Limp mode during test drive - should i run away?

[locky]

you aren't dealing with SEAT though, the FIAT garage is

SEAT could just tell FIAT any old sh1te and they'd believe it.

All they will do is scan it for faults. If the DPF is 90% clogged, will that show up as a fault? Will they even investigate it? the car is in for EGR replacement, wouldnt surprise me if they didnt check anything else



4k a year in a diesel is stupildy low, so I think that its just been used to do the school run and to the shops at the weekend.


so you did 1k miles in the rest of the year? I wouldnt even entertain having a diesel for doing 10,000 miles a year

I think you are making more assumptions than me

I was just pointing out that last year, I did 4x 900 mile trips and a total of 5k. Usually I am putting on over 10k. It used to be more when I didnt live within walking distance of work and did 20 miles each day.

Are you saying that not driving a CR170 also causes problems?

Ive mentioned this in pretty much all my posts, but one more time: I intend to call Seat, find out as much information about what caused the fault, what they have fixed, what other warnings / DPF levels came up. Yes the guy at Fiat said the EGR came up on their own scan so they were sending to Seat to do the work, but I have never encountered a dealership that does not scan for themselves before they undertake the work.

The Fiat and Seat dealers are not affiliated, so I have no reason to suspect there will be some cover up. In fact, I would have thought Seat would want to make the job as expensive for Fiat as they can, not send them back a turd.
I realise some of this is based on assumptions, but also as mentioned before, if I am in the least bit unsure about anything either garage is telling me then I will walk away.

 

[rossco775]

Slightly off topic but has the car you are looking at had it's timing belt changed?? My seat garage recommends every 4 years.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jarre]

All people are trying to warn you mate is that low mileage can sometimes go against you. Lots of short journeys where the car doesn't even get up to temperature does not do it any good.

Excess wear on the clutch/gearbox, DPF, turbo etc can all be a part of it and therefore you would expect parts to fail at a lesser mileage than usual.

I'd rather take my car at 40k miles and mostly motorway than 16k and all town driving/sat in traffic. Obviously we can only assume thats what it was previously used for and not that it did 4k a year motorway miles.

 

[STU3Y]

I don't think anyone is saying there is a cover up, but limp mode is a difficult issue to resolve and as stated can be caused by many things, mainly carbon build up leading to failure or restriction of a particular parts, I.e egr, turbo, inlet manifold etc. Due to this the diagnostic may throw up a fault code indicating its one component and the problem be rectified, however due to the fact it is likely to be a problem caused by a variety of issues, you may feel satisfied that it has been resolved even with proof, however find out later on that one part of the problem has been done but the rest hasn't.

Then with the dealer already down on profit they may deem any new fault your responsibility, which is where the costs will come in.

I can see you really like the car but there will many around and it is a buyers market, also bear in mind most dealer have up to £1500 profit on a car so they are generally over priced compared to a private sale, they are a business after all, so if its listed cheaper why?.

Having been through and still suffering with a similar problem myself I would strongly advise against it, otherwise you will feel robbed if it goes wrong and angry that you let yourself make the mistake in the first place.

Also, but maybe irrelevant, if it does come with a warranty, remember most have labour and parts limits, for example Seat charge £102 an hour labour and a warranty will only pay out £37 an hour, and parts the same, my turbo supply alone from seat was nearly £1000 and warranty would pay about £365, meaning you could always be left with a big bill anyway making it not worth while. Added to this most companies will take the work at agreed rates however when the warranty company deem it to be an invalid claim due to wear and tear etc all rates go back to standard customer prices.

I think the fact you asked this question on the forum shows deep down that you know it is a risk, but the same as me you don't want to miss out on something good should you be lucky and things turn out well. I learnt the hard way and my car didn't even have any problems that were obvious. The warning signs are there, listen to them !

 

[locky]

All people are trying to warn you mate is that low mileage can sometimes go against you. Lots of short journeys where the car doesn't even get up to temperature does not do it any good.

Excess wear on the clutch/gearbox, DPF, turbo etc can all be a part of it and therefore you would expect parts to fail at a lesser mileage than usual.

I'd rather take my car at 40k miles and mostly motorway than 16k and all town driving/sat in traffic. Obviously we can only assume thats what it was previously used for and not that it did 4k a year motorway miles.

I hear ya!

I asked the question, so of course I am prepared to hear opinions! Some are just coming over a bit OTT straight off the bat like I am a crazy mofo for even considering it

I realise low miles in dervs can cause problems, and quite possibly was the cause of the problem I encountered - but does that really mean both the Fiat dealer (selling) and Seat dealer (fixing) are conspiring to rip me off with a fudged repair, concealing further issues, and the 16k mile car is now a ticking timebomb which will bring me nothing but despair and financial ruin if I buy it?

I was driving the car for no more than 15 - 20 mins when the limp mode happened. I totally plan another one when the car is back, so was thinking a longer drive, like 60 mins would be more likely to present further issues.

 

[betty_swollox]

so was thinking a longer drive, like 60 mins would be more likely to present further issues.

It could die the day after you've bought it?

driving it for 60 mins isnt going to prove anything if I am honest. it might make you aware of any rattles etc etc, but the engine could blow up a day after you buy it. Anything can happen!!!!!

like I said before, if it feels right, then go for it, if not, just leave it

sick of you going on and on and on about lol


Just wait til its been fixed, take it for a test drive and then make your mind up.


I thought I was indecisive

 

[STU3Y]

No one is conspiring but they are a business and dont think long term. They just do what is necessary to make the customer happy to buy it, but there is a bigger picture that they will not consider which is why we are doing it for you, ha ha!

I think poeple are only OTT cause things dont always translate well in text. But also cos they feel so strongly about you making a bad decision when they can help prevent it.

The decision is yours. I will not say anymore cos im sure I've put a few thoughts in your head and thats all I aimed to do. Either way I hope things work out well. Keep us updated

 

[betty_swollox]

No one is conspiring but they are a business and dont think long term. They just do what is necessary to make the customer happy to buy it, but there is a bigger picture that they will not consider which is why we are doing it for you, ha ha!

Well said


The FIAT dealer want the EGR fixed and the car back with them ASAP
The SEAT garage don't give a toss because its not their car to sell, so they'll do whats asked and then send it back

 

[Jarre]

I hear ya!

I asked the question, so of course I am prepared to hear opinions! Some are just coming over a bit OTT straight off the bat like I am a crazy mofo for even considering it

I realise low miles in dervs can cause problems, and quite possibly was the cause of the problem I encountered - but does that really mean both the Fiat dealer (selling) and Seat dealer (fixing) are conspiring to rip me off with a fudged repair, concealing further issues, and the 16k mile car is now a ticking timebomb which will bring me nothing but despair and financial ruin if I buy it?

I was driving the car for no more than 15 - 20 mins when the limp mode happened. I totally plan another one when the car is back, so was thinking a longer drive, like 60 mins would be more likely to present further issues.

I'll put across my view:

It's being sold at a FIAT dealer who don't specialise in SEAT. Any warranty you get from them will be basic and won't cover anything expensive like clutch, gearbox, turbo, DPF etc. So essentially consider any warranty you are offered as being worthless and you will have to pay for any repairs.
If you buy a second hand car from a SEAT main dealer you get a MINIMUM of 12 months warranty with themselves - this can be used at any SEAT main dealer in the UK.
Also of note - you won't get any good will from SEAT if you buy from a non SEAT dealer as you 'haven't shown loyalty to the brand'. This may not bother you, but i'm making you aware regardless.

Dealers generally don't care about what they sell, as long as its sold. FIAT will have told SEAT to fix what needs to be done to get rid of the warning light and reset the codes - sorted. Any other underlying issues will be yours to deal with in the future, thats just how they roll.

You could buy this car and have no issues whatsoever for however long you own it. You could have so many issues that it does drive you to financial ruin. No one knows. But as long as you can accept the worst case then go for it!

If it was me? I'd do what I did and either buy a car in warranty, or, buy one from a SEAT main dealer and will come with a proper SEAT warranty. For the sake of a few hundred quid it now it could save you an awful lot more in the future. There's plenty of cars available - don't be afraid to travel. It's a buyers market and deals are definitely there to be had!

 

[betty_swollox]

It's a buyers market and deals are definitely there to be had!

I got 500-700 quid knocked off the Cupra just by asking

 

[Jeff Wood]

I think its worth buying.

I mean any 4 year car of this type could throw up a problem, but at least with this one you are getting sorted before you buy.

Also the 170cr is a good engine, my last car was a scirocco 170GT, no probs with that whatsoever..


The only other thing is, could you get a newer car on a PCP deal ?

 

[STU3Y]

If you buy a second hand car from a SEAT main dealer you get a MINIMUM of 12 months warranty with themselves - this can be used at any SEAT main dealer in the UK.

This isn't accurate. You will only get a warranty with a seat "used approved" car, which will probably be ok as seat will take responsibility for it, however seat also sell just "used cars", which is what I found out, they may well provide an aftermarket warranty with this but you could have to pay for it and either way its not worth the paper its written on.

 

[Jarre]

This isn't accurate. You will only get a warranty with a seat "used approved" car, which will probably be ok as seat will take responsibility for it, however seat also sell just "used cars", which is what I found out, they may well provide an aftermarket warranty with this but you could have to pay for it and either way its not worth the paper its written on.

Apologies, I assumed all CR170s being sold at SEAT dealers would have to be approved used?

 

[STU3Y]

Apologies, I assumed all CR170s being sold at SEAT dealers would have to be approved used?

Most probably are but the odd one will slip the net

 

[STU3Y]

I think its worth buying.

I mean any 4 year car of this type could throw up a problem, but at least with this one you are getting sorted before you buy.

Thats the point, due to the type of problem it is. It's likely to be a combined issue so even if one thing is fixed another may not have come to the foreground yet and be more hassle than its worth. Thats the risk.

 

[locky]

Cheers guys, dont get me wrong i do really appreciate the time and efforts going into posting your guidance and opinions. Thanks to each of you for the input so far.

Im really am not as wet behind the ear or indecisive as my posts might look either Just not sure what to make of the situation, Im using this discussion to mitigate and logically think this through, trying to reply to everyones POV whilst in the total understanding that buying any car is a gamble regardless of whether its shown you its cards before or after purchase.

I know that a problem manifesting as as one thing is usually has a root cause elsewhere and can be part of a chain of things and affect other parts too. The 'antipollution' fault ive been carrying on my Pug for a while is due to the engine cooling fan not working, i know that for a fact. In turn the air con does not work because the fan wont turn. Tell most mechs or 206 forum dwellers about it and they will say its the 'particulate filter' about the error and the air con needs a recharge. Well, my 2001 Pug pre-dates that filter, but people can quickly assume too much or attribute a more common fault to something with too much conviction when actually 'antipollution' covers every sensor under the bonnet. Anyway i digress...

Here is an update:
1) Fiat dealer emailed that the car would be back from Seat tomorrow - no info about the job.
2) My missus rang the Seat dealer and the guy said....

....."No fault codes were found"

Curve ball much?

Is it possible the Fiat dealer cleared them down before sending to Seat and it is now going to take a number of miles/ignition cycles to show again?
Should the codes not have been stored?

 

[Jarre]

Or they told SEAT to keep their mouths shut...

The only way you'll know the current situation is to scan the car for codes yourself while test driving it. But that by no means can be used to say whats going to happen to the car in the future.

 

[locky]

Or they told SEAT to keep their mouths shut...

The only way you'll know the current situation is to scan the car for codes yourself while test driving it. But that by no means can be used to say whats going to happen to the car in the future.

Yeah agreed on all counts.
Weird though seeing as Fiat told me it was going for the EGR, you would have thought them telling Seat to corroberate would provide a more pleasing conclusion for a punter.

I definitely think a mystery car at the centre of a potential conspiracy theory is not a car i want to be investing in really.

Still might take it for another test drive though. Ive (we've) all spent so much time talking about it, i think it owes me some smiles.

So, about these TSI's.........

 

[Jarre]

Back the the drawing board, maybe. I'd look are your mileage again - if you aren't doing near on 15k+ then you're better off with a petrol to be honest!

Find yourself a nice example are a SEAT dealer, ensure its an approved used car, and you'll have at least 12 months of motoring knowing that if anything goes wrong its covered

 

[Jeff Wood]

hmmmm

we only did 24000 miles in our scirocco in 3 years, nearly all town driving, and that was 170cr and no probs at all, and it gave really good mpg.

I do sometimes think that you might be better off buying say a 6 month old car from a seat dealer,,pay a reasonable deposit, and then you've got low monthly payments,

and you save on fuel (new ones are better), road tax, £30 a lot of them, no MOT's needed, quite often you get the servicing chucked in,, and of course, no expensive repairs.

damn I should become a salesman