Unplugging the MAF fixes a problem, but replacing it doesn't!

/dev/null

Active Member
Nov 12, 2008
1,652
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Apologies for the long post but I am really at a loss here!!!

I have been having a problem with my FR 170 PD for well over a year now but after many trips to the two dealers it still isn't fixed and is not out of warranty! The main issue is that it is an intermittent fault and it never seems to bloody do it when I take it in!! :(
Basically, every now and again the car engine starts to sound very "rough" when at a standstill and you can kind of feel the car vibrating more than normal. The revs are at normal though, not at 1k like when the DPF is regen'ing. When it does this then during acceleration it is absolutely shocking - it is as if there is no turbo there until about 2.5k revs when it then suddenly kicks in. If you put your foot flat to the floor doing say 30 in 4th then there is hardly anything til you slowly hit 2.5k and then it surges in but is very "lumpy" - ie, you get a big surge then a flat drop then comes back in again. It's quite hard to explain.
I had the dealers look at it and they said "computer says no - no problem!". No faults thrown up and I never get any warning lights on the dash. The car is a nightmare to drive - I'm scared of overtaking people because if I pull out and commit to make the manoever then have no power I'm buggered, lol!

Anyway on the last but one visit, the dealers change the fuel filter just in case it were that and it also had a service at the same time (so other components were changed). Still didn't help. Then on here in another thread, someone suggested unplugging the MAF when it was doing it and seeing if it fixed the problem (which would point to a dodgy MAF) - lo and behold it did (although it put the coil light flashing on the dash)! When I plugged it back in, the problem came back. So when it went in for a service this time I got them to replace it which they did. Gets the car back and it's fine for a couple of weeks, but now it's started doing it again!!

I unplugged the MAF today and the problem went. But this is with a brand new MAF!??

What could the problem be that is fixed by unplugging the MAF but not by replacing it with a brand new one? They definitely replaced it (ie, didn't just say they had) because the old one was all scratched and this is a shiny new one!

I have a few long drives coming up in the summer but I'm worried about taking the car in case something goes drastically wrong with it when I'm well away from home.

The dealers both pretty much say that until there is a fault on the dash or they actually witness it having the issue there isn't much they can do (which is fair enough I suppose) but if I can't do that then I'm stuck! :(
 

nc30rider

Active Member
Feb 8, 2009
335
12
Where ever the wife tells me
Do Seat not have an OBD log tool? The company that makes the diagnostic equipment I use make a small tool that the customer can take away.
Basically it is for diagnosing intermittent faults. You plug it in, and the customer takes the car away. The customer then waits for the fault to occur, when it does the customer removes the tool and brings it to the workshop. It is then connected to the diagnostic laptop and the last 20mins (I think) of live data and faults are downloaded for analysis. Hopefully showing exactly what has occurred. Great little addition to the diag machine, it can be left in for weeks if necessary

http://www.texa.co.uk/dettaglio_news.asp?id=30
 
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/dev/null

Active Member
Nov 12, 2008
1,652
101
The thing is though, I don't think a fault is ever logged - I have never seen a warning lamp on the dashboard because of it, the car just suddenly goes from being able to accelerate fairly quickly to being useless! :( sometimes it will fix itself when driving too!?
 

joe 08

Guest
Hi there mate I've got the same problem you are describing it a nitemare and not nice to drive at all I don't know what to do!!!!!
 

/dev/null

Active Member
Nov 12, 2008
1,652
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I've had a look but nothing looks out of the ordinary (frayed wires etc).Surely if the wire was dodgy though it would throw us a dashboard error as it does when it is unplugged? I would have expected them to check the plug when replacing the MAF as well, lol!
 

Marshall

Active Member
Jul 7, 2008
3,256
6
Bonnie Scotland
Well my dealings with diesel cars not seat though mainly fiat and alfa romeo this sounds like an egr valve problem ie the valve sticking open or closed and by disconnecting the MAF the ecu no longer knows the airflow and adjusts itself to run better using the signal from the other sensors.
Thats my opinion but I wouldn't dismiss it.:shrug:
 

/dev/null

Active Member
Nov 12, 2008
1,652
101
Hi,
Cheers for the info - the symptoms sound like what my car is having from reading on google!
But... how would I confirm that this is the problem? And more crucially, how much am I looking at to get the damn thing replaced? Is it something I could do myself?
 

burnsy_b

FR 170 AKA THE CLANKS
Apr 25, 2009
80
0
LEEDS W YORKS
Well my dealings with diesel cars not seat though mainly fiat and alfa romeo this sounds like an egr valve problem ie the valve sticking open or closed and by disconnecting the MAF the ecu no longer knows the airflow and adjusts itself to run better using the signal from the other sensors.
Thats my opinion but I wouldn't dismiss it.:shrug:
I know this might sound daft but do the FR 170 TDI's have an EGR valve i thought that the DPF was put there instead of that????? might be wrong though :confused:
 

alx_chung

Dark Lord of the Torque
Sep 11, 2006
1,537
0
In front of a PC....
I know this might sound daft but do the FR 170 TDI's have an EGR valve i thought that the DPF was put there instead of that????? might be wrong though :confused:

Yes it does have one. If you look at your engine its at the front of the engine.
The EGR is the Exhaust Gas Recirculation valve. Its all explained here and its completely seperate from your DPF.
Alex
 

/dev/null

Active Member
Nov 12, 2008
1,652
101
Damn, that sounds too complicated for a novice like me lol! What do you reckon dealer price would be to do it?
 

Pheo

Active Member
Sep 11, 2009
275
0
My first thought would be can you unplug it to see if the symptoms go away.

Also the electronics should throw an engine check light, but I'm not sure if this is just whether the electrics are working... But as it is opened gradually by the ECU presumably there might be a position sensor... If so it could be read with VCDS?

Personally given that guide I don't think it should cost that much in labour.
 

Pheo

Active Member
Sep 11, 2009
275
0
Infact:

There are a few ways to modify the operation of the EGR system.* The first is to use the adaptation function of a vag-com cable to adjust the degree of EGR system operation.* The computer may react to the change in EGR flow and adjust timing.* People report a mileage loss with this method of adaptation.* It is possible to shut it off completely with a Ross tech VCDS but this may set a check engine light.

therefore first thing I'd do is get it on VCDS and figure out how it is performing...
 

/dev/null

Active Member
Nov 12, 2008
1,652
101
The thing is, I haven't a clue where it is, what it looks like etc etc. I have to admit that anything beyond topping up engine oil is pretty much beyond my mechanical knowledge! :( I don't have a VAG-COM cable or software - I'm thinking it might be just cheaper to get it cleaned than paying for either the cable/software or a garage to do it for me.
 

magicmcfc

Full Member
Aug 26, 2004
60
0
You can't shut off the EGR with the newer PD engines but like you said you can check to see how its working.
Alex

Hi anyone know if I can check this on my version of vag.com 704.1 and which blocks do I look at? Do I need to set an output? On a leon mk2 fr pd engine. Thanks
 
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