1.2 Timing Chain DIY

[Gwyn]

Hi all - newbie here.

My sister has a 1.2 Ibiza which has 146k miles on it (nice and high...)

Last week it went into limp mode and the garage are saying that the timing chain has slipped.

It had a new timing chain and tensioners at 100k which was a couple of years ago, so I figure it should have been the updated parts.

The car is a bit scrappy, but apart from the engine problem it is solid.

I have experience in changing timing chains on BMW's so more than happy messing around with engines.

From a quick look around the forum it looks as if it may only need a new guide rail and to re set the timing.

Are there any how to guides on the web anywhere? I figure I may need some timing tools - does anyone have any that I can borrow?

It has such a high mileage that it is not worth paying a garage to do it, so if it really is a no DIY job then it will probably be scrap it for parts. Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

 

[smithy84]

ive got this job coming up too & im dreading it. ive done belts before but not a chain. my mate says it will be fine as long as i keep good oil in it but the timing chain rattles its arse off when i first start the car from cold. i know these engines are prone for the chain jumping too so i need to change the tensioner before its too late. anyway im rattlig on & ill get to the point now would it not be easier for you to just source a motor for it from a breakers & sling that in? if you end up scrapping the car though i may be interested in it for spares.

 

[Gwyn]

Yes I think it might be a better idea to either break the car or just replace the engine. I don't think the car is worth anymore than £1200 running and engines seem to go for £400 - so it doesn't really stack up.

How where you planning on doing it? are there no guides anywhere?

 

[joestella28]

Mines just rolled past 100k and am thinking about doing the tensioner, is it a big job? What sort of mileage can the 1.2's do if looked after? I know the one mentioned in this thread has done over 140k (which really suprised me) but is that to be expected? Mine runs surprisingly well, quiet and really smooth but I'm just very much aware of the danger of the timing chain going without notice

Joe

 

[Gwyn]

On BMW's it is a relatively involved job but there is plenty of support and manuals on line. The thing with this VAG engine is that I can't find any manuals. It seems to be a very common problem even with 1.4 and 2.0 liter engines.

I am not going to even start thinking about doing it until I can find some kind of manual or write up. Does anyone know if the Haynes is very good? They are all sealed up in Halfords and I can't have a look - past experience for big jobs like this is that Haynes misses out important details...

This engine had a new timing chain at around 76k and reading around it seems to be the guide / tensioner not the actual chain.

On BMW timing chains get a bit noisy after 150k, but it is pretty rare that they jump. Reading around most people seem to be saying that VAG engines, particularly this 3 cylinder need a change at 100k.

 

[smithy84]

ive got the haynes manual for the ibiza & it seems pretty acurate to me. theres plenty of photo's & diagrams on it etc. im just a bit weary on doing the job as ive never touched a chain before & it looks more complicated than a belt. the cars only done 51k so it should be ok for a while longer but i know the day will come... engine swap seems pretty straight forward though, but if i were to end up goin down that road then it would be gettin something bigger than a 1.2 3pot put back in.

 

[MJ]

You'll need the special tool set as the job CANNOT be done without.

 

[Gwyn]

Hi MJ yes, I suspected there might be the need for special tools. Is there anywhere / anyone that I maybe able to borrow them from>

Sounds like Haynes might be worth a look then.

I am still thinking that the car isn't worth it....

Also as the car is in limp mode - does the ECU need to be reset to get it out of this mode?

 

[MJ]

I don't understand? The 1.2 chain engine doesn't have a limp mode? What's it doing exactly?

 

[Gwyn]

Interesting, the mechanic said that's what it is...

Symptoms are - engine warning light is on, lacks power and does not seem to rev past 3000rpm. Makes a bad noise...

 

[Blanco92]

I've got this job to do as well... I've got all the new, modified parts in a box in the spare room, just need to fit them!

The timing chain tools can be bought online for about £60.

It sounds to me that just a new tensioner, and a few channels are all that need changing. I'm going to do the chain anyway, just because I wouldn't want to put a used chain back on. And the chain itself doesn't cost much.

I've never heard of a 1.2 in limp mode earlier, perhaps the lack of power is just because the timing is out? Maybe compression is down?

 

[Gwyn]

Ok, that doesn't sound so bad.

If your chaining the chain, are you changing the sprockets as well?

In my mind it could be just down on power because of the incorrect timing.

On another note (which is possible linked) it has been putting out some white smoke on a cold start up sometime, and the coolant has dropped ever so slightly over the last few months. Which is could be the start of something else with this engine - though perhaps it could be linked to the timing issues?

I'm based in South Manchester - so not far of Cheshire at all!

 

[Blanco92]

Ok, that doesn't sound so bad.

If your chaining the chain, are you changing the sprockets as well?

In my mind it could be just down on power because of the incorrect timing.

On another note (which is possible linked) it has been putting out some white smoke on a cold start up sometime, and the coolant has dropped ever so slightly over the last few months. Which is could be the start of something else with this engine - though perhaps it could be linked to the timing issues?

I'm based in South Manchester - so not far of Cheshire at all!

I've no intention on changing the sprockets, just because, they shouldn't be very worn at all really, my car only has 35k on the clock. And the chain should be in good condition anyway, I just want to be on the safe side really.

The 1.2 does have a habit of using a bit of coolant, mine does too; there's a few threads on here about it. Doesn't do them any harm though. Have to top mine up every 3-4 months or so, not really an issue.

You must live very close to me then, if I told you I'm from Gatley you'll know what I mean.

 

[Gwyn]

Ah Gatley - I'm in Chorlton so really not far away!

Hopefully the mileage on yours is low enough so the chain wont have stretch too much. I only bought up the sprockets because I heard of a few cases where people had put new chains on old sprockets (this is BMW twin cam engines) and the chain jumped, because the sprockets had warn to the chain.

Good news about the coolant!

 

[CGD217]

My 1.2 drinks a wee bit over 4 months or so, then top up time as Chris said

How much were all the parts you need Chris if you don't mind me asking. I'm coming up to 90k, maybe giving the girl to my sister in a year or so, therefore i want to keep her running well and getting the tensioner done is a must imo.

Do you think it's worth changing the sprokets etc?
I don't normally use a VAG garage but for this i think i will!
Cheers guys

 

[Gwyn]

So I have had a little closer inspection of the car - the idle is quite smooth - but the timing is clearly out the whole engine moves around quite seriously.

There isn't much in the way of bad noises (it just looks as if the exhaust is moving around making a bad noise) from the engine - so perhaps it is worth a fix.

Chris where is the tool available from? Have you bought one?

 

[joestella28]

This special tool people speak of, is that needed to change just the tensioner or is it just for changing the chain?

I've just past 100k, and am looking to give it a good going over as I'm going to be keeping it for atleast another 20k. I'm currently piecing together a list of jobs to do and the parts that are needed.

Does anyone have a link to where I can buy a new tensioner and any other parts needed?

Also, on a side note, I can hear a belt squeek when the car is cold, I'm guessing it's the altenator belt? How often should these be changed?

Cheers,

Joe

 

[Gwyn]

You can find the tool on ebay (I would post a link but can't) - and you can buy the tensioner from Eurocarparts or the dealer.

Belt squeek or sequel could be grease on the belt. But if the belt is damaged in anyway its worth changing. I have also read that if the drive belt snaps it can knock the timing out - causing the timing chain to jump. Not sure if this is true - but drive belts are not that expensive to replace if your not sure when yours was last done.

 

[joestella28]

Has anyone bought from these guys?

http://seekpart24.com/seat/ibiza-iv-6l1-02/1-2-2/timing-chain-100411

I'm not sure what postage would work out at but the parts seem pretty cheap?

 

[smithy84]

my coolant drops ever so slightly over time too... but i always wonder, where does it go? coolant usually evaporates back into the header tank & turns back into water as it cant get out into the air. still if everyone elses does it to then im not too bothered about it. if it goes bang ill just take it off the road & pull the motor out & buy a written off 20vt car to rape for bits.