boost drops under load

[Craig!]

Hi Martyn,

Can you take a aquick look at these figures and see if you can spot anything out of the ordinary, their 4th gear runs:

Group A:	'002				Group B:	'115				Group C:	'118			
		RPM	Load	Inj. On Time	Mass Flow		RPM	Load	Absolute Pres.	Absolute Pres.		RPM	Temperature	Load	Absolute Pres.
	TIME					TIME					TIME				
Marker	STAMP	 /min	%	 ms	 g/s	STAMP	 /min	%	 mbar	 mbar	STAMP	 /min	°C	%	 mbar
	2.85	840	20.3	2.46	3.36	3.15	840	20.3	960	970	2.56	840	15	0	970
	3.75	840	20.3	2.46	3.44	4.05	840	20.3	960	970	3.44	840	15	0	970
	4.65	1360	36.8	6.15	13.39	4.95	1760	47.4	960	960	4.34	960	15	0	970
	5.55	1480	54.9	6.56	16.81	5.85	1320	57.9	960	1000	5.25	1680	15	0	980
	6.45	1360	54.9	6.15	15.11	6.75	1560	52.6	960	1010	6.15	1160	15	0	1010
	7.35	1960	45.9	5.74	17.03	7.65	2120	42.9	960	1020	7.05	1760	14	0	1010
	8.25	2360	40.6	4.92	18.22	8.55	2480	39.8	960	1020	7.95	2240	13	0	1020
	9.15	1840	16.5	2.05	4.72	9.45	1520	22.6	960	990	8.85	2200	12	0	1020
	10.05	1480	36.8	5.33	12.97	10.35	1520	43.6	960	980	9.75	1440	14	0	980
	10.95	1600	41.4	4.92	12.97	11.25	1680	42.1	960	990	10.65	1560	14	0	990
	11.85	1800	42.1	5.33	14.53	12.15	1840	39.1	960	1000	11.55	1720	14	0	990
	12.75	1920	30.8	3.28	10.11	13.05	1960	26.3	960	990	12.45	1920	14	0	1000
	13.65	2000	19.5	2.46	7.56	13.95	2000	19.5	960	980	13.35	2000	13	0	990
	14.55	2000	21.1	2.87	8.17	14.85	2000	21.8	960	980	14.25	2000	14	0	980
	15.45	2000	24.8	3.28	9.94	15.75	2000	26.3	960	970	15.15	2000	14	0	980
	16.34	2000	28.6	3.69	10.89	16.64	2000	28.6	960	980	16.04	2000	15	0	980
	17.24	1960	30.1	3.69	11.53	17.54	1960	30.1	960	980	16.94	1960	15	0	980
	18.14	2000	30.8	3.69	11.44	18.44	1960	30.8	960	980	17.84	1960	14	0	980
	19.04	2000	31.6	3.69	11.97	19.34	2000	33.1	960	980	18.74	2000	14	0	980
	19.94	2040	38.3	4.51	14.81	20.24	2040	38.3	960	990	19.64	2000	14	0	980
	20.84	2080	43.6	5.33	17.67	21.14	2120	43.6	960	1010	20.54	2080	14	0	1000
	21.74	2200	43.6	5.33	18.08	22.04	2280	43.6	960	1020	21.44	2160	14	0	1010
	22.64	2360	43.6	5.33	19.17	22.94	2440	43.6	960	1030	22.34	2320	13	0	1020
	23.54	2560	42.9	5.33	20.44	23.84	2600	42.9	960	1040	23.24	2480	12	0	1030
	24.44	2720	43.6	5.33	22.17	24.74	2760	42.9	960	1050	24.14	2640	12	0	1040
	25.34	2880	47.4	5.74	25.72	25.64	2960	51.9	960	1060	25.04	2800	12	0	1050
	26.24	3120	52.6	6.56	31.22	26.54	3200	51.9	960	1120	25.94	3040	12	0	1090
	27.14	3400	60.2	6.97	38.39	27.44	3320	32.3	960	1240	26.84	3280	12	0	1130
	28.04	2520	21.8	2.87	11.25	28.34	2320	36.8	960	1010	27.74	2840	11	0	1100
	28.94	2400	57.9	9.02	32.33	29.24	2440	69.9	960	1080	28.64	2360	12	0	1010
	29.84	2560	71.4	9.02	36.25	30.14	2640	72.2	960	1230	29.54	2520	12	0	1160
	30.74	2760	72.2	8.61	37.94	31.03	2840	71.4	960	1260	30.44	2680	12	1.2	1250
	31.64	2960	69.2	8.2	38.89	31.94	3000	68.4	960	1260	31.34	2880	12	0	1260
	32.54	3120	66.9	8.2	39.67	32.84	3160	67.7	960	1260	32.23	3040	12	0	1260
	33.53	3280	69.9	8.61	43.92	33.84	3360	68.4	960	1290	33.24	3240	12	0	1260
	34.43	3480	69.2	8.61	46.08	34.84	3520	68.4	960	1290	34.14	3400	12	0	1290
	35.44	3640	77.4	9.84	55.53	35.73	3600	29.3	960	1340	35.13	3600	12	1.2	1300
	36.33	2960	73.7	11.89	50.17	36.63	2960	98.5	1320	1240	36.03	3120	11	0	1120
	37.23	3040	97.7	12.3	57.19	37.53	3080	97	1290	1430	36.93	3000	12	43.1	1440
	38.23	3200	97.7	12.3	58.86	38.53	3280	98.5	1270	1370	37.83	3160	12	27.1	1400
	39.13	3360	105.3	13.94	66.89	39.43	3400	108.3	1350	1350	38.83	3320	12	12.5	1360
	40.03	3520	124.1	16.81	95.25	40.33	3640	157.9	1840	1900	39.73	3480	12	19.2	1350
	40.93	3800	184.2	27.47	134.56	41.23	3920	178.2	1910	2180	40.63	3800	14	87.1	2250
	41.83	4080	164.7	24.6	127.39	42.13	4120	163.9	1900	2010	41.53	4000	15	79.6	2090
	42.73	4320	160.2	24.6	130.61	43.03	4360	160.2	1880	1930	42.43	4200	18	77.6	1970
	43.63	4520	159.4	25.01	136.03	43.93	4600	158.6	1870	1900	43.33	4440	19	78	1910
	44.53	4720	157.1	25.01	141.31	44.83	4760	156.4	1860	1870	44.23	4640	21	79.2	1890
	45.43	4840	156.4	25.42	144.64	45.74	4960	156.4	1840	1850	45.13	4800	23	80.4	1850
	46.33	5080	154.9	25.42	149.53	46.63	5120	154.1	1840	1820	46.03	5000	24	82	1820
	47.23	5240	151.1	24.6	151.61	47.53	5280	149.6	1840	1820	46.93	5160	26	83.9	1820
	48.14	5400	148.9	24.19	151.22	48.43	5440	146.6	1820	1820	47.83	5320	27	85.5	1830
	49.03	5520	142.9	23.37	151.22	49.34	5560	142.9	1770	1780	48.73	5480	29	86.7	1790
	49.94	5640	140.6	23.37	150.56	50.24	5720	139.1	1770	1750	49.64	5600	30	87.1	1790
	50.84	5800	137.6	22.96	151.06	51.14	5800	137.6	1730	1720	50.54	5720	32	88.2	1740
	51.73	5880	136.1	22.96	152.11	52.04	5920	135.3	1670	1690	51.44	5880	33	88.2	1710
	52.64	6000	134.6	22.96	151.86	52.94	6000	132.3	1640	1690	52.33	5960	33	87.8	1670
	53.54	5600	21.1	2.05	0	53.83	4880	118.8	1870	1230	53.23	5920	34	0	1690
	54.42	4920	161.7	27.47	153.03	54.72	4960	161.7	1900	1950	54.12	4920	31	87.1	1820
	55.32	5000	160.9	27.06	153.83	55.62	5040	160.2	1900	1920	55.02	5000	32	94.1	1960
	56.22	5080	158.6	26.65	153.92	56.52	5120	157.1	1910	1920	55.93	5080	33	94.1	1910
	57.12	5160	155.6	26.24	153.14	57.42	5160	156.4	1910	1900	56.82	5120	33	94.5	1910
	58.02	5200	154.1	25.83	153.61	58.42	5240	152.6	1920	1880	57.72	5200	34	94.9	1890
	59.03	5280	151.9	25.42	152.19	59.33	5280	151.9	1920	1880	58.72	5240	34	95.3	1870
	59.92	5320	150.4	25.01	153.28	60.23	5320	65.4	960	2200	59.62	5320	35	95.3	1870
	60.82	5200	15	1.64	10.19	61.13	5160	11.3	960	1070	60.53	5240	33	0	1320
	61.72	5040	7.5	1.23	8.11	62.02	5000	7.5	960	1030	61.42	5080	29	0	1050
	62.63	4920	12.8	1.64	12.56	62.92	4920	18	960	1010	62.32	4960	28	0	1020
	63.52	4800	18.8	2.46	17.89	63.82	4760	19.5	960	1020	63.23	4840	27	0	1010
	64.43	4680	19.5	2.46	17.17	64.72	4680	16.5	960	1020	64.12	4720	25	0	1020
	65.32	4640	17.3	2.46	15.47	65.62	4560	15.8	960	1020	65.02	4640	24	0	1020
	66.22	4520	15	2.05	11.92	66.52	4480	15	960	1010	65.92	4520	23	0	1010
	67.12	4400	16.5	2.05	14.53	67.42	4400	18	960	1010	66.82	4440	23	0	1000
	68.02	4320	21.1	2.46	17.67	68.32	4280	21.1	960	1020	67.73	4360	22	0	1010
	68.92	4240	24.1	2.87	19.78	69.21	4240	28.6	960	1030	68.62	4280	21	0	1020
	69.83	4160	21.1	2.87	16.56	70.12	4160	16.5	960	1030	69.53	4200	21	0	1050
	70.72	4080	15	2.05	10.64	71.01	4080	15.8	960	1010	70.41	4120	21	0	1020
	71.62	4000	12	1.64	9.25	71.92	4000	10.5	960	1000	71.31	4040	21	0	1000
	72.61	3920	8.3	1.23	6.11	72.91	3880	8.3	960	1000	72.31	3920	21	0	1000
	73.51	3800	9	0	6.94	73.91	3760	9	970	1000	73.21	3840	21	0	1000
	74.51	3720	9	0	6.72	74.81	3680	9	970	1000	74.21	3720	21	0	1000
	75.41	3640	9	0	6.17	75.71	3600	9	970	1000	75.11	3680	21	0	1000
	76.31	3560	9	0	6.25	76.61	3520	9	970	1000	76.01	3560	21	0	1000
	77.21	3440	9	0	6.19	77.51	3440	9	970	990	76.91	3480	21	0	1000
	78.11	3360	9	0	5.83	78.41	3360	9	970	990	77.81	3400	21	0	990
	79.01	3280	9	0	5.94	79.31	3240	9	970	990	78.71	3320	21	0	990
	79.91	3160	9	0	6.03	80.21	3160	9	970	990	79.61	3240	21	0	990
	80.81	3120	9	0	5.72	81.11	3080	9	970	990	80.51	3160	21	0	990

 

[Martyn]

Craig, your MAF is certainly healthy and boost is tracking well. N75 duty looks fine too

 

[Craig!]

Cheers for that, thats on a 210bhp K03'd car if it makes any difference. Any chance of explaining how to read those figures? I'm ok with everything else but been new to a turbo car the above checks are new to me!!

 

[Martyn]

No probs dude.

Block 002 will log your MAF, for a healthy Ibiza MAF I'd expect to see peak figures between 140-160g/s. Your MAF peaks at 153 so no probs there...

Block 115 will log your requested and actual boost, ideally your actual boost should at least meet or slightly exceed your requested all the way through the rev range.
If this isnt the case you may well have a boost leak. Your requested/actual boost tracks well so I doubt you have any probs there either...

What remap are you running bud? The boost figs track well but look a little low...

Block 118 will log your N75 duty. If your N75 duty is 100% then you've got a nasty boost leak, most cars will map to 95% duty.

 

[Craig!]

Running a live Jabba re-map, alongside the turbo tip, forge dv, blue flame exhaust and a dynatwist. It was windy last night when I did the run's if that's make any difference. I've seen a peak of 162mg/s on the MAF before but that was driving differently last night, last night was a very calm non agressive run.

What's the best way to do a log, foot right to the floor and let the boost build, or gradually build it, or doesnt it matter?

 

[Martyn]

Wide open throttle from 1500-2000rpm to redline.

 

[Craig!]

Ahh, last night I was been progressive on the throttle, could that cause the lower readings? I'll do another WOT run later on and compare the results.

 

[Martyn]

More than likely mate.

 

[Craig!]

Right, nice to know how to log it properly, wasnt sure if it wanted WOT'ing or not due to it been a turbo and the build up etc. Will get some further runs in later and see how it goes then.

You any good with error codes? Check out http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79778 I've got no idea as to what may of caused it, and am I right in thinking the ICM is the ECU? It's the first time I've had the error, may just clear it and see if it comes back before worrying!

 

[h17och]

Martyn, could you also look at these please

cheers fella

Saturday,18,February,2006,12:10:36
6K0 906 032 AA ,,1.8L 20VT EU3 0002,

,Group A:,'118,,,,Group B:,'002,,,,Group C:,'020
,,RPM,Temperature,Load,Absolute Pres.,,RPM,Load,Inj. On Time,Mass Flow,,Idle Stabilization,Idle Stabilization,Idle Stabilization,Idle Stabilization
,TIME,,,,,TIME,,,,,TIME,,,,
MARKER,STAMP, /min,°C,%, mbar,STAMP, /min,%, ms, g/s,STAMP, CF, CF, CF, CF
,0.54,3640,21.0,80.4,2350.0,0.93,3840,191.0,21.32,137.69,0.23,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,1.53,4160,24.0,78.4,2260.0,1.84,4280,185.7,20.91,152.28,1.23,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,2.44,4560,27.0,76.5,2090.0,2.74,4720,178.9,20.09,162.33,2.14,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,3.33,4960,32.0,74.9,1970.0,3.64,5080,170.7,19.27,164.75,3.04,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,4.24,5320,35.0,74.1,1890.0,4.53,5400,159.4,18.04,166.19,3.94,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,5.13,5600,39.0,73.7,1840.0,5.43,5720,152.6,17.22,165.47,4.83,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,6.03,5880,41.0,73.7,1800.0,6.33,5960,149.6,17.22,168.94,5.73,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,13.35,6880,45.0,0.0,1150.0,12.73,7000,57.1,6.56,80.14,13.03,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,14.23,5280,42.0,0.0,1040.0,13.63,6680,8.3,1.23,9.75,13.93,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,15.12,4840,39.0,0.0,1020.0,14.53,5160,6.8,0.00,6.81,14.83,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,16.02,4440,39.0,0.0,1020.0,15.42,4720,7.5,0.00,7.14,15.72,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,17.02,4000,37.0,0.0,1020.0,16.42,4240,7.5,0.00,6.86,16.72,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,17.92,2920,36.0,0.0,1010.0,17.32,3560,8.3,0.00,5.72,17.62,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,18.82,2800,34.0,0.0,1000.0,18.22,2880,8.3,0.00,4.81,18.52,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,19.72,2680,34.0,0.0,1000.0,19.12,2760,8.3,0.00,4.22,19.42,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,20.62,2560,33.0,0.0,1000.0,20.02,2640,8.3,0.00,4.53,20.32,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,21.52,2440,33.0,0.0,1000.0,20.92,2520,8.3,0.00,4.17,21.22,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0
,22.41,2360,33.0,0.0,1000.0,21.81,2400,8.3,0.00,3.83,22.11,0.0,0.0,0.0,0.0

 

[Martyn]

Dude, can you e-mail or upload the actual CSV please bud? Just makes it easier to read.

And sorry to be a pain but can you do a run that starts from like 1500-2000rpm?

 

[h17och]

ive never done logs before and flashdsb lent me his laptop! had no real idea what i was doing!

I posted it how he sent me it so i dont have anyother format!

What revs did i start from then?

cheers

HoocH

 

[Martyn]

No probs bud.

You started from 3800ish and pulled to 7000ish.

Next time you get a chance log 002,020 and 115 starting in 4th gear from like 1500-2000rpm and keep going flat out until 6500-7000rpm.

 

[Jay]

Martyn, could you also look at these please

cheers fella

from what you've post :

STAMP	 /min	°C	%	 mbar	STAMP	 /min	%	 ms	 g/s	STAMP	 CF	 CF	 CF	 CF
0,54	3640	21	80,4	2350	0,93	3840	191	21,32	137,69	0,23	0	0	0	0
1,53	4160	24	78,4	2260	1,84	4280	185,7	20,91	152,28	1,23	0	0	0	0
2,44	4560	27	76,5	2090	2,74	4720	178,9	20,09	162,33	2,14	0	0	0	0
3,33	4960	32	74,9	1970	3,64	5080	170,7	19,27	164,75	3,04	0	0	0	0
4,24	5320	35	74,1	1890	4,53	5400	159,4	18,04	166,19	3,94	0	0	0	0
5,13	5600	39	73,7	1840	5,43	5720	152,6	17,22	165,47	4,83	0	0	0	0
6,03	5880	41	73,7	1800	6,33	5960	149,6	17,22	168,94	5,73	0	0	0	0

CF are @0 everywhere and N75 duty cycle stay around 75%

i would say you could get a sps3 and bump up boost and timing a bit

 

[h17och]

CF@0.....?

is 75% n75 good?

chees

HoocH

 

[Jay]

CF@0.....?

correction factor values for timing are 0 on all the 4 cylinders, it would be interesting to see if it's also true when beeing under 3800 rpm but i would say your timing is not too advanced and using a sps3 you can choose a more agressive one

is 75% n75 good?

chees

HoocH

75% clearly shows you have a k03s, to obtain the same kind of boost from a k03 it would probably be nearly maxed out and show duty cycle around 90-95%.

i think your turbo can do better than the pressure it shows here

 

[h17och]

cool! i will try to get some proper runs soon!

I would andvance the timing use a mates VAG-COM! how much would you recomend by?

cheers for the advise and help jay!

Hoochy

 

[Jay]

cool! i will try to get some proper runs soon!

I would andvance the timing use a mates VAG-COM! how much would you recomend by?

cheers for the advise and help jay!

Hoochy

i would say get a sps3 and follow the guide pointed to by this topic

 

[Jay]

cool! i will try to get some proper runs soon!

I would andvance the timing use a mates VAG-COM! how much would you recomend by?

cheers for the advise and help jay!

Hoochy

i would say get a sps3 and follow the guide pointd to by this topic

 

[h17och]

Got some more logs!!

any chance you can take a look please guys!!?

3RD gear

Wednesday 22 February 2006 20:35:14
6K0 906 032 AA 1.8L 20VT EU3 0002

Group A:	'002				Group B:	'020				Group C:	'118			
		RPM	Load	Inj. On Time	Mass Flow		Idle Stabilization	Idle Stabilization	Idle Stabilization	Idle Stabilization		RPM	Temperature	Load	Absolute Pres.
	TIME					TIME					TIME				
MARKER	STAMP	 /min	%	 ms	 g/s	STAMP	 CF	 CF	 CF	 CF	STAMP	 /min	°C	%	 mbar
	0.86	2280	31.6	2.46	11.03	0.26	0	0	0	0	0.56	2720	17	0	1230
	1.76	1920	18.8	2.05	9.08	1.16	0	0	0	0	1.46	2000	18	0	1050
	2.66	1920	10.5	1.23	4.06	2.06	0	0	0	0	2.36	1840	21	0	1040
	10.15	1600	75.9	8.2	26.08	10.45	0	0	0	0	10.75	1680	20	100	1230
	11.05	1760	97.7	9.84	36.36	11.35	0	0	0	0	11.65	1920	17	100	1440
	11.95	2000	117.3	11.48	48	12.25	0	0	0	0	12.65	2240	15	100	1810
	12.95	2360	154.9	16.4	75.44	13.25	0	0	0	0	13.55	2720	15	82.4	2380
	13.85	2840	191.7	21.73	110.08	14.15	3	0	0	0	14.45	3120	15	80	2430
	14.75	3240	191.7	22.14	124.69	15.06	3	0	0	0	15.35	3520	17	79.2	2360
	15.65	3680	191	20.91	130.75	15.95	3	0	0	0	16.25	3960	20	78	2260
	16.56	4080	188	20.91	146.89	16.85	1.5	0	0	0	17.15	4320	24	76.1	2160
	17.46	4440	183.5	20.5	155.75	17.75	0	0	0	0	18.06	4680	27	73.7	2050
	18.36	4800	174.4	19.68	159.67	18.66	0	0	0	0	18.96	5000	30	72.2	1940
	19.26	5120	169.2	18.86	164.17	19.56	0	0	0	0	19.86	5280	34	71.8	1900
	20.16	5360	161.7	18.45	165.36	20.46	0	0	0	0	20.76	5520	36	71.8	1870
	21.06	5600	155.6	17.63	168.67	21.36	0	0	0	0	21.66	5800	39	71.8	1810
	21.96	5840	151.9	17.22	169.56	22.26	0	0	0	0	22.56	6000	39	72.5	1760
	22.86	6040	148.9	16.81	175.19	23.16	0	0	0	0	23.45	6200	42	73.7	1780
	23.75	6240	148.9	16.81	176.42	24.05	0	0	0	0	24.35	6360	44	74.5	1790
	24.65	6440	146.6	16.4	179.5	24.95	0	0	0	0	25.25	6560	45	73.7	1780
	25.55	6600	142.9	15.99	179.78	25.85	0	0	0	0	26.15	6680	45	72.9	1730
	26.45	6720	139.8	15.58	179.78	26.75	0	0	0	0	27.05	6800	47	72.9	1730
	27.35	6880	136.8	15.17	179.17	27.65	0	0	0	0	27.95	6920	48	73.3	1740
	28.25	7000	134.6	15.17	180.25	28.55	0	0	0	0	28.85	7080	48	1.2	1870
	29.15	6760	18	2.05	24.31	29.45	0	0	0	0	29.75	5560	42	100	1030
	30.95	5320	61.7	2.46	0	31.25	0	0	0	0	31.55	5520	41	0	1140