Cost cutting

[J400uk]

Anyone else get the feeling there are now a lot of bits missing from the Leon that are present in the more expensive Golf/ A3?

There are the obvious big things like Multi-link rear suspension on all versions and the electric handbrake, but I keep noticing lots of little features that have disappeared such as the hydraulic bonnet struts and rear air vents.

Previously the big selling points with SEATs is you are effectively getting a VW/ Audi product at a lower price, but with these constant changes that is pretty much going to vanish, especially given the price differential is less than it was before and is almost entirely lost by the weaker residuals.

I don't have my Ibiza anymore and had been considering buying the new Leon next year, but I can't see myself coming back anymore.

 

[J400uk]

A few more I spotted inside (with pictures from Paris)

Plastic DSG cover:

No sunglasses holder:

Plastic interior door handle:

No drivers grab handle:

Non-adjustable boot floor:

In isolation each of those may not mean much, but everything together adds up to an inferior lower quality product.

The Golf MK7 on the other hand is sublime inside:

... with the A3 taking it a notch further:

 

[Deleted member 74601]

You can't expect to pay ~£3K-4K less for a car and still get everything in it.

 

[jezyg]

The Golf also has two different suspension systems although there 140 GT has multilink, whereas the SEAT 140 FR does not. The biggest grip across VAG's brands is that the MBQ is supposed to be cheaper to build and offer greater economies of scale.

Prices still seem to be rising, when you think back to 2003 and a fully loaded Leon MK1 Cupra 180 was £14999, and now a Leon FR 1.8TSi with similar power is pushing towards 22K, makes you stop and think. Even factoring extra safety kit and the cost of emission regulations being met.

 

[J400uk]

You can't expect to pay ~£3K-4K less for a car and still get everything in it.

The issue is more that some of these features have been included with the Leon in the past, the MK1 even shared an interior with the A3.

With the prices, there is only £1665 beteween the Audi and Leon in 2.0 TDI 150 SE form and like I said in my OP that difference is justified up by the stronger residuals.

The Golf also has two different suspension systems although there 140 GT has multilink, whereas the SEAT 140 FR does not. The biggest grip across VAG's brands is that the MBQ is supposed to be cheaper to build and offer greater economies of scale.

Golf is still multi-link for all versions

Prices still seem to be rising, when you think back to 2003 and a fully loaded Leon MK1 Cupra 180 was £14999, and now a Leon FR 1.8TSi with similar power is pushing towards 22K, makes you stop and think. Even factoring extra safety kit and the cost of emission regulations being met.

Agree, they are rapidly losing their USP.

 

[JK1]

Just looking at the new A3 even the S Line almost everything is an optional extra, cruise control, parking sensors, Bluetooth, folding mirrors, all cost and they aren't cheap.

I added a few of them and I was already up to £28k

 

[jezyg]

Golf is still multi-link for all versions

I have read two articles that seem to state that it has torsion beam on the cheaper models maybe some conflicting info out there???

"Cheaper models will have simple torsion beam rear suspension and the more upmarket models will have more sophisticated multi-link suspensions."

"One interesting development is that versions sold with 'under 122bhp' will be switching back to having a torsion beam rear axle in place of the multi-link system of the mk5/ mk6 Golf. More powerful versions will stick with a development of the multi-link."

 

[Cougar]

A few more I spotted inside (with pictures from Paris)


No sunglasses holder

Disappointing, but what's (Possibly) more irritating is they included the sunglasses holder in the new Toledo!

 

[J400uk]

Disappointing, but what's (Possibly) more irritating is they included the sunglasses holder in the new Toledo!

Good spot! Guess that's because the Toledo interior borrows heavily from VW/ Skoda (loosely based on the current shape Polo) whereas SEAT designed the interior of the new Leon. Seems to be a recurring theme, I was always very dissapointed with the interior quality of my Ibiza SC and when I had a look at the Mii and Citigo found them to be a lot more solid and better built.

 

[jezyg]

I have to admit at being quite tempted by the Toledo is looks like the better value family car the Leon used to be. Well equipped, decent space and not bad value either.

 

[m0rk]

I have to admit at being quite tempted by the Toledo is looks like the better value family car the Leon used to be. Well equipped, decent space and not bad value either.

Sadly that's because it's a stretched Ibiza, rather than a Leon chassis that lurks beneath

 

[jezyg]

Sadly that's because it's a stretched Ibiza, rather than a Leon chassis that lurks beneath

Very true, but even the Leon lower down the range does away with multilink, and as good as the cheaper MBQ platform is, can it really justify it's premium? Will you really notice unless undertaking more spirited driving?

After studying the pictures SEAT has put money into the weak area of the Leon, the 'interior' and looks like a decent job. Just not sure if it is worth the premium, and look forward to seeing a Toledo and MKIII Leon side by side.

 

[SteveTDCi]

The new Toledo looks really nice but the engine choice is poor, I really wish they would drop the 1.8 tsi engine in it.

 

[Cougar]

Toledo FR would be nice....

 

[cupra-barn]

I know this is a bit off topic, but why would the driver need a grab handle they have the steering wheel!

 

[J400uk]

I know this is a bit off topic, but why would the driver need a grab handle they have the steering wheel!

Its a sign of cheapness and its the subtilities/ attention to detail like that which make the difference IMO

 

[markmeus]

On the SEAT facebook page they've posted a pic of the Leon with rear air vents and an arm rest which i presume will also be standard!

It's still the best specced Leon yet IMO. Ok it's missing a sunglasses holder and drivers grab handles, but if I needed those things I'd get a Golf, the Golf/A3 will always be better cars

The Ibiza is completely poverty spec compared to its cousins, even the fabia has the option of the maxi dot trip computer!

 

[J400uk]

That looks good, but this doesn't:

 

[markmeus]

Depends how it feels really, can't be any worse than the handles on a fabia, they really do feel like they're gonna snap off.

Wonder what changes they'll make for the Cupra interior, if any????

 

[J400uk]

True. Speaking of which I'd been hoping we'd see the production facelift Ibiza Cupra at Paris... but no joy

Wonder if the fact they are dropping the twincharged unit might mean it will never see light of day