LCR wishbone rebushing guide

[Ronin225]

This is a rough guide on how i rebushed mine and few other LCR wishbones
CAUTION- You will need fairly heavy duty tools for some parts of this and i take no responsibility for anyone breaking stuff or hurting themselves whilst following it.
Here are the part numbers and prices of all OE bits for all variants courtesy of sere motors

LCR wishbone inc bushes - left 1ML407151 £115
LCR wishbone inc bushes - right 1ML407152 £115
LCR front arm front bush 1ML407182 £9.50
LCR front arm rear bush 8N0407181B £15.65
LCR Balljoint (left and right) 8N0407365C £30.25
LCR balljoint nuts (3 each) N10332001 50p each
Wishbone front mounting bolt N90484004 95p
Wishbone rear mounting bolt N10262202 £1.30
Wishbone rear mounting nut N0150816 60p each
LCR top mount 1ML412331 £22.55
LCR top bearing 1J0412249 £5.40
LCR top threaded bush 1H0412365A £1.75
LCR top nut N90353604 65p

Standard wishbone inc bushes - left and right 1J0407151C £50.40
Standard front arm front bush 357407182 £7.80
Standard front arm rear bush 1J0407181 £9.75
Standard balljoint - left 1J0407365H £21.30
Standard balljoint - right 1J0407366H £21.30
Standard balljoint plate 1J0407175 £5
Standard balljoint bolts (3 each) N10127707 50p each
Wishbone front mounting bolt N90484004 95p
Wishbone rear mounting bolt N10262202 £1.30
Wishbone rear mounting nut N0150816 60p each
Standard top mount 1J0412331C £9.45
Standard top bearing 1J0412249 £5.40
Standard top threaded bush 1H0412365A £1.75
Standard top nut N90353604 65p

All powerflex uprated part numbers
Front Wishbone Front Bush, Cast Arm (LCR), 45mm OD PFF3-501
Front Wishbone Front Bush, Pressed Arm, 30mm OD PFF85-201
Front Wishbone Rear Bush, Cast Arm (LCR) PFF3-610
Front Wishbone Rear Bush, Pressed Arm PFF85-410
Front Wishbone Rear Bush (Race Use) PFF85-414


I decided to get some donor wishbones and rebush them so i didnt have to waste time trying to do this with the car jacked up and waiting
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/08042010018.jpg
These were actually off an S3 but same front subframe setup
Part Nos
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/08042010019.jpg
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/08042010020.jpg
I then gave them a good wire brushing down to remove all the crap and rust, etc. from them
I opted to rebush my set with powerflex bushes (took a while to get after the fire though)
Here are the pics of the new ones to replace the old
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/08042010021.jpg
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/08042010024.jpg
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/08042010023.jpg
This rear bush actually split down the middle so quite easy to refit once removed

[james walker]

take it theres more???

[Ronin225]

The most difficult part of the rebushing is the removal, the rears especially so here is how i removed them
This was my setup in work vice, piece of solid bar, a 2" pipe connector and brute force
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010024.jpg
Here is the size of the fitting for anyone needing rough dimensions
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/13042010031.jpg
Keep tighten the vice more then backing off to break the rubber, be careful it is straight or it might ping out and a pretty hefty vice is a must.
After a while this should happen
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010025.jpg
You can then easily pull it out
Then get a hacksaw and remove the blade and feed it through the new hole in bush to allow cutting of the casing
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010026.jpg

[Ronin225]

Afetr cutting through the casing get a suitable screwdriver preferably pound through and punch the casing out on the split
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010027.jpg
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010028.jpg
Try not to cut into the actual wishbone though, you shoulf feel the difference as the wishbone is steel and the casing aluminium
A quick clean of the inner bore to remove rust and debris with some scotch bright
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010029.jpg
The new bush can then be lubed up with supplied sachet and pushed in by hand from either side then clamped in vice to send it fully home.
These are the most difficult to remove
The front bushes can be removed the same way but if using poly for the front a hydraulic press is needed really hence no photos as they really take some pusshing in, i did mine at work
A garage/ engineering company can push these in very easily as access is plentiful on this end.
When finished should look something like this
http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx265/Ronin225/wishbone%20rebushing/09042010030.jpg
All now ready to go on the car

[wayne lcr]

how do you rate the polys do you get any vibration or oat with them?

[Slimy]

I didn't use a vice to replace mine, although the metal tubing was used in a similar way. I actually used a threaded rod through the middle, several washers and bits of metal with two nuts either end, then a nice big wrench to wind it in until it popped like you show in one of the middle pictures.

As for the larger ones, I just pounded away at the metal casing until it deformed and fell out, no bother there. I also didn't need a hydraulic press to fit the new bushes, although they are squirmy barstewards! Again, a bit of threaded rod, with some large plates of metal and two more nuts, and the whole thing just needed a couple of spanners and a LOT of patience! It took at least a dozen attempts before they stayed square and got pushed in sufficiently for the lip to 'pop' on the far side.

[Ronin225]

The poly bushes were fitted at the same time as the coilovers so difficult to know exactly how much difference they made but having rebushed a set with OE the poly much firmer.
To push new OE bushes ina hydraulic press is not really required but the poly ones are very stiff and i think you will really struggle as they are so tight. It wasnt that easy even with the press

[GREY 225]

Tightens up front end nicely, also stops tyres wearing unevenly on inside edge once tracking set correctly, i didnt notice much more vibration with bushes when i fitted mine after the coilovers.

[Mark300zx]

So how are the tyres after this is done, are the old bushes the cause of inner tyre wear due to all the adjustment being taken up?

[GREY 225]

So how are the tyres after this is done, are the old bushes the cause of inner tyre wear due to all the adjustment being taken up?

First set of ps2 tyres wore on inside edge, but still had plenty tread on rest of tyre, second set of ps2, which im just about to change now have done 5000 miles more than 1st set with bushes fitted.
It might be the coilovers & bushes together that are the cause of even tyre wear, but i think the bushes are the most contributing factor by keeping the wishbone soild and and in line.

[Slimy]

To push new OE bushes ina hydraulic press is not really required but the poly ones are very stiff and i think you will really struggle as they are so tight. It wasnt that easy even with the press

It was poly bushes that I fitted (Powerflex) and I totally agree they were a struggle! :) I did find it funny the instructions actually said they can be fitted by hand, like bo**cks can they!! The two part ones yes, but not the larger ones!

[Ronin225]

Forgot to add that after fitting a 4 wheel alignment should be done and the camber can be adjusted on the slots for the balljoints
I am currently running 1 degree of negative camber per side(OE is is roughly 0.3 to 0.5 or something), this will make the tyres wear on the inside a little faster but should aid turn in and handling

[hara]

great guide, fancy doing one for rebushing the rear or rebushing the ARB? :)

[Slimy]

There is a decent guide for the rear bushes in the Toledo section;

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=83511

[Mark300zx]

So the LCR and S3 share the same wishbone, what about the LC and the TT anyone know?

[wayne lcr]

lc are total diff to audi and lcr mate

[Slimy]

So the LCR and S3 share the same wishbone, what about the LC and the TT anyone know?

I believe the method of installation is the same, but the bushes themselves are a different size. You can see the different part numbers if you go to the powerflex website and look at their fitting guide. I believe the large bush is a different size.

[Mark300zx]

So just to confirm the the LCR, S3 and audi TT 225 all share the same wishbone?

[wayne lcr]

yes mate thats correct

[Ronin225]

LCR, TT, S3 all have cast wishbones requiring the larger front bush
LC has smaller pressed wishbones with a smaller front bush

[Seat Gooner]

Nice guide Ronin i was waiting for this :D thank you

Couple of questions you know the bottom ball joint is this worth replacing and if so what with oem??

And last question are the polys to hard or should we put the tt bush in the rear :confused:

[Bakes100]

I found the rear bushes the easiest to remove, i just stuck a suitably sized lever bar through the hole and levered them out, took abit of brute force but it pulled the rubber clean out and left the casing in there, which was easy to remove :)

When fitting the new rear bush just stick it in a vice with a peice of plate behind the bush to spread the load and wind the vice in, a small amount of jiggling is needed to get the lip over. This is with the Polybushes btw.

[Seat Gooner]

Parts list i think lol

2 x Front bush's cast arm 45mm PFF3-501
2 x Front Rear Bush's cast arm PFF3-610

[Ronin225]

Balljoints were in quite good condition so didnt change them
Did enquire about the price though and its about 40 quid each!!

[Seat Gooner]

bloody hell thats a rip off can you only get oem

[Ronin225]

Only asked for OE but after getting price i didnt bother
Price was from sere motors who are normally cheaper than most dealers

[Mark300zx]

I have had one little problem with poly bushes and it was because some of them don't flex as much as oem and in the bush that surrounds the vertical bolt it may cause some stress in the metal, so maybe keep an eye on the components?

[IBD]

Do you know if you can fit LCR / A3 / TT front wishbones onto a lesser LC?!? Might have some wishbones available, and like the idea of the cast ones

[wayne lcr]

i did all front bushes and 2 new ball joints for 70 quid from gsf

[Seat Gooner]

thats a good price wanye i take it they aint the polys lol

[Murdered LCR]

I have these on my wishbones drove me mad squeaking for about a month there ok now lol

[wayne lcr]

thats a good price wanye i take it they aint the polys lol

carnt see the point in the polys if you dont track your car:shrug:
i will never go on the track with my car either:)
and as mark300 these bushes are very stiff
o and me names wayne not wanye:p

[Seat Gooner]

:lol::lol: ha ha wanye ;) lol

ok mr wayne thats a good point with the polys wonder if sere motors could do a good price on them

[wayne lcr]

do them on ebay mate

[Seat Gooner]

good point mate ill have a looook

[james walker]

tt rear wishbone bushes are a good compromise to poly... stiff compared to oem, fraction of the cost of poly and no vibrations

[Mark300zx]

tt rear wishbone bushes are a good compromise to poly... stiff compared to oem, fraction of the cost of poly and no vibrations

Are you talking about the rear wishbone, or the rear bush on the front wishbone?

[wayne lcr]

the rear bush on the wish bone

[paul-murphys]

Ok when changing the rear bushes do you push them in from the top or bottom on a lcr, im doing mine currentle but dont want to put them in the wrong way as one side of bush is bigger then other side,


thanks

[Ronin225]

If poly they are in 2 pieces, if OE bushes they push in along the wishbone
If you look through the pics you can see which side the lip is on

[paul-murphys]

its 2 piece for front bush an 1 piece for rear bush,

heres the same one

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/POWERFLEX-BUSH-Seat-Leon-Cupra-R-Mk1-99-05-PFF85-410-/300432556792?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item45f32d02f8

just need to know if press it in from top or bottom,

http://i462.photobucket.com/albums/qq349/paul-murphys/IMG_0049.jpg

does the bigger side go top or bottom of wishbone

http://i462.photobucket.com/albums/qq349/paul-murphys/IMG_0050.jpg

[Ronin225]

I pressed from the top leaving larger flat on top of wishbone
If you look at the rebushed pic the larger diameter is on top

[cocadave]

Do you know if you can fit LCR / A3 / TT front wishbones onto a lesser LC?!? Might have some wishbones available, and like the idea of the cast ones

Bump,

Anybody know if these will fit normal cupra's?

Thanks

[brad1]

Bump,

Anybody know if these will fit normal cupra's?

Thanks

Nope they dont

[cocadave]

Gutted, so does that mean that the whole "upgrade your wishbone bushes to TT bushes is only applicable to LCR's?

[Ronin225]

Cupras have a smaller pressed wishbone, but layout is the same
If you bought the correct bushes the method to replace them is the same

[gdjohny]

Hi
I have two Leon s One is normal 1.9 tdi ( Missys car ) and I drive LC TDI. I have notticed that there is small crack in the front arm bush and I need to replace it . Are there few sizes or Can I get one size for both of the cars ?

[Ronin225]

I think both your cars have the pressed type arms which will require the smaller front bush
LCR has cast arms which require a different bush as its set up differently to other variants

[gdjohny]

thanks. can anyone send me some links to ebay listings so I can order it? thanks

[Ronin225]

Just a quick update now added all parts numbers for OE and powerflex replacement parts
Thanks to Dave at sere for taking the time to find them

[cupraJD]

very useful

[M206]

hello everyone.

please help me.

i've a doubt.

I've a Leon FR TDI 150hp, so i know that i have the pressed wishbones, so i'd need the powerflex bushes cod. PFF85-410.

Two weeks ago my tyreseller mounted the powerflex bushes, he don't know what exact code, he said he asked for the specific model of mine.

I fear he mounted the wrong bushes, the cupra r's ones (cod. PFF3-610 for cast wishbones).

here you are the pics.

i have a doubt about the small space that is left in the lower part driver side:

http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb465/m206/powerflex/powerflexlatoguida.jpg

and the same space left in the upper part passenger side:

http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb465/m206/powerflex/powerflexlatopasseggero.jpg

is everything ok?

are they the right ones or are they the cuprar wrong ones?

in the worst case, am i risking some breaking / problems if i drive in these conditions??

please help me..:cry::cry::cry:

[M206]

help.. i'm really worried..:cry:

[M206]

are there some dimensions difference between cupra r version and normal ones?

if someone confirm me that the are of the same dimensions and the difference are only in the material used i can calm down..

please help..

[Ronin225]

Tbh i wouldnt expect you to be able to even fit the incorrectly sized bushes.
Check the powerflex site for part numbers to compare

[gdjohny]

i think cupra R have a different sized bushes mate

[lcrsammy]

Good guide ronin, will be following it in the next few weeks to get through my mot.

Was hoping someone could tell me which part number is for which side of the 8n0 407 165/8no 407 166 drivers side or passenger side?

Thanks again ronin!

[Ronin225]

No problems mate, glad it helped
165 is passenger side, 166 is drivers side

[lcrsammy]

Sweet, nice one mate! Soon I shall have both wishbones £60, powerflex bushes £30 (nice having friends in high places) so a bit of DIY and I'll have a cheaply rebushed car!

Thanks again for the guide, will let you know how I get on! Maybey a few weeks though as spare time is very rare atm!

Sam

[lcrsammy]

just a few quick questions, has anyone, when putting the new balljoints on the arms, put them in the max negative camber position? and how did the car feel after?

thanks for any info posted ;)

[Ronin225]

Yes i did to start off with and ran 3 degrees of negative per wheel and above 60 the car was horrible to drive and so unstable

[lcrsammy]

Ok, that doesn't sound nice, was that with poly's or oem bushes?

What camber did you end up with/find the best compromise?

Sammy

[Ronin225]

About 1.5 degree in the end but that was set just before i went on the track

[P17DGY]

Did you find this worth doing?

[andy_lang]

Hi, im also doing this conversion - very good guide :)

apart from the wishbone and hub what else do i need? can you post some piccies up of all the parts i need as i will know them to look at :D

Thank youuuuu

Andy

[Ronin225]

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=347049

[csd_19]

Not sure if the installation instructions with the Powerflex bushes have been updated, but looking at a recent set it says to install the larger lip of the rear bush against the radiussed edge of the wishbone.

This means that one bush has the larger lip on the top side, the other has it on the bottom as that is how the cast wishbones have the radius.

Just that any pictures I've seen of poly'd LCR wishbones have them both done the same way.

Anybody got a new set to compare?

[tom t]

can anyone expand on slimy's method of changing his bushes? think i get the gist of it.