Are cars being overtyred?

martin j.

Active Member
Feb 11, 2007
1,996
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Fife
Been around a while now (old git) and remember having cars with decent grunt but narrowish tyres, ie 3 litre Capri on 195/60/15 if memory is correct, surely with improvements in suspension and tyre technology my 150 hp Leon doesn’t need 225/45/17s? Is it style over need.?
Discuss.
 
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andycupra

status subject to change
they weigh a fair bit more now though, better brakes, not to mention what was high powered then is standard now. - capri 3.0 was something like 140-150bhp?

ok so a bit of digging, the leon you drive is only about 16kg heavier, but has about 10% more power, - 150 v 136bhp.
195 v 225 is pretty much equivalent taking into account power and a small increase in weight. (based on tyres being equal so there may be some logic to your thoughts if we expect improvement in tyres) But we also expect cars to handle and stop alot quicker now.
 
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Nathan penney

Active member
Jul 8, 2017
686
789
Liverpool
An Audi SUV, (possibly a QR8 if there’s such thing?) pulled up next to me at the lights the other day and I had to do a double take at not only the size of the wheels and tyres but the size of the brake discs and callipers.
Think they were 22” and the discs must have been at least 18” diameter.
The size of the red calliper was phenomenal, it was bigger than what’s on the 44 tonne Scania I drive.
I certainly wouldn’t want the bill when it needs discs and pads. ??
 

Yellow fr

Gone to new owner so seat less for now
Sep 6, 2018
1,547
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Sandbeds West Yorkshire
An Audi SUV, (possibly a QR8 if there’s such thing?) pulled up next to me at the lights the other day and I had to do a double take at not only the size of the wheels and tyres but the size of the brake discs and callipers.
Think they were 22” and the discs must have been at least 18” diameter.
The size of the red calliper was phenomenal, it was bigger than what’s on the 44 tonne Scania I drive.
I certainly wouldn’t want the bill when it needs discs and pads.

A rs q8


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Seriously?

Active Member
Apr 20, 2018
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831
An Audi SUV, (possibly a QR8 if there’s such thing?) pulled up next to me at the lights the other day and I had to do a double take at not only the size of the wheels and tyres but the size of the brake discs and callipers.
Think they were 22” and the discs must have been at least 18” diameter.
The size of the red calliper was phenomenal, it was bigger than what’s on the 44 tonne Scania I drive.
I certainly wouldn’t want the bill when it needs discs and pads. ??
They need to be fitted with such mahoosive brakes so that they can avoid rear-ending you when you have to do an emergency stop and they have left half the thickness of a green Rizzla between your rear bumper and their front bumper :mad:
 

G.P

Active Member
Sep 3, 2011
1,241
38
Worcestershire
But we also expect cars to handle and stop alot quicker now.

Stop yes, but I quite happy with how they go around corners, I'm not sure they really need to be improved in this respect, do we really need to corner any faster, if they do, I'm not so sure my Leon corners any better than my 03 Focus due to the lack of feel, I know a M140i corners better than a Sierra Cosworth but I know which ones more fun to drive..
 

Nathan penney

Active member
Jul 8, 2017
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Liverpool
80s cars were way way more fun.
but way more dangerous, many cars that were popular just wouldnt be seen as acceptable now.

the sad by product is many people drive like nutters and think they are great drivers these days.
If only Mercedes A class didn’t have driver aids on it, there would be a lot less nutters on the road!!
 

G.P

Active Member
Sep 3, 2011
1,241
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Worcestershire
80s cars were way way more fun.
but way more dangerous, many cars that were popular just wouldnt be seen as acceptable now.

the sad by product is many people drive like nutters and think they are great drivers these days.

Surly if older cars had the same safety features as modern ones, they would be safer as when they lose traction you'd be travelling much slower providing more chance to correct or making an accident less severe. As you say, its the drivers not driving to the conditions or knowing their vehicles ability. .
 
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Crossthreaded

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Apr 16, 2019
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Massively wide tyres are all very well until you get standing water or icy conditions. Then it all gets very "interesting". Personally it just makes me smile to think how much these people's image matters to them as I poodle past in my little old Fiat Panda, or, if I want to really show off, my 1.0 litre Ecomotive ibiza ST on it's massive 185/60x15 tyres! Tend to feel happier if they are in front of me though!
 
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'& Son' managed

Third Party
Mar 2, 2018
269
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South Coast
Back in the 90's I used to run rings around a lot of 'faster' cars in my Panda on modest 145/70x13" Polish tyres.
Main reasons were the 700Kg kerbweight - and not having the awful 'eco' Pirelli P8 rubber that FIAT often inflicted on
them when they were new.
4.5", (1/2 inch wider) Uno steelies also helped, but to a lesser extent. The grip level wasn't particularly high and there
was quite a bit of lean, (no anti-roll bars) - but that, (1990 Mk.2) Panda had excellent steering feel and a forgiving chassis,
so was fun and easy to drive near it's limits and no great drama if you went slightly-over, (it offered you 2 stages of prior warning.)
 
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SuperV8

Active Member
May 30, 2019
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Been around a while now (old git) and remember having cars with decent grunt but narrowish tyres, ie 3 litre Capri on 195/60/15 if memory is correct, surely with improvements in suspension and tyre technology my 150 hp Leon doesn’t need 225/45/17s? Is it style over need.?
Discuss.
Brakes as well are growing.
Sierra Cosworth brakes were 278mm, slightly smaller than the brakes from a 150tdi Leon!
As mentioned these big fast barges have huge brake discs - gone past 400mm now! Nearly 16" in old money!

Modern cars are sooo capable upto a point! then you crash! You rarely hear your tyres chirp. I believe everyone should be taking their driving tests in older cars, and actually learn to drive, so when the occasional slip happens from aqua planing/ice/snow etc.. you automatically know what to do to control the car.
 

'& Son' managed

Third Party
Mar 2, 2018
269
89
South Coast
I had a Ford Capri Calypso when I was 18.
Looked ace but cornered like a greasy chip paper!
LOL - A mate's similar 2-tone grey Capri 1600 was just one my Panda could comfortably out-corner, out-brake and just about live-with on the straights.
He wasn't that bothered about it, unlike an older workmate with a 'faster' Hyundai Scoupe, who seethed when I left his then new car in the dust through
some speedy twisties on the commute home...
 
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Mike the_cupra

Active Member
May 29, 2020
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81
Brakes as well are growing.
Sierra Cosworth brakes were 278mm, slightly smaller than the brakes from a 150tdi Leon!
As mentioned these big fast barges have huge brake discs - gone past 400mm now! Nearly 16" in old money!

Modern cars are sooo capable upto a point! then you crash! You rarely hear your tyres chirp. I believe everyone should be taking their driving tests in older cars, and actually learn to drive, so when the occasional slip happens from aqua planing/ice/snow etc.. you automatically know what to do to control the car.
I passed my test in 2010 but learned to drive in a Y reg 1.2 Corsa. Everyone else I knew learned to drive in a brand new diesel 307 or focus or whatever (10x easier to learn clutch control). As soon as they passed their test, they got into an old s***box KA/Fiesta. I actually got a newer car after my test (wasn't difficult). So I agree with your point.
 

smutts

Active Member
Apr 12, 2020
372
188
Having to drive through lots of Devon narrow lanes, I absofuckinglutely hate the behemoths that the yuppies bring down here.
You pull into the widening that previously allowed you to pass and carry on, instead it's a nobber in a Q8,
who can't get past in their bloated stupid useless vehicle.
Then expect me to reverse quarter a mile. (One of the mk1 Leon's weaknesses)
The Krauts are losing the plot building these things, they are doing what the Yanks did in the 1970's,
who then got raped by the Japanese and Germans making cars that were handy & useful, leaving the bloated dinosaurs for dead.
May history repeat itself.
Rant over, but the brakes will be needed here, as the damned thing won't be getting past
 

smutts

Active Member
Apr 12, 2020
372
188
Back on subject.........................
years ago I needed some parts from German & Swedish, (remember them?) twenty miles away.
I got a lift in a mates 1950's P4 Rover. It was pouring with rain.
The tyres were crossplies that remembered where they were when Jack Kennedy was shot.
I still have nightmares.
 
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