Altea Handbrake Problem

[12string]

Hi to everyone first of all as I am new to the forum.
I am on my third Seat Leon having had a 180 Cupra then a 150TDI with the Cupra R kit and now have the new 170TDi FR.
My other half has an Altea 1.9TDI Reference which is 15 months old and we both like the Seat cars.
Her daughter was looking for a bigger car as she has 3 year old twins and she bought a 1.9TDi Altea brand new on Aug 1st this year.

However after about 4 weeks she was dropping her daughters at nursery one morning and got out with the engine running but the handbrake securely on to get the first child out. As she leant in the open back door she heard a loud "ping" and the car started to roll back. She had to jump in the back and reach forward between the seats to pull the handbrake lever which had slipped down from where it was when she got out. The door unfortunately caught on a fence post and pulled the door past 90 degrees and basically the door is knackered.
The AA came out and forced the door closed as she couldn't get it to close. She took it to the dealer straight away and they took it out but could find nothing wrong. It was reported to Seat head office who requested a brake efficiency test to be carried out.
The result from this is apparently the handbrake is working at 25% and they would only do something if it is 16% or less.
Worryingly the handbrake lever has slipped again while it was parked in a car park, at least this time it was on flat ground and the car was in gear so it didn't roll anywhere.

Has anyone had a similar issue ?

She now faces a repair through her insurance which for a 4 week old car (when it happened anyway) is a bit rough.
The dealer even quoted the Highway Code to her saying the car should have the engine switched off and left in gear.

Elliot Grieve

 

[Tell]

hmmm ah well perhaps this is another one where us DSG owners smile since P should be fine for us I reckon.

Seems like bad news. I haven't had any problems with the handbrake as such, back discs yes having to be changed and the dealer reckoning that wasn't a warranty repair which I would say it was at 10,000 miles.

 

[_Steve]

i've had a Jaguar X-type, and a Focus 2 roll down the company car park because of handbrakes failing, but these were after a period of time - ie the rear discs cooled and contracted slightly, reducing pad pressure and letting the cars roll.

I've got the DSG box so can't offer Seat Altea specific reply, however the couple of times i've had to stop the car to shut the boot after noticing the "boot not shut properly light" on the dash the auto-lock feature has caught me out meaning having to remember to press the unlock switch near the handbrake to release the central locking in order to lift and re-shut the boot. After this i always take the keys out of the car with me, especially after hearing about chance car-jackings where kids would jump in cars at the slightest opportunity. With kids still in the car i'd certainly never leave it running without me sat in the drivers seat.

With the other cars we sent them away for inspection, and they all came back with no fault found - jag damage was bumper nudge - no cost, the focus ran backwards down a hill for 100 metres, snapped a rear suspension arm as the wheel mounted a kerb, and damaged the rear arch/bumper and door - cost about £1600 to put right. Both garages involved said the handbrake cable was at correct adjustment, but i did issue a memo to the fleet drivers to ensure handbrakes were at least 3 clicks engaged, and cars left parked in gear.

Sorry i can't offer any real help.

 

[Tell]

On the tailgate Steve that is sort of a common problem of not wacking it hard enough using the internal handle, on the right. You can tell whether it's shut by either looking at the edge around the lights or just feeling the edge, you don't need to get into the car to check the door warning . You can also tell by what it sounds like when you shut it. You just have to remember to do these things...

 

[D3DNA]

On a modern car the handbrake should be a 85% effective in keeping a car stationery on a flat or uneven ground. If it doesn't do this their is 2 means in which it has failed, a user error or mechanical fault. For a 4 week old car to have the handbrake fail twice is a worry. Complain to Seat customer services stating that your other halfs daughter isn't happy with the mechanical reliability of one of their vehicles and could be A ) another accident waiting to happen and B ) potentially maim or kill someone. With a report of a 25% effectiveness on the handbrake test then the courts should see you in favor. A handbrake should be at least 85% effective on an incline.

Just to say to you other halfs daughter, park the car with it in gear and the wheel turned so that if it did happen it would swing towards the kerb. Just in case.

 

[12string]

Having now seen the report the braking system is 85% but it is the parking brake that is 25%.

I have now got the dealer to take a look at the ratchet mechanism for the handbrake as I believe this is where the problem lies since it is the handbrake lever that has dropped from its original position while the car as been stationary twice.

Hopefully they will find something.

 

[Tell]

For what it's worth I've been googling parking break efficiency to see what the standards are, 85 percent, 25 percent ??? etc.

Found this table:

http://www.ukmot.com/3-10.asp

25 percent seems to be the magic MOT figure which is why they quoted that back at you.

Bit more detail:

http://www.ukmot.com/3-7.asp

The Google:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=e...d=1&q=hand+braking+efficiency+percent&spell=1

Albeit you might have rachet problems, you know I still come across people when walking down the road who insist on yanking the hand break up so it goes click, click, click rather than pushing the button and pulling up, which is a no - no in driving terms.

 

[_Steve]

On the tailgate Steve that is sort of a common problem of not wacking it hard enough using the internal handle, on the right. You can tell whether it's shut by either looking at the edge around the lights or just feeling the edge, you don't need to get into the car to check the door warning . You can also tell by what it sounds like when you shut it. You just have to remember to do these things...

The problem with the bootlid is down to a dent master removal of the trim to remove a ding from the metal - somehow the re-fitted trim is pressing differently on the boot surround - i'll get round to fixing it soon. in the meantime i just have to put a few extra kgs into lowering the tailgate.

As for applying the handbrake i would much prefer my drivers to click click click the handbrake on each and every time to ensure that they are not leaving the car with the handbrake only engaged with one tooth of the ratchet locking mechanism. If you press the button in to lift the handbrake, get a feel of the tension in the cable, and then let go of the handbrake button there's a strong chance the drivers will release the tension on the cable as they let go of the button and so lightly lower the handbrake. Or they let go of the button when the handbrake is only 1 click engaged, but having not heard any clicks they will be unaware the ratchet is only /just/ engaged. So click click click it is for my 50 drivers, and fingers crossed since sending them the memo last year i've had no roll-aways

 

[Tell]

Well I seem to recall Steve that clicking the handbrake is what does it in, that was from my BSM days of driving lessons and he was an ex paratrooper, so I trusted his aggressive motoring style and instruction that I was taught . The ratchet holds it, the clicks are not there as a warning sign they are the noise that it makes naturally.

Basically you know when someone has put the break on too hard since you have to pull harder to get it off. It's all done by feel and my car has never run away and I don't click the ratchet . There could be correlation. Ratchet clicking of handbrakes is considered unprofessional way of driving.... this sites does not have a vote menu .

The tailgate, yes you can move the bar that the lock goes into as on all the doors, but I haven't got around to doing it. I know I simulated with my brother what the problem was with the tailgate by fooling the lock that we were closing it. Basically the rubber as you say is holding the door out [in your case] in my case it's always needed a good wack. I was leaving it on the basis that the rubber might give way, but wacking it, is easier enough.

 

[_Steve]

I can see how you think that a ratchet clicking would make it wear, but that's simply not the case, otherwise ratchet spanners would be worn out so quickly

In the graphic above the handbrake in both cases could have been applied with the button depressed, without the driver knowing which situation the ratchet has been left in - A or B.

With application of the handbrake without the button the driver will know if he/she has left the brake in postion A or position B by means of the clicks the ratchet makes.

I'd be far happier knowing that my handbrake was 3 clicks engaged rather than just 1 click

 

[robint]

Not sure I've ever heard of anybody replacing a handbrake because the ratchet is worn - cables, pivots etc etc yes but not the ratchet. Suspect the real reason that instructors say don't use it is to have a quieter life as the only people who regularly use the handbrake are learners........

 

[aceman]

I have had my handbrake drop off a notch occasionally but only one notch and always straight away after me applying the brake hence I have always put it down to me not positioning it quite correctly because I depress the button when pulling up the lever so I don't know exactly when it is seated correctly. It does go with quite a ping though but has never released fully hence I do not see it as a problem only a self induced nuisance.

I go with the majority of comments and leave my car in gear but I would also not expect the ratchet mechanism to fail in such a manner that it is obviously unsafe and would expect some sort of recompence from SEAT.

 

[Tell]

This threads rapidly turning into a does size really matter with respect to listening to clicks on the ratchet, I've been driving now for 23 years and can safely say I never listen to clicks, knowingly put it one click or two clicks up or down and it's never rolled except when front ended at 50 MPH when parked. I do gring my teeth at drivers that insist on pulling the hand breaks up with noisy clicks knowing that they haven't been taught too drive correctly and I'd suggest that cars that roll might be because the hand brakes needs re-tensioning for those number of clicks [it is a service requirment to retension] and that one or two clicks just isn't enough !. Best to pull it up till it feels about right and size does matter, yes....

 

[NICK..MIZEN]

This happend to me today luckilly a tree stopped it instead of a wall ..The car actually ended up in the M.d's space .... He was even unhappier than me ..

 

[12string]

The dealer say that they can find no fault with the ratchet mechanism either and neither they nor Seat head office are interested in doing anything further.

I must admit that I have never had anything like this happen to me wiath any of my cars but there is something strange going on with this Altea's handbrake.