LMAO! You just couldn't resist,could you?
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2012 Facelift
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LMAO! You just couldn't resist,could you?
***** Sent from my Motorola Defy using Tapatalk. *****
LMAO! You just couldn't resist,could you?
***** Sent from my Motorola Defy using Tapatalk. *****
I don't think its a big problem with allowing smaller engines get the FR badging. Its only really the equivalent to GT for a VW or S-Line for an Audi. The proper hot hatches will remain Cupras. The 105PS 1.2 TSI and 1.6 TDI units are hardly underpowered for a supermini and offer 'warm' performance IMO.
I would definitely consider one, and they'll probably prove to be fairly popular.
I would definitely consider one, and they'll probably prove to be fairly popular.
Not really. IMO the current SEAT range kind of goes like this; the Cupra is like the Audi RS, the FR is like the S and the Sportrider is like the S-Line. Making all the lower powered cars with an FR bodykit called FR absolutely dilutes the FR brand to the point where it means little and I wouldn't be prepared to pay a premium for it.
The FR dilution began with the Leon and as I predicted it has now spread to the Ibiza. Sadly the marketing people don't really understand what people want from a sporty range.
Can you imagine if Audi made an S3 with a 1.6TSi as well as the 2.0 and it looked the same, how much that would damage the S badge. They don't do this and if you want nice looks with less power you get the S-Line.
It's a real shame as the FR brand was getting some recognition/identitiy and now they chose to ruin it.
![[:@]](/forums/styles/seatcupra/oldforumsmileys/furious.gif "Furious [:@]")
i'm on my 2nd FR Ibiza but doubt I'll get another. Will likely choose another manufacturer who hasn't ruined the warm hatch branding.
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You could argue that a RS is more like a Cupra R, the S would then align with the Cupra and the FR then matches up with the S Line. I appreciate the current Ibiza range does not include a Cupra R but likewise the Audi RS model doesn't cover the whole range.
I wouldn't advocate putting the 70BHP 3 cylinder engine into a FR but I think the 1.2 Tsi and 1.6 CR Tdi would complement the current range.
We all have a perception of what the FR badge stands for; to me it is simply a styling/trim level as is the S Line. So why not give the range a few more engines, so it appeals to a wider audience.
Ultimately Seat are a volume car manufactured and if adding more engines to the FR range is as a way of attracting more sales, then for them it is a good move.
Just my opinion folks, I appreciate there are quite a few who will disagree with me! Ultimately the decision lies with Seat though, so whatever we on the forum think it probably won’t make much difference anyway.
Well look at it this way. So far the only people that think that lower powered FRs are a good idea are the people that don't have a FR presently and drive lower specified models (no offence intended) and the folk that currently drive FRs unamiously will not be buying another one because of Seat's decision to dilute the brand.
What this seems to be saying (and I know this is not scientific analysis) is that all the folk that would buy the higher powered FRs will abandon the brand, leavng most facelift FRs you see around being 1.2TSI and 1.6TDI owners in nippy (but hardly quick) cars. I would not be wanting to drive around in a new 2.0TDI or 1.4TSI FR and have folk just assume that it was a 1.2TSI or 1,6TDI and therefore not that fast. There was up till now a cerrtain exclusivity and pride of ownership that went with the FR badge - it meant a car that was quick. No longer will seeing a FR badge indicate this... This is a sad loss and will put many enthuasiasts off. I still don't see why Seat couldn't stick all the FR kit in the lower powered Ibizas and christen them Sportriders, and keep the FR badge for the 1.4TSI and 2.0TDI engines. After all it's only the price of changing a badge!
What this seems to be saying (and I know this is not scientific analysis) is that all the folk that would buy the higher powered FRs will abandon the brand, leavng most facelift FRs you see around being 1.2TSI and 1.6TDI owners in nippy (but hardly quick) cars. I would not be wanting to drive around in a new 2.0TDI or 1.4TSI FR and have folk just assume that it was a 1.2TSI or 1,6TDI and therefore not that fast. There was up till now a cerrtain exclusivity and pride of ownership that went with the FR badge - it meant a car that was quick. No longer will seeing a FR badge indicate this... This is a sad loss and will put many enthuasiasts off. I still don't see why Seat couldn't stick all the FR kit in the lower powered Ibizas and christen them Sportriders, and keep the FR badge for the 1.4TSI and 2.0TDI engines. After all it's only the price of changing a badge!
I'm with you on that.
Look what happended when Vauxhall did the same thing with the SRi badge. Now it's not even regarded as sporty as they do it with low powered engines, I even had a feeble astra SRi 1.6 hire car last year. People who want the exclusivity will only have the Cupra option.
I might get a 2.0TDI for the back of mine, ready for when the pseudo FR's arrive at dealers.Andyf said:
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Energizer
Guest
How fast is Fr, something around 8 sec 0-100? When I read your post it would seems like its at least 2x faster then 1.2 tsi and not less then 2 sec. I agree with this new way of naming things and leave Cupra as high end.
So basically you're saying that you didn't bought your car because of nice looks, good performance and things like that, you bought it because you want to show people the badge at back of the car? Sorry but when I buy the car I buy it for myself and want to be happy with it and don't care what other people think of it.
Yeah but SEAT say this about the FR
and
And you think SEAT aren't trying to sell these based on the badge and engine choices? lol @ you.
Energizer
Guest
I personally don't care if there's badge at back or not. I like facelifted sport model, and don't like regular one. If I had 1.2 FR I wouldn't care about the badge, if I had 1.4 I wouldn't care about the badge, if I.... you get the point. I care about the car and enjoy in it and not what would people think about me when I drive by.
I personally don't care if there's badge at back or not. I like facelifted sport model, and don't like regular one. If I had 1.2 FR I wouldn't care about the badge, if I had 1.4 I wouldn't care about the badge, if I.... you get the point. I care about the car and enjoy in it and not what would people think about me when I drive by.
The point i was trying to make was that SEAT care about the badge and their marketing suggest that they want you (the customer) to car about the badge.
Back in the real world, no one ever buys a car based on badge alone, there has to be other merits; looks, performance, price etc
Selmir
Guest
It looks sweet, but I hope it will be somewhat tuning-friendly when changing stuff in the engineroom
Good god, Im totally agreeing with you again!
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Good god, Im totally agreeing with you again!
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Group buy - 2.0TDi badges anyone ? - haha
So you reckon an improvement of 2 secs, 0-100kph isn't significant? I can assure you that you'll definitely feel the difference! I've driven the 1.2TSI Sportrider and (great car that it is) and it is totally outgunned by the FR TDI as far as power and acceleration goes. I was very seriously considering buying a brand new 1.2TSI Sportrider until I got a test drive of a one year old FR TDI and was so impressed by the performance that I bought the 1 year old FR instead.
No your perception is wrong. I bought the car mostly on the basis of the strong engine performance, handling, economy, good level of standard kit and the sporty look. And is it that wrong for me wanting to advertise that I bought a car with such excellent attributes by having a FR badge on the tailgate??? Is this vain? Perhaps, but obviously a heck of a lot of people think the same way if you look at the marketing blurb highlighted by @NathWraith. People want to feel like they've made the right choice and want to show others on the road this - especially if the cars are highly-specced. Human nature for the most part, mate!
Going by your logic why bother to have model designations at all? Just call the car an Ibiza and people have to just specify the specification level when ordering. Don't bother putting badges other than "Ibiza" on the car, be it a 180PS flying machine or a 60PS entry level machine. If Seat could get away with that they probably would and save money on badge production. However Seat and other car manufacturers know marketing and also human nature. If people buy a good car, part of them wants to show this to others – especially if they are car enthusiasts.
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