Scary SXE Toledo problem

[teknow]

I've found out why these G28 sensors seem to cause problems when the car warms up - this is the bit I couldn't get my head around.

The sensor is basically a magnet that reads "teeth" on a cog. I believe that there is a "gap" in the teeth so that the engine can determine what position the pistons are at etc. Seems the results from this sensor may be compared by the ECU to the output of the crankshaft sensor too?

Anyhow - as the engine warms up, the sensor does too. The resistance increases as the temperature does - and effectively the magnet becomes less powerful. This means if it is on its way out or too far away from what it is monitoring then it can send intermittent/no results back to the ECU.

I've been noticing the last few mornings that my car is going into limp mode about 13 miles down the M6 toll. I live half a mile from the toll exit so my car is warming up on the M6 toll. although the engine seems warm at the point when it happens I suppose it takes a while for the sensor to "cook" before this happens.

Not sure why turning the ignition on and off should make the problem go away - maybe the ECU takes a reading from the sensor at startup to compare against? Who knows!

What I do know is it is looking more and more likely that this pesky sensor is to blame and I'm getting tempted to take the £60 gamble and change it.

 

[Martyn]

Welcome to page 3

 

[snoopdogg]

No F*#king Joy Yet..

Nope no joy yet mate got told it might be the thermo sensor switch (or something like that) so i changed it and it didnt work it's still pissing about...
get this the garage i took it to was about 38miles from mine where i used to live so i thought it would be pissing about by the time i get there so i can take them out in it and show them.....guess wot she didnt play up once on the way there not a blip in the revs so i coudnt show them the problem......the Bitch conked out 9 times on the way home...lol

You still not got yours sorted yet then teknow? iv seen the sensor hiding behind the engine mount but i havnt got a clue how to get to it without taking all the brackets and oilcooler out the way the startermotor is on the other side of it so i dont think that'll have to come off...it's a right **** to get at..allthou i have noticed the out wire has come off showing the inercores so it might be the problem.,..who knows.stay in touch with any news mate.

The £60 gammble woudnt be to much of a problem to me cos i already did a £90 one and lost its the fact of all the work changing the blasted thing or the massive bill from a garage if you get them to do it.the other thing thats getting me the sensor iv found is right behind the engine mount on the block rather than on the gearbox bell housing where the flywheel is, meaning that it looks like the sensor iv found goes into the oil so i cant see it being a magnetic one reading the teeth on the flywheel, i found the connector for it and sure enough when you unplug it while the engine is running it will stop, so once again im baffled by it............the design of this sensor is :w4nk:

 

[teknow]

No joke!

Get this .... my car has been doing this rev restricting lark for 12 months now.

I got to the point in the week where it happened at the same place on the way to work and the same place on the way out of work for about 5 days on the run.

Great! I thought ...

I was just about to order the G28 sensor when it stopped doing it. I haven't had a problem in about a week now - and I do 600 miles a week.



This is a seriously annoying problem - I had to have 2 front tyres and tracking yesterday so am now a bit skint so will wait a bit longer.

I was just about to invest in VAG-COM and a cable off eBay to do my own diagnosis.

Went to a Seat dealer and was told 90+VAT just to do basic fault finding (ie plug the car into a computer!)

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr .....

I'm the sort of bloke who buys a £8000 car brand new, enjoys the warranty for 3 years and then keeps it running for another 7 years! They don't realise that by showing no interest in my aging Ibiza that I'll go to bloody Ford next time!

Cars me off.

 

[snoopdogg]

That might be an idea....

Have you any idea how much your own diagnostic kit will set you back...i havnt even looked into it, wot would you need the actual program for the comp (is that wot VAG-COM is?) and then a lead to plug into the pc?

If there not to exspensive i might consider buying one myself as it would definately come in handy in the future.

Im the type of guy that buys cheap motors to run about in then run them into the ground, i used to like doing my own work on them but since everything is turning computerised its starting to get me stumped, iv only had a pc in the house about 7months and i still havnt got the jist of it (well this) yet...lol

I would of thought the leads should be basicaly universal so you should be able to get one from anywhere, but then again the dealers have probably put there own plugs on the end so the robbing make sure you have to go to them...

 

[teknow]

Snoop - guess what?

Went out at lunch time and it happened again!! Cursed it with my earlier post!

Difference here is that as I started the car, someone phoned me! So she was warmed up to 70 degrees (on the temp gauge anyhow) before I even moved.

In the mornings, I'm 1/2 mile from the M6 toll and once on there I wonder if the cooling effect of the freezing cold air (at the moment! brrrrr) is keeping that sensor relatively cool so the problem doesn't occur?

Only time will tell!

With regard to VAG-COM you download the software free - do a search on the web or look around these forums for the link. Buy a USB lead off eBay for a tenner.

The "shareware" sofware gives you limited functionality - idea being that you can check the lead, software etc is compatible before forking out the $99 license fee to unrestrict it. Only £50+a lead so a bargian I reckon.

If you have a laptop which I do, would mean I could drive around until the problem happened and log the error at the time.

I still remain convinced it is this sensor from the amount of reading I have done - but I am a technical idiot so don't take my word for it!

Next step is to call the dealer and get a "fixed price" quote to find out how much supply and fit of the sensor will be. I thought I read that it is a 30 minutes job somewhere ...

 

[snoopdogg]

Vag-com?..Got it

Now then chap so the good news didnt last that long then?....

Iv managed to get hold of a copy of Vag-com5041 program now all i need to do is get hold of the lead required so it'll be a ebay search for me later.

Then all i need is a laptop or a 15mile exstention lead to power my desktop.
wot the hell i'll get the exstention lead if i dont find the problem i'll certainly have fun tripping everyone up on the path as i drag the bitch along.

Sit the desktop on the bonnet and bobs your uncle...the jobs a gudun...
Anyway mate keep us informed how your getting on with yours.we'd be better off exchanging emails mate were using this as our personal forum

 

[teknow]

I think this is such a "fiddly" problem that we should post every little snippet of info here - no matter how insignificant it is. It is the lack of public info on this problem that has caused us all so much grief (and wonga) in the first place!

BTW - my car has done 74k miles and is 7 years old (nearly) for anyone reading this in the future. It is the 1.4S/.Cool.

Might be worth posting your model/age/mileage snoop for reference.

 

[teknow]

For anyone who has this sensor problem!

G28 Engine Speed Sensor = £55+VAT
Fitting @ main dealer = £62.50+VAT

Total (inc VAT) = £138.00

 

[snoopdogg]

Wheres the Diagnostics Plug?......

Has any body got a clue where the 16pin jack plug for the diagnostics is on my 98 Toledo?

Teknow iv already posted wot model year and engine faults my car is and has at the beggining of this thread when i started it up mate, but for those who are to idle to go back to page 1 iv got a 98 Toledo 2.0 SXE with a recuring problem everytime the car has been running awhile say 10miles aprox suddenly the revs will drop as if the fuel has been cut off or the power and she'll die and stop then after about 45sec to a min she'll start up and drive away as if nothing has happend, this can happen at any speed also when you slow down for roundabouts or junctions traffic lights and so on it'll do the same, iv changed the ignition odule plugs leads vaccum pipes and the thermo temp switch for the ECU (or something like that, the black and yellow switch in the thermo housing) all to no avail

The only thing i havnt changed is the knock sensor or crank sensor or wot ever sensor YOU like to call it, so thats looks like my last resort which i wouldnt hesitate to change if it wasnt such a to get to.

So i'll ask once again if anyone has any idea wot the is up with the old girl your advice would be most apreciated

Its deffinately getting to the point where im about to

 

[teknow]

Snoop - I have no idea on your Toledo but my plug is by the fuses underneath the steering wheel.

I just pull off the trim that covers the foot pedals and there it is.

My car hasn't played up now for over 700 miles (yes I do that many a week!)

Getting really hacked off with it myself mate.

 

[snoopdogg]

She's Fixed................

Hi everybody....

I'm just posting to let you all know iv finaly got the old girl fixed

After alot of time,money and effort and abit of hair loss the old girl is running like new

I sent her into a garage for the full work over to find the problem but after spending ages on the diagnostics the only thing that was showing up was a slight one off fault with the air flow meter.So i asked them to change the crank sensor and after they had they did a continuity test on the old one and when they wiggled the wire it was failing, so they cut off the outer cable and sure enough the inner wires where burnt and abit crispy

The whole bill cost me £200 that was including the sensor at £61.50 being put on a rolling road for the diagnostics several times and getting checked over for an MOT so i'm prety happy with that

Before i got the sensor changed i couldnt drive her more than 10miles before she'd cut out but yesturday i took her for the MOT and drove her over 80miles without missing a beatso i can safely say im sure she's cured.

To be honest it'll take at least a week of daily use without any problems for me to get my full confidence back in her...but things are looking good and im back on

I'll keep you all informed if i have anymore problems and i'd just like to thank everyone who has helped me with this problem

 

[Shendry]

Guy's, I ahve had my Toledo 1.8 20 v s 99 T for two years and not once has it not started or given me any problems. Here is where it gets messy.

While on a jolly in OSLO i lost my keys and put it in for a new set to be done.

On getting the car back (9 WEEKS LATER) it was ok to drive off and I was happy.

On the carriage way I noticed that the mileage had some how dropped from 82,000 to 54,000 miles. Odd......About 5 minutes later and this is no lie the engine cut out with the known clicking sounds in the dash and the battery light went on and it was dead.

few points.

1. They did not return car with remote keys just master keys but it was to go back to seat this week to programme the new ones as they ordered wrong parts.

2. They deny that this is anything to do with them and say that "these things happen

surely the mileage change is enough to confirm that something they did is afecting the car running?

What did they do in the process that could have caused these problems and what can I do about it?

Any ideas?

Cheers

Scott

 

[snoopdogg]

Guy's, I ahve had my Toledo 1.8 20 v s 99 T for two years and not once has it not started or given me any problems. Here is where it gets messy.

While on a jolly in OSLO i lost my keys and put it in for a new set to be done.

On getting the car back (9 WEEKS LATER) it was ok to drive off and I was happy.

On the carriage way I noticed that the mileage had some how dropped from 82,000 to 54,000 miles. Odd......About 5 minutes later and this is no lie the engine cut out with the known clicking sounds in the dash and the battery light went on and it was dead.

few points.

1. They did not return car with remote keys just master keys but it was to go back to seat this week to programme the new ones as they ordered wrong parts.

2. They deny that this is anything to do with them and say that "these things happen

surely the mileage change is enough to confirm that something they did is afecting the car running?

What did they do in the process that could have caused these problems and what can I do about it?

Any ideas?

Cheers

Scott

Scott to be honest it sounds like the same problem i had and i dont think the milage has anything to do with it but i tried everything ie ignition module plugs leads you name it i triedit and no joy...untill i changed the crank sensor and bingo no problems since.

Iv heard its a common problem with the Mk3 Golf aswell.

Hope this helps mate.

 

[bling145]

my mate has got a 2000 reg 1.6 toledo and his kept cutting out when he depressed the clutch comeing up to roundabouts. he was told it was a sensor (cant remeber which one) and he had it changed but it did'nt cure it. but the other week he took it to a guy who took all the throttle boddie off and cleaned it all out and that has cured it. it was all carboned up inside, not sure how this made it cut out but now its fine so must have done the trick.


steve'o

 

[Red Ibiza VR6]

Crank angle sensor is a poo to change, but its usually checkable by feling thewire going to it. They get cooked and become brittle. Wraping any exposed wires with insulation tape can prolong its life. Same problem as on the Mk3 golf 2L AGG Engine Code.