View Full Version : More power for Arosa 1.4Tdi
I've got a superchip in my Arosa 1.4TDi and now it is kicking out 105BHP but still wanting some more power from the little gem under the bonnet! What other modifications can I do to get more from the the little beast?
gavin.kilner
10-04-2002, 21:34
Surely 105BHP is enough!!
A larger intercooler would probably be the next worthwhile modification, shortly followed by a new clutch/gearbox I suspect!
Can you do me a favour? - time your car from 50-70 in top, use a stop watch if possible. I'd be very interested to find out what times you get!
In std form my car gives;
50 - 70mph in 5th = 9.3secs
50 - 70mph in 4th = 7.4secs
With tuning box fitted;
50 - 70mph in 5th = 7.4secs
50 - 70mph in 4th = 5.4secs
I did these timings at the weekend, I did the same timings 10,000mls ago and they were a bit slower than this - the engine definetly gives more power as the miles pile on.:)
ModdedCars
10-04-2002, 21:37
What else have you done to keep this power under control?
I should imagine that 105bhp and 184lb/ft of torque is putting quite a strain on the clutch/'box - but I'm not sure what the limits are, might be worth looking into it before you go for more power gains.
Also chassis/brakes could be a good investment, brakes on my GTi aint too hot coping with 125bhp, and the TDi ones are smaller (does it have drums on the back ?)
As for squeezing more power, remember its only a small 3-pot engine, so I'm not sure how far you can go.
Unless, you swap it for the 2.5litre V6 Diesel engine out of an Audi A4.....now THAT would be impressive! :) would handle like shite, though.
105BHP TDi versus the 100BHP 1.4 16V would be interesting though!
Well this will be something for me to do then over the weekend then as I am curious to. So you have a tuning box, what is the max BHP and torque you are getting then? I see that a lot of people have got these tuning boxes but I opted for a Superchip and wondering if I should have got the tuning box instead if it gives you a few more horses! Do you know what your 0-60 time is? Well I only got 13K miles on my car dunno if it will get any faster with a few more miles on! I feel that 50-70 might be a bit sluggish in 5th gear coz in 5th my car comes alive when you hit it at 80MPH+ that when the turbos really kicks in! Well I will report back to you as soon as I have the times!
gavin.kilner
10-04-2002, 21:46
The brakes on my car are not the best, break hard down from 100 to 50 a few times and they begin to fade. My dealer stripped them down at the last service but said they were in perfect condition - thats as good as they get!!
I would also be very interested to find out what 50-70mph timings people with the Arosa 16V/Lupo GTi's get!!
Originally posted by ModdedCars
What else have you done to keep this power under control?
I should imagine that 105bhp and 184lb/ft of torque is putting quite a strain on the clutch/'box - but I'm not sure what the limits are, might be worth looking into it before you go for more power gains.
Also chassis/brakes could be a good investment, brakes on my GTi aint too hot coping with 125bhp, and the TDi ones are smaller (does it have drums on the back ?)
As for squeezing more power, remember its only a small 3-pot engine, so I'm not sure how far you can go.
Unless, you swap it for the 2.5litre V6 Diesel engine out of an Audi A4.....now THAT would be impressive! :) would handle like shite, though.
I had the superchip fitted on my car just after 4,000 miles as I was advised that this is the best time to do it since the engine is bedding in and it will accommodate the extra power better! I had my car on the rolling ramps and before the superchip it was actually registering 82BHP and not 75BHP. Now it is 105BHP and 186lb/ft. I was told that any more power would probably damage the gear box and/or clutch and at Superchips they had got some chips to do this on certain cars and so had to pull the power back. This was known on the Lupo and the guy at Superchips was surpised that my clutch could handle this power! 13K miles not and no problmes what so ever! Yeah the brakes are pretty good and have good stopping power especially with the standard fuel saving tyres on (Hopefully getting Eagle F1 soon so should improve performance a bit more I hope). Yep rear brakes are drums! Apart from Superchip I have done nothing else yet, was considering getting bigger wheels but I was told that I would lose like 2-3MPH and after all my effort of Superchipping the beast every MPH counts! 2.5 V6 Diesel + a superchip I love the sound of that!!!!
Originally posted by gavin.kilner
The brakes on my car are not the best, break hard down from 100 to 50 a few times and they begin to fade. My dealer stripped them down at the last service but said they were in perfect condition - thats as good as they get!!
I would also be very interested to find out what 50-70mph timings people with the Arosa 16V/Lupo GTi's get!!
Hey whats the top speed you have got with the tuning box?
gavin.kilner
10-04-2002, 22:04
My car has not been on a dyno but tuning box only claim 89bhp and 171lbft torque.
A friend has a Golf TDi 90BHP fitted with a tuning box and the difference it makes isn't that impressive, however the difference is certainly more noticeble on my car - the tuning box really does seem to suit the little 1.4TDi PD engine very well.
When you floor it and open her up, have you noticed how smokey your car is? I can see a fairly big puff when I do this in the rear view mirror! But I definitely bet would never dream of going back to the basic un modded engine! Doesn't it just feel like the car is let free now!:D
gavin.kilner
10-04-2002, 22:15
The fastest indicated speed I have seen is about 117mph that's revving at 4200/4300rpm it will not go any faster than that - even down hill, the power drops off significently at 4200rpm.
It could really do with a 6th gear!!
On fast A roads 112mph is a speed it will always reach quite easily, any more than that and you have to wait quite a while!
The only time I notice smoke is when driving in the dark with a car following closely behind, when I floor it I can see smoke in his headlights. Friends following me say they haven't really noticed!
Originally posted by gavin.kilner
The fastest indicated speed I have seen is about 117mph that's revving at 4200/4300rpm it will not go any faster than that - even down hill, the power drops off significently at 4200rpm.
It could really do with a 6th gear!!
On fast A roads 112mph is a speed it will always reach quite easily, any more than that and you have to wait quite a while!
Hmm seems like the Superchip doesn't really improve top end speed much then! Yeah I was going down a very slight hill and it was reading about 117 and still going but I am sure it would have gone a bit more had I not eased off as I thought I saw something after me! Yeah it was revving about 4200rpm. On the flat mine will happily cruise at 110. I saw somewhere on here that someone mentioned hitting 130 with a tuning box. I am sure that would be more or less redlined and hard to believe in a 1.4TDi Arosa!
gavin.kilner
10-04-2002, 22:32
I've never timed 0-60, but I have a friend with a '00 Focus 2.0 Zetec, and another with a '96 Honda Accord 2.0, upto about 80mph all three cars are very evenly matched. Both the Honda and Focus are booked at approx 9.5 secs, so I'd guess my car is very close to that.
130mph would be 4,800rpm - no chance!!!!
ModdedCars
10-04-2002, 23:52
>> It could really do with a 6th gear!!
No reason why you couldn't take the box out of a 6-speed Lupo GTi. Same size box as the 5 speed thats used in the rest of the models.
Wouldn't get your hopes up of finding a second hand one from a write off, though, and it'll prolly set up back about a £1000 from VW....
>> 105BHP TDi versus the 100BHP 1.4 16V would be interesting
>> though!
The TDi would eat it alive. 5 more bhp, a HELL of a lot more torque - assuming the TDi driver could keep the power down....
>> I would also be very interested to find out what 50-70mph
>> timings people with the Arosa 16V/Lupo GTi's get!!
I should imaging that, the GTi's larger torque and greater power should give it a significant edge - even more so if its the 6-speed box.
A chipped Arosa TDi would kill both cars on a 50-70 though. And I reckon that it would do quite well against a GTi generally.....anyone got the 0-60 times of a chipped TDi???
I'll try and get the 0-60 time up as I have been meaning to do so for ages now! Standard is quoted at 12.6 seconds but I am sure it should be sub 10 secs! We'll soon see!
ModdedCars
11-04-2002, 00:12
I'd be willing to put some money on the 8.2-8.5 seconds region.
If the Arosa 16v can do 8.8 (10 is quoted, but 8.8 has been tested) then the greater torque should see the TDi get a better time
gavin.kilner
11-04-2002, 00:26
I'm not convinced that a chipped TDi will beat a 16V Arosa 0-60.
Why?
1. The TDi is quite a bit heavier
2. All that extra torque helps low down, but makes very little difference to outright 0-60 performance.
3. Even though they have very similar BHP outputs, the diesel engine cannot rev as quickly as a petrol engine.
4. The TDi will need to make an extra gear change into 3rd, can the 16V Arosa pull 60 in 2nd?
5. I've got a test of a Polo 1.4TDi fitted with a Chip that did 0-60 in 10.4, I can't see the Arosa being 2 secs faster than that.
It would be interesting though! I'm always on the look out for 1.4 16V Arosa's/Lupo's/Polo's to see how my car compares.
Originally posted by gavin.kilner
I'm not convinced that a chipped TDi will beat a 16V Arosa 0-60.
Why?
1. The TDi is quite a bit heavier
2. All that extra torque helps low down, but makes very little difference to outright 0-60 performance.
3. Even though they have very similar BHP outputs, the diesel engine cannot rev as quickly as a petrol engine.
4. The TDi will need to make an extra gear change into 3rd, can the 16V Arosa pull 60 in 2nd?
5. I've got a test of a Polo 1.4TDi fitted with a Chip that did 0-60 in 10.4, I can't see the Arosa being 2 secs faster than that.
I agree that the 16V Arosa MIGHT be better. The TDi is alot heavier than the 16V Arosa. Superchip has got rid of the turbo lag and makes the car rev alot more freely reaching the high revs really quickly. I know that my TDi Arosa flat out will pull 55 in second if you are just interested in top end speeds in each gear but you need to change up a gear before that as the power tails off at the top end revs. I am pretty sure that the Arosa weighs a lot less than the Polo so maybe looking at 9 secs there abouts!
This has been a really interesting Thread, with been a newby to the TDi Arosa, just over a week and 450 miles, got a few questions more (sos, I seem to ask a lot)
in the books 0-62 is 12.1 secs, you guys seem to think its a lot faster, are you one about chips or the standard?
When does the Turbo actually kick in?
Its a bit boggy down in 1st gear, is it just me or are all a bit lacking in 1st it seems best in 3rd gear
What revs did you keep to when running, god its hard keeping it down, trying to keep it below 2,000 rpm but sometimes in 1st and 2nd when needing a bit of speed from junctions I've gone a bit higher, not breaking 3,000 though, its a strain been so restrained
Does the superchipping invalidate the warranty, I've heard the SEAT dealers uphold the warranty for 1.8T Ibizas, does it also effect the MPG?
With regards to performance of the 16V I know full well I can beat 1.8 MK2 Golfs only the 8V not the 16V. I can also beat 2.0 8V MK3 and also fiesta XR2's and XR2i's.
0-60 never really been bothered nor can I be bothered with working out 50-70 as I seem to have a life. All I know is I can just keep up with my mums Vauxhall Omega 3.0 V6 but when I went passed her on the M5 at 125 without knowing she was there she soon caught me back up again.
Colin(GZA)
gavin.kilner
11-04-2002, 18:07
Well I don't have a life! I've been out with the trusty stop watch.
Times with Tuning Box connected;
I had a few runs, on flat road!
0-60 = 9.3 to 9.6
0-90 = 21.3 to 21.9
I got 9.0 and 20.7 once, but I probably cheated a bit, I couldn't manage it again!
As for MPG before tuning box I was averaging 55mpg, now with tuning box I'm everaging 53mpg.
Originally posted by spook
This has been a really interesting Thread, with been a newby to the TDi Arosa, just over a week and 450 miles, got a few questions more (sos, I seem to ask a lot)
in the books 0-62 is 12.1 secs, you guys seem to think its a lot faster, are you one about chips or the standard?
When does the Turbo actually kick in?
Its a bit boggy down in 1st gear, is it just me or are all a bit lacking in 1st it seems best in 3rd gear
What revs did you keep to when running, god its hard keeping it down, trying to keep it below 2,000 rpm but sometimes in 1st and 2nd when needing a bit of speed from junctions I've gone a bit higher, not breaking 3,000 though, its a strain been so restrained
Does the superchipping invalidate the warranty, I've heard the SEAT dealers uphold the warranty for 1.8T Ibizas, does it also effect the MPG?
0-60 with a Superchip I guess will be around 8.5 - 9 secs I am only guessing at the moment haven't tried it yet but will do very soon! But I can tell you it is a lot lot faster than the standard TDi as it really does feel explosive!
Standard the turbo in mine kicked in around 2500 RPM now with the Superchip Turbo lag more or less gone and turbo kicks in a lot earlier about 2100 RPM.
My 1st is pretty explosive coz you already hit top revs before you should have changed up! 2nd gear pulls well, I agree 3rd grear pulls like a train!
Running in is the most boring and tempting time! I kept mine under 3000 rpm for the first 1000 miles but didn't take me long to do 1000 miles.
Well chipping ofcourse affects the MPG if you drive it sensibly less gear change = less diesel being burnt. It is only when you use the extra power the MPG goes down a bit but come on you got plenty of MPG to spare! MPG ranges from 45 - 65 like I say depends if you want the little beast to be naughty!
With Superchips fitted;
50 - 70mph in 5th = 6.4secs
50 - 70mph in 4th = 4.7secs
ModdedCars
14-04-2002, 23:51
What did you use to measure the times?
gavin.kilner
15-04-2002, 00:26
Quote;
With Superchips fitted;
50 - 70mph in 5th = 6.4secs
50 - 70mph in 4th = 4.7secs
Thats quick!! - Quite a lot quicker than my car. Very impressed.
Originally posted by gavin.kilner
Quote;
With Superchips fitted;
50 - 70mph in 5th = 6.4secs
50 - 70mph in 4th = 4.7secs
Thats quick!! - Quite a lot quicker than my car. Very impressed.
Well Superchips has a few more BHP than tuningbox so I guess it shows!
gavin.kilner
15-04-2002, 18:40
Did I forgot to mention, that when doing my 50-70mph timings I was towing a 6 birth caravan?!!
This could explain my slightly slower times!
Originally posted by gavin.kilner
Did I forgot to mention, that when doing my 50-70mph timings I was towing a 6 birth caravan?!!
This could explain my slightly slower times!
Hee hee yeah yeah...and I was towing a lorry! Hey have you noticed that the diesel from different brands of petrol station affects the performance of your car and the MPG? Or is that me and its a psychological thing?
gavin.kilner
15-04-2002, 19:10
I've read a few articles in Diesel Car where the very latest ultra low sulpher diesel sold at Shell/Texaco gives less performance & mpg than standard diesel.
In France they are not required to meet such a low sulpher content as we are. A lot of people when taking their car abroad claims to get increased performance/mpg.
So when filling up keep a look out for 'ultra low sulpher' and steer clear!
you'll never get more MPH with any chip unless the rev limit is raised , easiest way is to get it is through gearing , i e BIGGER rolling radius , wheels are the easiest way
BUT keep in mind if you fit big wheels to gain MPH you will lose out in the acceleration PLUS your speedo will be innacurate too :( hence no real mph figure @ all
if it was me :D i would b efitting smaller wheels and droppin top wack to about 105/110 and seeing if i could drop that 50-70 down to below 3.5/4secs now that would scare the average BMW :):):)
ModdedCars
15-04-2002, 22:27
I've never understood why people say "my car can do 140mph+"
AND?
How many times in your driving life will you hit the maximum speed of your car. Apart from the fact its highly illegal.
OK, So I was slightly impressed by a mate acheiving 150mph. But that was in an RS2. And he got caught too (a lesson for us all! :))
Acceleration and in gear times are what its all about, in gear times more than anything because thats real-life performance - and the most relevant in driving - because on the track, you only do a standing start once....
Unless your a Santa Podder, or course :)
ModdedCars
17-04-2002, 23:57
Out of interest, I recorded a 50-70 time of 6.5 seconds in the Loop in 4th.
Although, that was a mate-with-a-stopwatch jobbie, so it could vary by as much as a second :)
I noticed that a guy with a 400bhp Golf (Spook with know him) recorded a 50-70 time of just over 2 seconds.
Now THAT is quick.
Originally posted by ModdedCars
Out of interest, I recorded a 50-70 time of 6.5 seconds in the Loop in 4th.
Although, that was a mate-with-a-stopwatch jobbie, so it could vary by as much as a second :)
I noticed that a guy with a 400bhp Golf (Spook with know him) recorded a 50-70 time of just over 2 seconds.
Now THAT is quick.
You should have got your mate to get out of the car and timed it yourself, makes the car that little bit lighter :D maybe knock a few more secs off!
JonBlakeburn
25-04-2002, 14:42
Originally posted by rise_uk
I had the superchip fitted on my car just after 4,000 miles as I was advised that this is the best time to do it since the engine is bedding in and it will accommodate the extra power better!
On another note, which Arosa models are actually chippable - All of them? I'm looking into buying an Arosa 1.4 16v Sport, and am just curious as to what power gains can be seen if the Sport is chippable?
Last car I drove that had been attacked by Superchips was a New Mini One, which was pretty damn good...
Any info would be much appreciated guys! :)
gavin.kilner
25-04-2002, 17:24
Chipping non-turbo engined cars doesn't give much of an increase, you may get an extra 6-7bhp, but you will have to run the car on Super Unleaded/Shell Optimax.