... and clarification will come in due course. Best for everyone involved then.
Bill
ibizacupra
21-11-2003, 18:00
Originally posted by gillm
after the phone call yesterday , i think i will go stage 3 as i want stage 2 with boost controller + cat . but i will ask to have the mapping brought down a bit to keep it safer . this way i have all the bits for latter in the cars life . say re-map to around 320 bhp . then when i have saved some more i might lower the compresion ratio , and a few other bits . :)
Remember guys... Mine was 325bhp out of the box... and was Awesome... just a nads over 1 bar boost, with 325bhp, 280lb/ft on an otherwise totally stock motor, even with stock IC then also. Ok it got hot quick on Dyno's, but I never really noticed any real loss of power on the road. There is so much... :D Who can really tell they loose 20bhp in 300bhp? :p
Things which have developed further since then, have been dealing with reliable fueling... and that was injector and fuel pump spec change. Further productionising includes their new exhaust and downpipe system, which no doubt will be pretty cool too :) (not seen it yet myself)
Add ons like FMIC, CC etc... are all nice to have's, but mine did'nt have them from day one... and they were'nt mandatory, but advised..
Want more than this and want to do track days? Consider more boost will mean more intercooling req'd, be it CC or FMIC. Want more boost again, and a lower CR certainly helps increase the margin.
Believe me when I say 325bhp is plenty in an Ibiza... pulls like the proverbial from 2800rpm to over 7K... Smile from ear to ear.
It will definately be worth the wait..
Specs need confirming for sure. This is'nt being ignored, and clairification will follow.
Enjoy your motors... :)
regards
Bill
Originally posted by ibizacupra
Well it was quite the reverse in reailty...
Lots of pressure by phone calls from many people...
The website relaunch included the 1st officially released information on the kits, but this is'nt definative or all encompasing...
Its getting there... and clarification will come in due course. Best for everyone involved then.
Bill
Actually Bill i hate to disagree but the first official info I got was at the Powerstation RR day you organised a LONG time ago. Mike was talking about the kits and was giving out sales sheets with very specific kit details including the prices for stages 1 (280bhp) all the way upto 475bhp kits, and even said that if you wanted more (Upto 550bhp) then to give them a call.
I still have the sales sheet, and to be honest it has more detail on it that I've seen anywhere else since!
I phoned them up about a week later and put my name on the list, and we were talking about getting it fitted before GTI inters (2002)!!! At the time I asked if i was the first person on the list and they said yes.... but that was so long ago i think they lost my name because I've had to re-add myself to the list. :(
I'm not complaining though.... I didn't have the money back then anyway, and now I know the kit has had lots of testing.
Can't wait for the call! :D
Cheers
Ben
ibizacupra
22-11-2003, 13:19
Originally posted by BenS1
Actually Bill i hate to disagree but the first official info I got was at the Powerstation RR day you organised a LONG time ago. Mike was talking about the kits and was giving out sales sheets with very specific kit details including the prices for stages 1 (280bhp) all the way upto 475bhp kits, and even said that if you wanted more (Upto 550bhp) then to give them a call.
I still have the sales sheet, and to be honest it has more detail on it that I've seen anywhere else since!
I phoned them up about a week later and put my name on the list, and we were talking about getting it fitted before GTI inters (2002)!!! At the time I asked if i was the first person on the list and they said yes.... but that was so long ago i think they lost my name because I've had to re-add myself to the list. :(
I'm not complaining though.... I didn't have the money back then anyway, and now I know the kit has had lots of testing.
Can't wait for the call! :D
Cheers
Ben
Remembering back at the Power Station day they had not done any Ibiza, including their own... Speculative info back then... and lots of kit evolution has gone on since then. As for detail.. on that sheet, I wonder how close the components match todays offering. :)
The website update was to try and answer the repetative questions they received by phone... I think it made interest higher, and made them even busier tho.. LOL