View Full Version : Is it me or.......
swales_p
14-03-2004, 12:36
Is it me or does the 2.0l 16v C/Sport seem much more responsive when you drive it a bit casual. For example instead of whacking the accelerator to the floor you gently ease it in all gears. Basically dont drive it like a race car - drive it like a road car!!!!!!!
This is defo the case in mine as it doesnt really take off unless im in 1st when flooring it!!! BUT goes like a bullet when slowly easing the accelerator to the floor waiting for high revs then..... WOO HOOOOooooooooo.
Ok i get bored sometimes when driving and use different techniques to see whats best,and after allot of trial and error this is defo the best way for mine. Why is this by the way!!! :cheers:
I find it can really fly when easing the power on in third, as you say not trying to thrash it but just let it ease on some speed :D
i'll let you know when it's built and run in :p
you guys running induction kits by any chance ? ;)
i'm not & do agree
full throttle vs applying the throttle just makes more noise.
also not revving the crap out of it seems to be working ok atm
No induction kit on mine either, just feeding in the power in third up until the redline at 90mph and not thrashing through first and second makes for a very good drive, mine feels at its quickest between 60-100 mph, puts a grin on my face every time. :D
Although mine's an 8v and is obviously different but I've noticed similar chracteristics. Also the first half of the travel of the accelerator pedal is most responsive and the further half seems to make little or no difference to acceleration. Consequently I rarely feel the need to floor it.
If the the initial responsiveness was linear throughout the whole travel of the pedal it would go like stink.
swales_p
14-03-2004, 23:37
I totally agree with GTI16v, however if you travel for a while in 2nd letting the revs hang around 3000 for a bit then apply the throttle slowly mine takes of and continues all the way up to 100 mph!!! - obviously changing gear along the way!!
Ive also noticed a big gap in power / revs from 2nd to 3rd, basicaly meaning i have to really work it in 2nd gear - approx 5000 - 6000 revs so that when i change gear the revs fall into the power band in third gear which on mine is approx 3500 - 4000 revs!!!
Does any1 else notice this? or is my car errrm... strange!!!!
I don't think mine drops that far back when shifting from 2nd to third but agree that you have to keep it in the power band otherwise it just dies, but I think most 16v's are like that, most hot hatches seem to have a long second gear so they will do 60 in second giving them a respectable 0-60 to seem more appealing. I don't like the way the power seems to really die off as soon as I hit about 65000, it might be the rev limiter starting to cut in but that usually stops it quite violently at 7k, I may be asking to much of it wanting power right up to the redline but I find I have to change a bit earlier to keep the power on, I do like the idea of getting some throttle bodies for it though :D
swales_p
15-03-2004, 00:00
I was thinking about doing something like that but isnt it expensive!!!!
looks like my cars a normal everyday 16v then!! thank god!!! Mine does however pull quite well up to 7000 revs but i dont really redline it much at the mo, seeing as me gearbox is in a right old state!!!!
I would say that thats the only downfall with our cars!! Modding for extra power! for 1000's ur talking +50 BHP MAX!!!! not much!! great car tho!!! :thumbup:
hopkinsgm
16-03-2004, 11:34
This really isn't uncommon on many cars, especially those running on original factory mapping - i'd imagine the problem is that like many control systems, the response time of the system tends to be such that step changes to the inputs (like gong from fully closed to wide open throttle) upset the system. This is most likely due to damping designed into the system ensuring that it can't increase the fuelling quick enough to get a rich enough mixture for all the extra air you've made available for the engine to suck in. Resulting in a weak mixture and the sluggish response you have observed.
So does a generally remap improve this sluggishness then?
hopkinsgm
16-03-2004, 11:40
p.s. as for modding routes being expensive - this is the way with normally aspirated motors. With forced induction (turbocharger or supercharger), you simply crank up the boost to increase the air supply, add some more fuel and adjust the timing. Alright, I know there's a little more to it than that, but that's basically about the size of it...
If you wanted to get big bhp gains out of any n/a motor, you'd have the same cost issues after sorting a few simple bolt ons - things such as exhausts, etc...
hopkinsgm
16-03-2004, 12:14
So does a generally remap improve this sluggishness then?
You could probably design out a little of the sluggishness by remapping, but then you run the risk of having the exact opposite situation - and an underdamped system is as bad (if not worse) than an overdamped one. In the case of an ECU in a car, the system would overfuel when you go from fully closed to wide open throttle. And if you wish to maintain a functioning catalytic converter, then less is most definitely more where fuelling is concerned...
I don't like the way the power seems to really die off as soon as I hit about 65000
Feck! That revs higher than a VTEC
hisashiburi
16-03-2004, 12:34
Feck! That revs higher than a VTEC
lol, im 99.9999999999% sure he meant 6,500rmp, not 65,000!
I have noticed the slugishness too... notably... when cruising along in 4th or 5th at low rpm, say, 1500.... if you release the throttle and then prompty press it down hard, the car jerks foward a few times before resuming smoothe acceleration. Mind you it takes a fair stab at the throttle to get this to happen.
I always put it down to restrictive intake system/that bloody resonator box.
I plan on geting an induction kit soon, i will comment if i notice any difference (just as soon as some kind sod answers my post from the other day!!!!!)
when cruising along in 4th or 5th at low rpm, say, 1500.... if you release the throttle and then prompty press it down hard, the car jerks foward a few times before resuming smoothe acceleration. Mind you it takes a fair stab at the throttle to get this to happen.
This is partly down to the fact that when you release the throttle the fuel supply is cut.
hopkinsgm
16-03-2004, 16:32
...when cruising along in 4th or 5th at low rpm, say, 1500...
Worth noting that you're well and truly off the cams at this point, far better to drop a cog or two before you boot it if you want any kind of "go"...
ibizacupra
16-03-2004, 18:07
The ABF throttle is nasty...
Huge big cast 'wedges' in it as its a large single throttle plate and I guess they were trying to make it nice and progressive on throttle thru town by making it dead.
First 20% throttle movement opens next to no air gap
Horrible..
Yeah I did mean 6.5k and not 65000, midnight on a Sunday was not the time to be writing down numbers. I do find the first part of the throttle does nothing, quite a contrast to my old 205 GTi that would pull nearly half revs if you even brushed along side the pedal.
The ABF throttle is nasty...
Huge big cast 'wedges' in it as its a large single throttle plate and I guess they were trying to make it nice and progressive on throttle thru town by making it dead.
First 20% throttle movement opens next to no air gap
Horrible..
and there was me thinkingi had a slack throttle cable
cheers bill :)