improving turn in/front end traction????

[cap r 225]

alright guys, just after a bit of advice!

looking to improve the understeer on my car! (lcr225)
I'm trying to improve things as and when i find a weak point instead of the usual re-map route!
After a rather spirited ride out tonight i found that the car was pushing it's nose wide massivly through corners when i pushed it, it was wet but i'm pretty sure i'm having the same problem in the dry, just not to the same extreme's.

ideally i'm after sharper turn in and better grip on accelaration out of corners, any ideas? Would an upper strut brace on the front help this

i should mention my car is in standard form

 

[DannyC87]

Yeh a strut brace will help with front-end rigidity making the geometry of the suspension stay as it was designed, rather than changing due to chassis flex. Adding a rear arb will help a lot as the ratio of front-rear arb thickness will change from front biased to rear biased increasing the tendency to lift off oversteer, and reduce understeer

 

[cap r 225]

cheers danny, it's gota be one of the two hasn't it. i wasn't sure if the rearARB would just make the back end oversteer? this is easier to control but how does it improve front end grip?

am i right in saying the S3 strut brace is cheapest from the stealers?

 

[DannyC87]

cheers danny, it's gota be one of the two hasn't it. i wasn't sure if the rearARB would just make the back end oversteer? this is easier to control but how does it improve front end grip?

It is more that is back end is tightened up more willing to follow the front, rather than try and send the car straight on; hard to explain tbh! try and get a ride in a car with an aftermarket rear arb fitted and you will notice the difference!!

 

[cap r 225]

i get what you mean mate, so the understeer comes from the reluctant rear as aposed to the lack of front end grip! i'm gona start searching prices for both the above now anyway, thanks buddy

 

[ArosaRacer]

S3 front upper brace and thicker anti roll bar will solve this add the rear and the car feels so much better

 

[james walker]

add tt wishbone bushes, rear arb, s3 upper brace new topmount bushes and a decent shock spring setup... combine with 4 wheel alignment and you will be happy mate... front arb on the lcr makes a huge difference also. r32 model seems to be favourite at the minute

add good tyres to this... f1 assymetrics, falken 452 etc etc.

 

[Willie]

It is more that is back end is tightened up more willing to follow the front, rather than try and send the car straight on; hard to explain tbh! try and get a ride in a car with an aftermarket rear arb fitted and you will notice the difference!!

this is what I wanted out of the SCN National meet, allow people to get a drive in other cars to feel the difference.
Missed opperunity

 

[225]

What tyres have you got on the front?

 

[cap r 225]

S3 front upper brace and thicker anti roll bar will solve this add the rear and the car feels so much better

when you say a thicker ARB mate do mean uprate the front aswell as adding the rear one? or did you mean add a rear strut brace along with an ARB on the rear? i thought the front arb on the lcr was pretty good as standard?(purely going on what i read)

add tt wishbone bushes, rear arb, s3 upper brace new topmount bushes and a decent shock spring setup... combine with 4 wheel alignment and you will be happy mate... front arb on the lcr makes a huge difference also. r32 model seems to be favourite at the minute

add good tyres to this... f1 assymetrics, falken 452 etc etc.

this would be a great set up james but unfortunatly i don't have a grand to spend all at once at the mo! also... are you recommending i uprate the front ARB aswell james? as above i thought adding the rear alone was substantial?

What tyres have you got on the front?

i'll be changing the tyres soon'ish. i'm not even going to say what are on at the moment!

 

[lordgibbness]

I think you already answered these questions yourself reading other threads, but to answer the ARB question, a rear one will make a big difference, but to keep things in proportion you'd need to upgrade the front ARB too. LCR front is only 18mm compared to LC 23mm.

I'd keep things simple and do little by little as you say in the first post: upper strut and dbm are good starting mods. James has a slightly different starting point (being an LC) so I wouldn't be changing bushes in your case...

 

[james walker]

when you say a thicker ARB mate do mean uprate the front aswell as adding the rear one? or did you mean add a rear strut brace along with an ARB on the rear? i thought the front arb on the lcr was pretty good as standard?(purely going on what i read)



this would be a great set up james but unfortunatly i don't have a grand to spend all at once at the mo! also... are you recommending i uprate the front ARB aswell james? as above i thought adding the rear alone was substantial?


front arb on lcr worth it, not so much so on lc...

lcr front arb is 18mm iirc, lc is 23mm.

add rear arb, s3 upper and lower, tt wishbone bushes, new top mounts.... should come in at circa £240

then new tyres on the rears only if you dont wanna do all four £130 for pair of falken 452s

4 wheel alignment around 60quid

great setup with standard shocks, uprate standards for better handling.

 

[Fl@pper]

check your tyre pressures to see what they are 'after a quick drive' to see

try a balanced front to rear as most are usually higher front

then try a higher rear by 3 or 4

doesn't take long to change and test

 

[james walker]

I think you already answered these questions yourself reading other threads, but to answer the ARB question, a rear one will make a big difference, but to keep things in proportion you'd need to upgrade the front ARB too. LCR front is only 18mm compared to LC 23mm.

I'd keep things simple and do little by little as you say in the first post: upper strut and dbm are good starting mods. James has a slightly different starting point (being an LC) so I wouldn't be changing bushes in your case...

tt bushes massive upgrade on oem lcr aswell as lc mate.

renewing top mounts also a benefit and cheap mod. maybe even go track density top mounts, as i will be doing when decide on my next suspension swap.

 

[lordgibbness]

I would have thought that the LCR bushes are pretty much on a par with the TT/S3/R32 etc. already? I've never felt the bushes weren't up to their job at least?

Regarding tyre pressures, you'll probably be 33psi all round, so to increase traction at the front you could drop by 2psi or so on front tyres only to see if that improves. Worth using a good tyre pressure guage to test this (not a petrol station).

 

[james walker]

tt wishbone bushes are an upgrade over stock lcr wishbone bushes.. the rear that it, front wishbone bush oem standard only. tt bush is more solid than the rubber lc and lcr bush.

 

[lordgibbness]

Mmm okay, not sure it would really offer that much for me. You could always go for poly bushes all round if you want stiffer...

 

[james walker]

why not for you... look at willies thread, he has them, i have them... other do aswell.

worthwhile mod mate.. trust me

 

[Willie]

when you say a thicker ARB mate do mean uprate the front aswell as adding the rear one? or did you mean add a rear strut brace along with an ARB on the rear? i thought the front arb on the lcr was pretty good as standard?(purely going on what i read)



this would be a great set up james but unfortunatly i don't have a grand to spend all at once at the mo! also... are you recommending i uprate the front ARB aswell james? as above i thought adding the rear alone was substantial?


front arb on lcr worth it, not so much so on lc...

lcr front arb is 18mm iirc, lc is 23mm.

add rear arb, s3 upper and lower, tt wishbone bushes, new top mounts.... should come in at circa £240

then new tyres on the rears only if you dont wanna do all four £130 for pair of falken 452s

4 wheel alignment around 60quid

great setup with standard shocks, uprate standards for better handling.

James remember the LC is 23mm but in the position it's in compared to the LCR, the 23mm one is less effective than the 18mm LCR one

 

[lordgibbness]

why not for you... look at willies thread, he has them, i have them... other do aswell.

worthwhile mod mate.. trust me

I don't really mod for the sake of it - only when I find a genuine issue that I want to improve.