Dv & waste gate removal!!

[Mattsumoto]

So after having my Leon for 3 years and it being under my heavy foot, it's still not dead. Nor is it showing any signs of problems at all, I've obviously looked after it, serviced it regularly ect.
I've now decided in gonna keep it, probably get it to stage 2 until it finally goes kaput! But had anyone else ever removed and bypassed their dump valve as well as wastegate - I've done both of mine no n75 either to control them. Has anyone else done this??
I am decat'd but only because I had a mishap with the cat converter (basically it went pop pop bang) but now there seems to be a hell of a lot more boost initially, then it dies off, then builds up again obv I know there's restrictions in all different areas ie exhaust flow, fuel pressure, intercooler ect but that's all to come... I just wanted to know if anyone else had any thoughts? Hmmm

Makes one hell of a turbo chatter when I change gear though... Bloody awesome ;p

 

[andrewkettle]

Isn't running a turbo car without a DV or wastegate just going to kill the turbo??

As soon as the throttle body is shut all of that pressure will be trying to go somewhere!

There are a few things on these cars that can be got rid of - N75, SAI etc but Im pretty sure that the dump valve and wastgate is very much needed!!

Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[ibizacupra]

So after having my Leon for 3 years and it being under my heavy foot, it's still not dead. Nor is it showing any signs of problems at all, I've obviously looked after it, serviced it regularly ect.
I've now decided in gonna keep it, probably get it to stage 2 until it finally goes kaput! But had anyone else ever removed and bypassed their dump valve as well as wastegate - I've done both of mine no n75 either to control them. Has anyone else done this??
I am decat'd but only because I had a mishap with the cat converter (basically it went pop pop bang) but now there seems to be a hell of a lot more boost initially, then it dies off, then builds up again obv I know there's restrictions in all different areas ie exhaust flow, fuel pressure, intercooler ect but that's all to come... I just wanted to know if anyone else had any thoughts? Hmmm

Makes one hell of a turbo chatter when I change gear though... Bloody awesome ;p

dont be a fool...

 

[Mattsumoto]

Noo! That's just a myth - I've never known any turbo to go bang from the turbines spinning in the opposite direction because of now dv or wastegate. These tools are only to relieve pressure from the vacuume system, I reckon as long as removing them doesn't cause over boosting and exceeds the psi limitations of the turbo im safe! Plus the pressure is still released it just backs up through the system and comes out the air filter... Which after running this system for 6 months still hasn't messed up my maf or the turbo

 

[Mr OCD]

Your wrong... Listen to what Bill has said above...

 

[aaron-gardner]

When it goes all wrong you will know why. There is a reason why we have dv and wastegates. The dv is to act as a pressure stabiliser and also a pressure release when the throttle body closes. Back pressure on the turbo causes more than just turbo stall and a performance drop. The idea for quick gear changes and maximum turbo usage is to keep it spinning in the right direction. But besides performance you risk damaging the turbo seals which a prone to damage with this abuse. And of course the wastegate. Your car may seem like it will run without it because your car goes into limp Mode from overboost and the turbo is still pushing out high boost due to limp mode having no control over the boost. You risk running very very lean which will destroy your valves and quite possibly the pistons. Even tho they are forged they are not indestructible. Do you even have a boost gauge? The wastegate and dv control the boost to prevent overboost and any engine damage. Basically they are fitted for a reason.

 

[cupra.al]

Noo! That's just a myth - I've never known any turbo to go bang from the turbines spinning in the opposite direction because of now dv or wastegate. These tools are only to relieve pressure from the vacuume system, I reckon as long as removing them doesn't cause over boosting and exceeds the psi limitations of the turbo im safe! Plus the pressure is still released it just backs up through the system and comes out the air filter... Which after running this system for 6 months still hasn't messed up my maf or the turbo

why do you think your cat went pop pop bang?

 

[milner575]

I don't get what you'd hope to achieve by removing them?

 

[glynnd]

So after having my Leon for 3 years and it being under my heavy foot, it's still not dead. Nor is it showing any signs of problems at all, I've obviously looked after it, serviced it regularly ect.
I've now decided in gonna keep it, probably get it to stage 2 until it finally goes kaput! But had anyone else ever removed and bypassed their dump valve as well as wastegate - I've done both of mine no n75 either to control them. Has anyone else done this??
I am decat'd but only because I had a mishap with the cat converter (basically it went pop pop bang) but now there seems to be a hell of a lot more boost initially, then it dies off, then builds up again obv I know there's restrictions in all different areas ie exhaust flow, fuel pressure, intercooler ect but that's all to come... I just wanted to know if anyone else had any thoughts? Hmmm

Makes one hell of a turbo chatter when I change gear though... Bloody awesome ;p

I dont mean to be rude here, but speaking as a qualified vehicle techician................................this is the craziest thing I have read on this forum.
You will be sorry at some point if you let your car continue to run like this.

 

[Mattsumoto]

Haa yeah probay, 10 years from now and once I've done another 20000 miles! Like I say it would be a pretty stupid floor if the turbines could only spin 'x' amount of revolutions one way and then completely blow up if it went the other! If anything is say my car was running a bit rich, but isn't this the same when you modify custom fuel injectors or decat the exhaust or any other modification the dealership would class as 'risky' or unheard of. I mean who's to tell me other wise, have any of you seen any other turbos or similar situations upon which the engine had melted, blown ect! All this is, is speculation, what ifs and theoretically I'm agreeing with you I see the implications of removing said items! But being right here and having done approx 6000 miles both urban, motorway and heavy footed driving nothing has happened as of yet! I achieve a little more than what you would from replacing the origional n75 valves or removing half the engines components or n249 replacing the springs in dump valves to more restricting ones to hold more pressure within the system or replacing the actuating rod ect ect! None of what your saying is backed up with hardcore evidence it may seem stupid and outlandish as its not really spoken of or done, but so were many other mods back in the early days... So were turbo's! I'm sure you will all be the first to know if or when I encounter any problems and you can all laugh and say those all important words "I told you so" but for now I don't want your descending connotations just a friendly chit chat and maybe a few laughs

 

[Harris.]

Can't comment on running no wastegate or n75, but ran a fiesta turbo on the original T2 at 1 bar of boost with no dv and immense chatter for 10yrs and it never caused any damage to the turbo at all. And it was running more boost than a T2 should.Still running like that now as far as I'm aware.
Not saying its right or wrong tho just my experiences. I'm from the Ford scene where nobody runs dv's unless its mfi injection.

Sent from my HTC Sensation XE with Beats Audio Z715e using Tapatalk 2

 

[CupraRmark]

I ran my subaru with the waste gate welded up then using external waste gate and screamer pipe and no d.v with no issues I wouldn't wanna run one with no waste gate at all tho....
Yea scrap the d.v lol....

 

[CupraRmark]

I ran my subaru with the waste gate welded up then using external waste gate and screamer pipe and no d.v with no issues I wouldn't wanna run one with no waste gate at all tho....
Yea scrap the d.v lol....

Mind you after about 2000 miles it was removed as the screamer pipe was doing my head in

 

[Hartosh1]

I know on the 200 forum alot of them don't run dump valves without any problems even at 300+bhp. Ive got a recirc on mine just now as i don't like the idea of stalling the turbo.

 

[JoeBrooke]

You can't seriously think you're not running a wastegate. The ECU would not allow you to run the turbo blind, it'd just go into limp mode. The turbo would make as much boost as it could. Even if the ecu did allow this, it wouldn't be able to supply the correct fuelling as the standard injectors wouldn't be up to the job, so it'd go bang very quickly.

 

[ibizacupra]

Haa yeah probay, 10 years from now and once I've done another 20000 miles! Like I say it would be a pretty stupid floor if the turbines could only spin 'x' amount of revolutions one way and then completely blow up if it went the other! If anything is say my car was running a bit rich, but isn't this the same when you modify custom fuel injectors or decat the exhaust or any other modification the dealership would class as 'risky' or unheard of. I mean who's to tell me other wise, have any of you seen any other turbos or similar situations upon which the engine had melted, blown ect! All this is, is speculation, what ifs and theoretically I'm agreeing with you I see the implications of removing said items! But being right here and having done approx 6000 miles both urban, motorway and heavy footed driving nothing has happened as of yet! I achieve a little more than what you would from replacing the origional n75 valves or removing half the engines components or n249 replacing the springs in dump valves to more restricting ones to hold more pressure within the system or replacing the actuating rod ect ect! None of what your saying is backed up with hardcore evidence it may seem stupid and outlandish as its not really spoken of or done, but so were many other mods back in the early days... So were turbo's! I'm sure you will all be the first to know if or when I encounter any problems and you can all laugh and say those all important words "I told you so" but for now I don't want your descending connotations just a friendly chit chat and maybe a few laughs

dont be a ****

you clearly dont understand what you have said.....

Wastegate controls the boost... and you want to remove it?? c'mon... read up a little on how these things work before post cr4p and making yourself look like an eejit

DV removal for "cool" chirpy noises... Understand its there to keep turbo from stalling on closed throttle between gear changes, and the lack of it will also increase load on the compressor as it pumps "dead head" for that moment..

 

[CupraRmark]

dont be a ****

you clearly dont understand what you have said.....

Wastegate controls the boost... and you want to remove it?? c'mon... read up a little on how these things work before post cr4p and making yourself look like an eejit

DV removal for "cool" chirpy noises... Understand its there to keep turbo from stalling on closed throttle between gear changes, and the lack of it will also increase load on the compressor as it pumps "dead head" for that moment..

Love it bill

 

[dazjstuart]

I'm pretty sure a turbo has to have a wastegate (be it internal or external), if not the boost would be unregulated and im pretty sure the turbo would spin itself to death. Yes you can run without a DV lots of cars dont have them, no idea if you could make it work on this engine though.

The argument over whether the chattering sound (caused by the turbo still trying to compress air that isnt going anywhere as the throttle is closed, the DV gives it somewhere to go) causes harm has been around for as long as turbos I imagine. I have yet to see compelling evidence from either camp, some say their car always does it and never gives problems whereas others say it causes terrible harm and get all in a flap about it. My take on it is that so long as its not making a ridiculous noise then you will probably be fine. It might decrease the lag a bit (im guessing thats why rally cars never have DVs and chatter away all the time) but I'm pretty sure in the real world the only benefit is the cool noise.

 

[ReDBull]

Rally teams also class turbos as service items. It's not going to be very smooth to drive either with out a N75 to control the none existent wast gate. Got to be a wind up!

 

[Muttley]

Noo! That's just a myth - I've never known any turbo to go bang from the turbines spinning in the opposite direction because of now dv or wastegate. These tools are only to relieve pressure from the vacuume system, I reckon as long as removing them doesn't cause over boosting and exceeds the psi limitations of the turbo im safe!​

Aaand you forfeit any claim to credibility.

Removing N75 means your ECU no longer has any control over boost. Have you added a manual boost control to replace it?

I suppose it is just about possible that your turbo is so damaged and anemic that it is no longer capable of overboosting, especially if you have a remap.

However I think that by removing the N75 you have prevented limp mode from actually affecting the engine. I assume your CEL is on, or disabled.

When your engine blows up it will deposit a massive oil slick on the road behind you. The people who die in the ensuing pile-up will have been murdered by your disregard of basic engineering. Basic accident investigation will uncover your modifications. There is no way this can end well.

I'd like to think you've informed your insurance company of the modifications you've made. Have you?

Removing the dump valve is insignificant in comparison, all you have done is make your gearchanges take longer and to lose power while the turbo recovers. That chatter is a painful sound to anyone with any mechanical sympathy.

Haa yeah probay, 10 years from now and once I've done another 20000 miles! Like I say it would be a pretty stupid floor if the turbines could only spin 'x' amount of revolutions one way and then completely blow up if it went the other!​

If any further evidence was needed of your lack of understanding, here it is.

You're driving 2000 miles a year, so this car is obviously a "nothing under 3000 rpm dicing box" (thanks to John Passini, who made carburetion amusing ), a toy that you only take out once in a blue moon, with no understanding of how it works. That would be fine, provided you only take it out on a track day, or somewhere else where you will have no effect on the general public while you play your selfish games.