Tyres, Summer, All Season or Winter
- Thread starter andylong
- Start date
888R’s for summer and Yokohama Flava wet weather tyres. Although didn’t get round to swapping this winter.
Just do minimal mileage any way. Not a daily.
Semi slicks are ok in the wet as long as you’re sensible. Not good with standing water.
Badger5 Custom Map + TIP,
3”Custom exhaust, FMIC, Bosh 550’s, BC Coilovers, ARB’s +loads more.
Just do minimal mileage any way. Not a daily.
Semi slicks are ok in the wet as long as you’re sensible. Not good with standing water.
Badger5 Custom Map + TIP,
3”Custom exhaust, FMIC, Bosh 550’s, BC Coilovers, ARB’s +loads more.
From 2013 to 2021 I had seperate tyres for summer & winter. Last October I needed new tyres so fitted Michelin Crossclimate 2 all seasons tyres to my summer (original) 18" wheels, scrapped my winter tyres & sold my winter 17" wheels.
I've been impressed with the Michelins.
I've been impressed with the Michelins.
I changed my Ateca 4Drive to Michelin Crossclimate original before the series 2 came out. They were on the Bridgestone factory fitted ones before, 5 years of use. Snow is an issue in these parts although we seem to miss out on it a lot. Living in a village you may need to get out in an emergency or back in.
I did it since there is not much point having a 4Drive if you run on summer tyres and you want to use the 4Drive in difficult situations to best advantage and don't want to swap tyres between winter and summer. I found the original Crossclimate series generate no more cabin noise as the factory fitted Bridgestones. When I have used the Crossclimate in snow they perform well. I poured over the performance tables for a long time. At the launch of the VAG group SUVs, the choice of tyre in all season form was non existant. Subsequently manufactures started to make them.
I did it since there is not much point having a 4Drive if you run on summer tyres and you want to use the 4Drive in difficult situations to best advantage and don't want to swap tyres between winter and summer. I found the original Crossclimate series generate no more cabin noise as the factory fitted Bridgestones. When I have used the Crossclimate in snow they perform well. I poured over the performance tables for a long time. At the launch of the VAG group SUVs, the choice of tyre in all season form was non existant. Subsequently manufactures started to make them.
Around October Michelin frequently offer money back on tyres. The amount offered, up to £100, depends on the number of tyres bought & the wheel size.
I think that the ideal way to do things is to have a set of each and change wheels/tyres every 6 months roughly location dependant, but since retiring and including covid lockdown, our driving profile has changed a lot, winter tyres are at their best if "used up" over a 5 to 6 year period, Michelin Alipn/Alpin Sports seem to last for ever, which is good when your annual mileage is highish. I store our cars and obviously the "spare" wheels/tyres in the garage, so UV light is not aging them as much as it would if they were always parked outdoors.
I've had four wheel drive cars since 1991/1992 and only fitted winter tyres to my wife's two wheel drive car for the past 18 years, due to a "bad" set of weather conditions, I found that I now needed to wise up and get winter tyres for the four wheel drive car as well, so they have been fitted with winter tyres for the past 16 years.
If or when we change to being a one car couple, I think that I'll stick with having winter and summer wheels and tyres, but I can see that I'll start dumping tyres because of their age, which is where the shift to all seasons tyres idea starts to become a sensible move, that will probably mean the alloys will start to look nasty quickly though.
I've had four wheel drive cars since 1991/1992 and only fitted winter tyres to my wife's two wheel drive car for the past 18 years, due to a "bad" set of weather conditions, I found that I now needed to wise up and get winter tyres for the four wheel drive car as well, so they have been fitted with winter tyres for the past 16 years.
If or when we change to being a one car couple, I think that I'll stick with having winter and summer wheels and tyres, but I can see that I'll start dumping tyres because of their age, which is where the shift to all seasons tyres idea starts to become a sensible move, that will probably mean the alloys will start to look nasty quickly though.
I dumped my winter tyres when they were getting old & down to 3mm & fitted Michelin CC2 tyres to my summer (OEM) wheels & sold my winter wheels.
In some countries, even in the north of the UK winter and summer tyres would be ideal.
If I look at the winters in my part of the world, the southwest, snow isn't a consideration really but temperature is.
I don't spend anytime driving near the limit, my issues are more wet weather performance and low temperatures on untreated roads, so ice perhaps.
The reviews for all season tyres seem to address this and the crossclimate has a snow bonus.
It's interesting to see what people do or don't do, many of my friends and associates do nothing and run a summer tyre all year round and just cope with the lack of performance, chances are they don't know about it and don't feel it's an issue, just drive slower or somesuch.
It many cases is seems like a financial choice in combination with a lack of knowledge about how or what tyres do.
If I look at the winters in my part of the world, the southwest, snow isn't a consideration really but temperature is.
I don't spend anytime driving near the limit, my issues are more wet weather performance and low temperatures on untreated roads, so ice perhaps.
The reviews for all season tyres seem to address this and the crossclimate has a snow bonus.
It's interesting to see what people do or don't do, many of my friends and associates do nothing and run a summer tyre all year round and just cope with the lack of performance, chances are they don't know about it and don't feel it's an issue, just drive slower or somesuch.
It many cases is seems like a financial choice in combination with a lack of knowledge about how or what tyres do.
Exactly, the trigger for me, who chooses to use winter and summer tyres, is the probability of temperatures dropping to or below +4C - with the hopefully added bonus of winter tyres coping better with snow when it arrives.
In my mind, it was not always so, in my motoring lifetime, quite so clear as it is now, "tyres" have modified to give longer service, be quieter and produce less in the way of "lost energy", ie be more eco, this works/worked very well for the majority of, in our case, UK drivers, but weather conditions seem to have changed bringing more rain to the typically drier areas in winter, and along with the changed priorities concerning tyre design leaves me thinking that normal tyres have been changed to being more Summer tyres, which can and does cause some issues.
The sudden change to using winter tyres on my wife's 2002 VW Polo was prompted by her making comments about the grip or lack of it that she was experiencing with Michelin "something" - I've forgotten the name, but on checking up on the Michelin website, they seem to have been dropped from their range of tyres. These tyres, I later discovered, while being a very good warm weather tyre, were almost dangerous when used in Northern UK in winter time. This was confirmed to me when I needed to replace a pair, the tyre fitter in our local Costco said "you are not planning on using them in winter are you?" I confirmed that I had already worked that out and had winter tyres, Alpins on that car, I was just getting 2 tyres replaced while the wheels were not on that car.
I was running Michelin Primacy on my 2000 VW Passat 4Motion at that time and continued to use them without any issues even in winter, then maybe a couple of years later, changing weather meant that I had trouble driving down my driveway while staying in control, reversing up and out was still okay though, so I quickly searched out a set of Michelin Alpins, but none of the usual outlets had any stock, which did happen a lot back then in maybe 2006 or 2008, so ebay came to the rescue, luckily some silly person had tried to fit that size of winter tyre to an Audi A3 and ended up with fouling, so I bought them, and binned the Michelin Primacy, then set out looking for a set of Summer alloy wheels and fitted them with maybe Dunlops in ZR rating, so win - win.
In my mind, it was not always so, in my motoring lifetime, quite so clear as it is now, "tyres" have modified to give longer service, be quieter and produce less in the way of "lost energy", ie be more eco, this works/worked very well for the majority of, in our case, UK drivers, but weather conditions seem to have changed bringing more rain to the typically drier areas in winter, and along with the changed priorities concerning tyre design leaves me thinking that normal tyres have been changed to being more Summer tyres, which can and does cause some issues.
The sudden change to using winter tyres on my wife's 2002 VW Polo was prompted by her making comments about the grip or lack of it that she was experiencing with Michelin "something" - I've forgotten the name, but on checking up on the Michelin website, they seem to have been dropped from their range of tyres. These tyres, I later discovered, while being a very good warm weather tyre, were almost dangerous when used in Northern UK in winter time. This was confirmed to me when I needed to replace a pair, the tyre fitter in our local Costco said "you are not planning on using them in winter are you?" I confirmed that I had already worked that out and had winter tyres, Alpins on that car, I was just getting 2 tyres replaced while the wheels were not on that car.
I was running Michelin Primacy on my 2000 VW Passat 4Motion at that time and continued to use them without any issues even in winter, then maybe a couple of years later, changing weather meant that I had trouble driving down my driveway while staying in control, reversing up and out was still okay though, so I quickly searched out a set of Michelin Alpins, but none of the usual outlets had any stock, which did happen a lot back then in maybe 2006 or 2008, so ebay came to the rescue, luckily some silly person had tried to fit that size of winter tyre to an Audi A3 and ended up with fouling, so I bought them, and binned the Michelin Primacy, then set out looking for a set of Summer alloy wheels and fitted them with maybe Dunlops in ZR rating, so win - win.
Michelin now have an offer until the end of May of up to £100 off any of their tyres. Exact amount of cash back depends on number bought & wheel size. Max is on 4 tyres for 19" or larger wheels.
I think snow is a big deal, whether you get any or not, in your choice of tyre.
My neck of the woods hasn't seen snow for years, but live more north and you may see snow every year for a week or more.
So for me it's temps that matter than driving on snow.
If I had more extreme weather to deal with I'd consider winter tyres although the crossclimates get excellent reviews in snow.
Anyone who does something about it gets my vote based on their own needs.
My neck of the woods hasn't seen snow for years, but live more north and you may see snow every year for a week or more.
So for me it's temps that matter than driving on snow.
If I had more extreme weather to deal with I'd consider winter tyres although the crossclimates get excellent reviews in snow.
Anyone who does something about it gets my vote based on their own needs.
That might be the published findings, but it used to be quoted, probably from mainland Europe, that below 7C is the figure where things start to show a drop off in the case of summer tyres, I should have written +7C and not +4C, at +4C the ice warning starts alerting in cars - my error. 10C seems to be a bit high and if correct really does suggest "summer" tyres have become very much "summer only" tyres.
I was sceptical, as was the tester.
He went to facility somewhere underground where they reduced the temperature and he did handling and braking tests.
The biggest suprise for him was how poor summer tyres were in anything other than the dry, so much so that driving to the beginning of the run was scary.
I think the link is at the top of this thread and one of the reasons I posted so people can see the tests for themselves and not just hear a number.
He went to facility somewhere underground where they reduced the temperature and he did handling and braking tests.
The biggest suprise for him was how poor summer tyres were in anything other than the dry, so much so that driving to the beginning of the run was scary.
I think the link is at the top of this thread and one of the reasons I posted so people can see the tests for themselves and not just hear a number.
I've driven 400 and 500 BHP V8 monsters all year round for the past 10 years - ok, so I always had the luxury of a 4x4 when the weather was truly adverse
But...
I just drove tentatively when there was frost and ice & apart from the occasional 'twitch' all to the good.
It's very true that 'summer' tyres don't wake up till realistically the thermometer reaches double digits and certainly not till they have done some work- the first 5 mins can be 'entertaining'.
Expecting summer tyres to deliver summer performance in winter is optimistic to say the least.
What about Traction Control I hear you cry...
On a 6.0 Monaro it goes something like this "ooh ooh wait loss of traction" "er must do something" ... "ow yes I know"... "cut power" during which time driver has already corrected the rear end leaping out by a foot and applied counter steering at which point the TC works out that "traction has been re-acquired" and promptly puts the "power back online" thus engaging traction with front end is now steering towards the scenery.
Cure - turn off TC and drive within the traction limitations.
Winter tyres are Brilliant in Winter
Summer tyres perform in Summer
If you have the resources for both then that's awesome - go for it.
Michelin's CrossClimates work well for our 156 horse AWD Outlander work well but may not serve so well with higher horsepower - happy to hear from those with experience especially of the next gen CrossClimates.
As they say - Horses for Courses...
But...
I just drove tentatively when there was frost and ice & apart from the occasional 'twitch' all to the good.
It's very true that 'summer' tyres don't wake up till realistically the thermometer reaches double digits and certainly not till they have done some work- the first 5 mins can be 'entertaining'.
Expecting summer tyres to deliver summer performance in winter is optimistic to say the least.
What about Traction Control I hear you cry...
On a 6.0 Monaro it goes something like this "ooh ooh wait loss of traction" "er must do something" ... "ow yes I know"... "cut power" during which time driver has already corrected the rear end leaping out by a foot and applied counter steering at which point the TC works out that "traction has been re-acquired" and promptly puts the "power back online" thus engaging traction with front end is now steering towards the scenery.
Cure - turn off TC and drive within the traction limitations.
Winter tyres are Brilliant in Winter
Summer tyres perform in Summer
If you have the resources for both then that's awesome - go for it.
Michelin's CrossClimates work well for our 156 horse AWD Outlander work well but may not serve so well with higher horsepower - happy to hear from those with experience especially of the next gen CrossClimates.
As they say - Horses for Courses...
Yes ofcourse it is horses for courses.
The main advantage of winter and otherwise appropriate tyres is stopping and steering, ofcourse you need to be able to go in the first place.
I fondly recall back in 2002 going to the movies in my brand new Africa twin and coming out to find it had snowed for 2 hrs.
Surely the most bum clenching ride of my life.
The large block tyres worked well and I can only imagine the ride if I was on my fz600 with those barely treaded road tyres.
The main advantage of winter and otherwise appropriate tyres is stopping and steering, ofcourse you need to be able to go in the first place.
I fondly recall back in 2002 going to the movies in my brand new Africa twin and coming out to find it had snowed for 2 hrs.
Surely the most bum clenching ride of my life.
The large block tyres worked well and I can only imagine the ride if I was on my fz600 with those barely treaded road tyres.
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