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Navigation System Updates

keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
Right, had a play with this, and I can't see anything in the 4mb partition. However, I have found something to try. Rooting some android phones needs a 'goldcard' which appears to be a card with a particular CID embedded in the partition table. I've updated an SD card in the same way, and will be trying it out when I get the car back tomorrow, I have to say I'm not too hopeful though.

Is anyone local to bolton and we can try swapping cards between cars, that should identify its the maps locked to a card or the car locked to the maps & card.
 

nokiauk

Full Member
Feb 9, 2003
513
24
Edinburgh
Just a thought is it really likely that anything is locked, if you went to a dealer to purchase a map they would just take off the shelf and you would insert the new card?

This may not be the case for downloading VW/Skoda maps and trying to get them to work I appreciate.
 

keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
Just a thought is it really likely that anything is locked, if you went to a dealer to purchase a map they would just take off the shelf and you would insert the new card?

This may not be the case for downloading VW/Skoda maps and trying to get them to work I appreciate.
I suspect you're probably right, and that the maps are locked to the CID of the card, however as we haven't had any input from someone who has bought an upgrade its difficult to be certain. If cards work in any car we can be pretty confident of it though.

If that's the case it should be evident from a diff between two cards of the smae version. I was having trouble getting the version romm uploaded to download due to internet issues last night. That should also give us an idea if the map data is somehow encrypted or if its just listed in plaintext somewhere.

There may be a way round the entire thing by using vcds to make it think its in a golf, but thats a big if.

Edit: Cybergene has already done a diff on v36, suggesting there is some protection on the card. leaving us probably with the VCDS option,
 
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sixysix

Active Member
Jan 27, 2014
343
1
London
This would be interesting if we could get this working somehow but does look like it might be something only a few might be able to do themselves but hopefully not the case.

Just wondering if there is a particular file or code in the stereo/media system itself that writes a code into the SD card when it is first installed into the car.

I have a Blackvue dash cam and every time you format the card to do a firmware update, the card is empty apart from the new firmware.
Once the SD card is installed, the device writes some files to the card including a user manual and original firmware version if firmware has not been stored manually on the SD card.

Just a thought :)
 

keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
This would be interesting if we could get this working somehow but does look like it might be something only a few might be able to do themselves but hopefully not the case.

Just wondering if there is a particular file or code in the stereo/media system itself that writes a code into the SD card when it is first installed into the car.

I have a Blackvue dash cam and every time you format the card to do a firmware update, the card is empty apart from the new firmware.
Once the SD card is installed, the device writes some files to the card including a user manual and original firmware version if firmware has not been stored manually on the SD card.

Just a thought :)
Cybergene's checks would seem to suggest thats not the case, he's established there isn't a difference between the files downloaded for the VW update and the ones on the card.

I've a block level cloned SD Card (dd if=/dev/sdb of =/dev/sdc) and one coded up using the gold card routine to try when I get the car back later.

Assuming neither of those work then its out with the cable and trying to fool it into being an audi.
 

keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
sad to report a complete lack of progress on this. the dd'd card didn't work, and theres nothing I can see in VCDS to indicate it. Even tried changing the manufacturer in central electric to vw & audi with no success.
 

niggle

Rollin' on 17s, baby!
Jan 28, 2014
461
2
Huddersfield, West Yorkshire
What was in the write-protected area? All zeros or seemingly random byte values?

I wonder if there are checksums for each of the mapping files (CRC, SHA, MD5 ?) stored in the slack space or elsewhere?

Does the 2nd copy of the FAT match the 1st exactly?

Do any files in the filesystem have the Hidden attribute?

As an aside, does the SD card need to remain in the slot permanently for the sat-nav to work or just to apply updates?
 
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nokiauk

Full Member
Feb 9, 2003
513
24
Edinburgh
I downloaded both the Skoda and VW maps from the update site, both files were the same. I copied the data from my Seat card then erased the card and copied the VW maps, when loaded it just presented an error.

Given the VW/Skoda are identical updates I can only assume the Seat SD card has extra info or something is programmed into the unit so they only accept genuine Seat data. Poor showing I think that Seat is the poor relation in regard to updates, esp as the core components are the same for VW/Skoda.
 

dw911

Active Member
Mar 30, 2013
1,038
4
What was in the write-protected area? All zeros or seemingly random byte values?

I wonder if there are checksums for each of the mapping files (CRC, SHA, MD5 ?) stored in the slack space or elsewhere?

Does the 2nd copy of the FAT match the 1st exactly?

Do any files in the filesystem have the Hidden attribute?

As an aside, does the SD card need to remain in the slot permanently for the sat-nav to work or just to apply updates?
Needs the card in all the time to work
 

keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
What was in the write-protected area? All zeros or seemingly random byte values?

I wonder if there are checksums for each of the mapping files (CRC, SHA, MD5 ?) stored in the slack space or elsewhere?

Does the 2nd copy of the FAT match the 1st exactly?

Do any files in the filesystem have the Hidden attribute?

As an aside, does the SD card need to remain in the slot permanently for the sat-nav to work or just to apply updates?
Looked random data in the 4mb partition, I couldn't read the SD card secure area as I only have usb readers.

The fat matches exactly to the best of my ability. I used dd with auto byte size onto a 16gb disk.
I haven't checked hidden or not, but as I was just testing between cards it shouldn't have changed.
 

SluggCone

Active Member
Mar 3, 2014
71
0
South England
New 14 Plate Leon

Morning,

Interesting read on here as I was questioning the dealer when I purchased my new Leon about what happens to updates.

I will be getting my new 14 plate FR Leon on Saturday and would be happy to attempt letting you all know the software that is on the satnav if anyone is interested?
 

CyberGene

Active Member
Apr 26, 2008
306
1
Sofia, Bulgaria
What you guys can do is to read your SD card CID and post it here along with map version number so that we know if the CID is personal and linked to each particular SD card copy or is shared across SD cards with particular map version.

Just for an update. I have bought an Arduino Uno and a SD shield and I'm going to order some cheap Chinese SD cards and experiment with writing CID onto them. There's a guy on the Arduino forum who has had a partial success with that. I've also bought a Raspberry Pi which is currently used as a media center for the TV but can be also of help in cracking the SD card security.
 

Andy

Active Member
Nov 12, 2013
379
0
Ayrshire, Scotland
Cid? if Container ID see below

Map Version
5F0919866F 0036 ECE 2014

CID
{1b5a87e8-db8f-97f7-a669-5940498fd154}
 
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niggle

Rollin' on 17s, baby!
Jan 28, 2014
461
2
Huddersfield, West Yorkshire
Just for an update. I have bought an Arduino Uno and a SD shield and I'm going to order some cheap Chinese SD cards and experiment with writing CID onto them. There's a guy on the Arduino forum who has had a partial success with that. I've also bought a Raspberry Pi which is currently used as a media center for the TV but can be also of help in cracking the SD card security.
Nice one! :thumbup:

I have my SD card breakout board attached to my RPi now via SPI and have started writing some C++ code to access the card. Coincidentally, the RPi appears to have a full implementation of the SD card device for the primary SD card slot, the CID and other status info is available via the /dev/mmc device. If I can work out how to chroot to a ramdisk or USB storage device it should be possible to unmount the Raspbian boot SD card and replace it with the SEAT map card for "forensic" investigation.

It would be interesting to do a binary diff of the current v36 SEAT SD card against a previous version (ignoring any differences in the NavTeq mapping data files).

Would I be correct in thinking that it has been established beyond all doubt that the v36 NavTeq map data files on the SEAT card are exactly the same as the v36 map data files that can be downloaded for VW and Skoda Sat Nav devices?
 
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yaffa0

Guest
I am from Finland and I bought the Mapcare option with my Navi System. It costs about 130 EUR here in Finland. I asked from my dealer how the update works.

So here goes:

New updates are put to the same website you guys were linking here earlier (VW/Skoda Here maps). Seat just doesn't have the pages ready yet. They have promised to open them "before summer 2014".

The smart technology behind the updates is that only the cars that bought the mapcare pack are eligible to the updates. Somehow the car's serial number (or some other unique information) is written to the card. So, even though the material is available and you can download it, it works only if you have bought it. The same goes to VW and Skoda. They just have the pages ready. Seat is coming a bit behind here.

So, you download first the update to your computer, then extract the files and copy them to the original navi SD card and then the car's navi system installs the extracted files.

If you don't have mapcare the only option is to go Seat dealer and order the update. It costs here in Finland hefty 195 EUR. And the installation of the update must be done during car maintenance as it requires VAG COM or similar unit to be connected to the car.

I hope this information helps. Sorry about my English. I am not native.
 

joker_fr

Active Member
Apr 15, 2014
17
0
Hi,
I'm form Poland - here coast update is 150 euro.
I've VCDS 12.12.0. What exactly should be modified to update worked? Please, step by step instructions.
 
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