MK5 SEAT Ibiza heating issue

[jamesyboyjim]

Hi all, drove to work today in the miserable rain and with the ac on quite low and felt a little chilly, decided to try and put some warm on, hmm, just cold air still... Engine had been on sufficient amount of time to be warmed up so I cranked the heating and fans to max but only blew cold air for my whole 15 mile commute.

I parked up at work and left the engine and heating running to see if it would warm up without the car moving as my last car had a failed thermostat that was stuck open but it continued to blow cold.

Any ideas what i can check first? I'm hoping its not going to be expensive!

Its a 2010 mk5 ibiza 1.4se (it doesn't have climate control just the standard heating and ac)

 

[RUM4MO]

I would guess that the temperature control flap motor assembly is causing this problem. I've assumed that you have checked the coolant level and that the radiator and pipes are at least getting warm. One thing to try to get some life out of that flap motor - try demanding Low, wait for a minute, demand High, wait for a minute - and repeat that 9 times. Doing that might just clean/clear the positional feedback track enough for the system to start working again, if not it could be time to replace that motor assembly. By the way, these flap motors have been failing in all VAG cars for maybe the past 15 years, some people stay lucky, some don't.

 

[jamesyboyjim]

I would guess that the temperature control flap motor assembly is causing this problem. I've assumed that you have checked the coolant level and that the radiator and pipes are at least getting warm. One thing to try to get some life out of that flap motor - try demanding Low, wait for a minute, demand High, wait for a minute - and repeat that 9 times. Doing that might just clean/clear the positional feedback track enough for the system to start working again, if not it could be time to replace that motor assembly. By the way, these flap motors have been failing in all VAG cars for maybe the past 15 years, some people stay lucky, some don't.

I'll give that a try, thanks. Hoping its not the motor assembly though as i expect that'll b expensive to resolve.

 

[RUM4MO]

I have not checked where that motor is in a 6L Ibiza, but I did manage to replace one on my old VW Passat 4Motion, it was awkward but it helps if you have smaller hands, so I was okay there! Motors used to sell for around £100 but if you can fit it yourself it should save lots of money, if the new one does not work too well, you might have to find someone to perform "basic settings" on them all as that allows the AC controller to find the Lo and Hi end stop voltages and store them.

Edit:- one thing, if you scan that car with a VAG fully compliant scan tool, it will reveal all stored fault codes, which should include any AC controller faults - maybe get that done first.

 

[jamesyboyjim]

I have not checked where that motor is in a 6L Ibiza, but I did manage to replace one on my old VW Passat 4Motion, it was awkward but it helps if you have smaller hands, so I was okay there! Motors used to sell for around £100 but if you can fit it yourself it should save lots of money, if the new one does not work too well, you might have to find someone to perform "basic settings" on them all as that allows the AC controller to find the Lo and Hi end stop voltages and store them.

Edit:- one thing, if you scan that car with a VAG fully compliant scan tool, it will reveal all stored fault codes, which should include any AC controller faults - maybe get that done first.

Annoyingly it looks like I'll have to take it to a garage to diagnose!

 

[jamesyboyjim]

Well, thought I'd go have a look on my lunch break, noticed the header tank looked emptier than it did earlier so took the cap off, noticed it practically empty and also noticed a lot of liquid quickly dripping out the bottom of the car (guessing i released the pressure).

Luckily there's a garage just across the road so its currently sat there while they have a look. Any ideas what it could be? The water pump is only a year old so that would be unlucky if that's failed. Awaiting the dreaded phone call...

 

[jamesyboyjim]

Local garage (admittedly halfords) say its the waterpump. They want to change the cambelt and pump for £600. I said the belt and pump are only a year / 8,000 miles old. Can you not just change the pump, he said no he wont do just the water pump in case it puts the belt at risk. I think I'll have to top the car up with water and drive the 15 miles home sensibly and try and get a second opinion. what do you guys think?

 

[RUM4MO]

Okay, find out what the menu price to replace a cambelt and water pump is at your local SEAT dealer, and/or find a proper VAG indie and get a price from them.

I agree with Halfords, there just is no mileage on taking these things to bits and skimping on the price of a new cambelt kit while it is in bits.

Where/who did the repair a year ago, I'd be chasing them or at least naming and shaming them!

Really I don't understand why SEAT don't fit temperature gauges to all their cars as you would have noticed that something was wrong earlier, as would you if you checked your levels weekly!

 

[jamesyboyjim]

Well I topped the car right up then attempted the drive home, on the way I wasn't sure if my mind was playing tricks but thought I could smell a hot smell, then noticed a bit of smoke coming from under the bonnet so pulled over, engine off, call the AA.

The AA guy topped me right up again and off I went to a local garage where the car currently is. It's going to have a new pump and belt fitted and they are going to inspect the car for heat damage. Really wish these cars had a temp gauge, what a strange decision by seat not to include one. Would have helped me out for sure but it is what it is I guess.

I should have played it safe and topped up every few miles so that's my fault but hopefully it'll be ok. Just nervously waiting the call from the garage.

As for checking levels it was only when I checked the car at work did most of the coolant pour out of the bottom of the car. So it must have failed as I started the car that morning or on the way. Or so I hope.

The garage that did the work roughly a year ago were called the car concierge in chertsey. Apparently now ceased trading so I have no one to take the warranty up with annoyingly.

 

[RUM4MO]

Oh bother! My local SEAT dealer shut up shop while I was trying to get them to get to the root source of a problem that it seemed they had failed to solve, but had charged my for, so even the proper places sometimes close - in that case, they were sitting on a gold mine of land for redevelopment so the group plugged the plug on that operation and turned it into ready cash!

I don't know about SEAT, but newer Skodas without temperature gauges get fitted with two coolant lights, a blue one which lights until the engine is up to temperature, and a red one which lights when the engine is too hot.

Remember, if that coolant quickly leaves that car, the temperature gauge might just quickly drop in temperature so unless you were keeping an eye on things you might have missed seeing a high temperature reading - if a gauge was fitted. It is always a worry for me when I drove that late 2009 Ibiza!

 

[jamesyboyjim]

Garage is saying new pump and belt on but the engine is not heating and failing a gas test? They say it's a head gasket problem and it'll need to be stripped etc and will cost at least 1200!! I said it's been fine and drove to the garage ok once it had more water but they are saying it's failing our gas test? Not entirely sure what that is. Gas either in the coolant tank or gasket?

He's going to leave the car to settle put some more water in and call me Monday after another look. It's hard to know what to believe when you aren't the most knowledgeable about cars. I'm in a state of shock right now as I don't know what to do

 

[RUM4MO]

Hum, not good, I'm guessing that this leaking water problem has been going on for longer than you are admitting? These engines have an aluminium alloy cylinder head which I'd reckon has not liked this treatment at all!

 

[jamesyboyjim]

Hum, not good, I'm guessing that this leaking water problem has been going on for longer than you are admitting? These engines have an aluminium alloy cylinder head which I'd reckon has not liked this treatment at all!

Definitely only happened Friday - that I know of! Perhaps driving it home Friday evening is what's cooked it

 

[jamesyboyjim]

Well, potentially some good news.

After speaking to the garage again they've been playing with my car and are now saying everything seems OK, engine is reaching temp, pressure is good and the heaters are working again. only thing he's said he hasn't seen pass is the chemical test but that he hasn't actually tried it again today.

Now whether there was air in the system that hadn't left when they first tested or not I don't know (someone has suggested this could be the cause) or whether they were trying their luck and me saying "I cant afford it" had anything to do with it I don't know (hope not) but as it stands, the car is alive and can be collected, they just advised I might not be out of the woods and to keep an eye on the water levels for the next two weeks. So fingers crossed

 

[RUM4MO]

Ah, that sounds a bit more sensible an outcome, keep us posted.

 

[RUM4MO]

I have just remembered that these, at least the 1.4 16V 86PS engines can be a bit tricky to bleed the air out off after you have lost a lot of water, the normal suggestion is to remove the engine coolant temperature sensor, while that is out refill the system with pre fixed coolant and when the coolant flows freely without bubbles from where the coolant temperature sensor is located, refit that sensor while coolant is flowing from it, then continue refilling up to the correct level on the header tank.

I certainly had trouble with getting consistent heating after replacing that sensor with a new one and losing a lot of coolant while doing that - and doing as I've suggested above sorted it out right away.

 

[jamesyboyjim]

I have just remembered that these, at least the 1.4 16V 86PS engines can be a bit tricky to bleed the air out off after you have lost a lot of water, the normal suggestion is to remove the engine coolant temperature sensor, while that is out refill the system with pre fixed coolant and when the coolant flows freely without bubbles from where the coolant temperature sensor is located, refit that sensor while coolant is flowing from it, then continue refilling up to the correct level on the header tank.

I certainly had trouble with getting consistent heating after replacing that sensor with a new one and losing a lot of coolant while doing that - and doing as I've suggested above sorted it out right away.

Thank you. I'll keep this in mind in case it starts misbehaving. Had a nice smooth 15 mile drive in this morning though, so I'm keeping everything crossed! What a tough little engine this is turning out to be! (he says )

 

[RUM4MO]

I'd think that is the end of your problems as far as the engine etc is concerned, enjoy!

Edit:- most cars do get designed with a self purging ability built into their cooling systems, that prescribed method of getting rid of trapped air after the coolant system has been opened up with this engine, proves that there is always an exception to the sensible rules!

Another Edit:- I would never have found out that this could be an issue if I had not accidentally put myself into the situation where I needed to find out why I could not get heating restored after opening up that cooling system.