Manual or DSG?

[jr795]

Hi folks, looking for some opinions/clarification on some of this stuff. When I first decided I wanted a Cupra I thought a manual would be best as they are generally my preference, however after reading up a bit more it seems the DSG could be a better idea. From what I've worked out it boils down to:

Pros​

• More 'driver engagement' as you can row through the gears yourself
• Don't have to worry about DSG servicing (although I assume the manual does have a gearbox oil service interval, not sure when it is though)
• Less complicated, less to go wrong/less chance of expensive bills down the line
• Sit at about 2.4k rpm at 70mph, DQ250 sits at about 3k rpm apparently

Cons​

• Clutches seemingly need to be replaced often, and aren't cheap to do
• Clutch delay valve hampers the experience somewhat
• 0.1s slower 0-60
• Worse fuel economy?

How quickly do they get through clutches? Basically I'm now thinking that a manual will cost more to run than a DSG due to clutch replacement costs.

Is the DQ381 better than the DQ250? Extra gear will probably help on the motorway but I'd have to go for a late 290 to get one and I'm not sure the lack of MPI and addition of a GPF are good things

 

[H Rafiq]

Will it be your daily car, or weekend car? I’d go DSG if it’s your daily, and a pre-GPF car. Ideally I’d have the later DSG but without the GPF, but that’s not an option.

 

[jr795]

Will it be your daily car, or weekend car? I’d go DSG if it’s your daily, and a pre-GPF car. Ideally I’d have the later DSG but without the GPF, but that’s not an option.

Technically my daily but I work from home so I don't have a commute, I normally only do about 5500 miles a year, mostly on motorways. Not a lot of urban driving really mostly national roads.

Yeah 7 speed with no GPF would be the ideal, personally I wouldn't want the GPF either tbf

 

[SRGTD]

I have the 6 speed DQ250 DSG in my VW (2020 2.0 litre / 200ps Polo GTI+) and it’s the first non-manual car I‘ve owned in over 45 years of driving. I thought I’d miss the driver engagement of a manual but in all honesty I haven’t. I have long term bad back issues, so not having to contend with the left foot clutch work of a manual is a bonus for me, especially in stop start heavy traffic in built up areas. Service intervals of the DSG are mileage but not time dependent; on the DQ250 it’s 40k miles (I think it‘s 80k on the DQ381).

My car also has a GPF and apart from the occasional regen, I’m not aware it’s there in normal day to day driving.

 

[jr795]

My car also has a GPF and apart from the occasional regen, I’m not aware it’s there in normal day to day driving.

How does the regen work? Out of interest

 

[SRGTD]

How does the regen work? Out of interest

I don’t know the technicalities of the process. However, when the particulate matter in the GPF reaches a certain level, the regeneration process takes place.

Regeneration can be either passive or active. With a passive regen, under ‘normal’ longer journeys, the exhaust temperature reached is high enough to burn off accumulated particulate matter and the driver may well be unaware a regen is happening. However, if a high proportion journeys driven are short journeys where the engine and exhaust temperature might not get up to the ‘optimum’ level, an active (forced) regeneration might happen where additional fuel is used to increase the exhaust temperature to help burn off accumulated particulate matter and clean the filter.

From memory, I’ve had two or three active GPF regenerations in my car In 39-40 months of ownership. Frequency of active GPF regens will depend on the mix of journey types driven; a high proportion of short journeys on a cold engine = higher frequency of active regens compared to a car being used predominantly on long(er) journeys.

There are some tell tale signs when an active GPF regen is happening (you might not notice all of them);

• louder booming / droning exhaust note
• slight hesitancy under acceleration and slight lumpiness to the engine idle in stop start traffic
• the stop start function is deactivated (so the engine doesn’t switch itself off during the regen process)
• a ‘hot‘ smell
• significantly worse fuel consumption due to the extra fuel used to raise the exhaust temperature. My fuel consumption worsens by around 30-35% during an active GPF regen.

From memory, an active GPF regeneration takes between 20-30 minutes with my car. When I’ve been aware an active regen is happening, if possible I’ll try and ensure it’s completed before I switch the engine off, even if it means extending the journey by a few miles / minutes.

 

[andy2max]

I’ve got a cupra 300 with the DQ250. I used to love a manual, whether I’m just getting lazy but I would only buy a DSG/Auto now. I work in the office 2 days a week which involves mostly motorway, I don’t notice high revs at normal motorway speeds. The 7 speed would probably be a bit better but the Revs on the motorway don’t cross my mind.
maintance depends where you buy from but mine came with a 2 year warranty from seat which is peace of mind

 

[DigitalSushi]

DSG without a shadow of a doubt.

I used to be a manual gives driver engagement blah blah and to be honest its utter crap once you start with a dsg.

Pros
Far easier to drive in traffic, auto hold etc
Way better fuel economy vs manual mode (though i cannot compare to a true manual)
quicker 0-60 due to instant shifts (this very much disappointed my neighbour with a manual 300)
Can use the paddles or the lever to change if you want, has a manual mode (though it will still shift if it is going to either stall or blow the engine to bits to protect itself)


cons,
Initial launch you are a slave to the clutch deciding when you engage, nowhere near as good as a manual
Launch control is hilariously bad until you learn how to use it.
Yes it does need servicing which cost me appr £210 every 50k miles
Needs a 7th gear but i think later models do have that now

 

[jr795]

Pros
Far easier to drive in traffic, auto hold etc
Way better fuel economy vs manual mode (though i cannot compare to a true manual)
quicker 0-60 due to instant shifts (this very much disappointed my neighbour with a manual 300)
Can use the paddles or the lever to change if you want, has a manual mode (though it will still shift if it is going to either stall or blow the engine to bits to protect itself)

Thanks, to be honest for my use case a lot of the DSG benefits don't really matter. I very rarely sit in traffic, I'm not too bothered if it's slightly faster. What's more important to me is the fuel economy and on the motorway at least (most of my miles are motorway/major a roads) the manual should be a fair bit better because it's revving a lot less.

Also the manual lacking launch control is a blessing really as it guarantees it hasn't been used. Allegedly when these cars were new some SEAT dealers would tell customers that their warranty would be invalid if they used the launch control more than 3 times. I can't imagine it's great for them.

Needs a 7th gear but i think later models do have that now

I've heard others say this too. It's a shame only the newer 290 has the 7spd because it also gets rid of the MPI (so you get carbon buildup on the valves) and adds a GPF which if nothing else makes it sound not quite as nice, so I'd much prefer a 300.

The thing that puts me off the manual though is the clutch replacement. If I recall correctly it's around 700 quid to get it done and supposedly in the worst cases they can need changing every 30k miles. That would still be about every 5 years for me but either way it's money I'd rather not have to spend.