Drive Profile defaulting to Normal on engine restart

[serdar_18fr]

Hello all,

I was reading the user manual and saw this note about the Drive Profile feature:

"When the vehicle is switched off it will store the driving profile that was selected when the ignition key was removed.
Nevertheless, when the engine is restarted, the engine and the gear will start by default in the Normal setting.
For engine and gear to revert to the desired position, select the corresponding drive profile again."

I generally use "Individual" mode (Engine:Normal, Suspension:Comfort, Steering:Sport) in the city due to the low quality of our inner city roads in Istanbul.
When I drive on smooth highways, I use "Sport" mode which sets everything to "Sport".
For those highway rides, I find the aforementioned behaviour of starting the engine in Normal mode regardless of the last setting simply irritating.
I just don't understand why I should re-select it everytime I start the engine.

I didn't verify the correctness of what the manual says yet but assuming it just works that way, I thought there might be a parameter to override this behaviour and start the engine in last selected mode too. Anybody looked into this?

Cheers,
Serdar

 

[rafletcher]

The manual is correct. What’s really irritating is that (in my Cupra Ateca) the light on the selector dial will still indicate Sport, or Cupra or Individual on restate (whatever it was in when I stopped) but the engine and ‘box will be in Comfort. If it’s going to default back, make the bloody light change too . It’s likely to do with maintaining the stated emissions, because anything other than “normal“ will be worse.

 

[70 Plate- Cupra 290]

Unfortunately they have had to do this for the emissions side of things, As soon as i get into the car i whack it into the mode i like before driving off.
This is one of the reasons I wont be getting another seat leon Cupra in a years time once my lease has ended, lets hope the new Cupra Leon model doesnt do this.

 

[serdar_18fr]

The manual is correct. What’s really irritating is that (in my Cupra Ateca) the light on the selector dial will still indicate Sport, or Cupra or Individual on restate (whatever it was in when I stopped) but the engine and ‘box will be in Comfort. If it’s going to default back, make the bloody light change too . It’s likely to do with maintaining the stated emissions, because anything other than “normal“ will be worse.

There is no selector dial on a Leon, just a mode button without a display of current mode anywhere. The instrument cluster shows it only once when you select a mode by pushing the button, then it goes out. This is also problematic in my view.

When you restart the engine, the car starts to a state that does not correspond to any of the pre-programmed modes : engine & gearbox in comfort (or normal for non-Cupra models), steering & suspension in whatever mode you selected last. I see this as another strange behaviour.

It needs a complete rethink and this is the proper way to do it, I think:
1:There should be a constant display of the selected mode.
2:The default behaviour of the car out of the factory should be that it reverts to Comfort (or Normal) completely, including steering & suspension.
3: There should be an option in vehicle settings to override the default behaviour so the owner could choose the mode to survive through the restarts. The owner could be warned via "Eco Tips" on every restart about the emissions also.

Cheers,
Serdar

 

[Chillout]

I was annoyed by this as well, but........ frustration sometimes leads to creativity
I researched the Driving Profiles extensively, and found ways to:
- make it remember the profile you were using when you shut down the car
- make it remember the S mode of your gearbox after restart
- make the car think it has other driving profiles than it actually has
- add controls that you couldn't modify normally
- show all controls that are changed by the driving profile. Most profiles from factory have hidden or grouped settings
- change whether or not the driving profile button LED is on/off/blinking
- give you full control over what's being shown in your driving profiles menu

Read about it here:

GitHub - jilleb/MQB-FPA: Driving profiles customization research for MQB platform cars

Driving profiles customization research for MQB platform cars - jilleb/MQB-FPA

github.com

Some examples of what I'm using on my Leon:


Added the soundaktor, and gave me full control. (Currently I'm using a more functional selection than just on/off, I can choose Sport/Normal/Comfort. Sport = always on. Normal = Only on when gearbox is in S, Comfort = always off).

On my previous car, I added many controls. Not all of them were functional because the car lacked the hardware.

A slider for DCC, with additional sporty/comfy settings:

So don't give up on SEAT or Cupra yet.. all this stuff can be tweaked extensively!

 

[CupraRST]

I was annoyed by this as well, but........ frustration sometimes leads to creativity
I researched the Driving Profiles extensively, and found ways to:
- make it remember the profile you were using when you shut down the car
- make it remember the S mode of your gearbox after restart
- make the car think it has other driving profiles than it actually has
- add controls that you couldn't modify normally
- show all controls that are changed by the driving profile. Most profiles from factory have hidden or grouped settings
- change whether or not the driving profile button LED is on/off/blinking
- give you full control over what's being shown in your driving profiles menu

Read about it here:

GitHub - jilleb/MQB-FPA: Driving profiles customization research for MQB platform cars

Driving profiles customization research for MQB platform cars - jilleb/MQB-FPA

github.com

Some examples of what I'm using on my Leon:


Added the soundaktor, and gave me full control. (Currently I'm using a more functional selection than just on/off, I can choose Sport/Normal/Comfort. Sport = always on. Normal = Only on when gearbox is in S, Comfort = always off).
View attachment 28224


On my previous car, I added many controls. Not all of them were functional because the car lacked the hardware.
View attachment 28225



A slider for DCC, with additional sporty/comfy settings:
View attachment 28226


So don't give up on SEAT or Cupra yet.. all this stuff can be tweaked extensively!

This looks very, very interesting!
If only this could be integrated without the risk of bricking the system. Keeping the original firmware as a backup that can be restored, before integrating these new options with installing a new firmware. Sounds like a dream scenario.

 

[Chillout]

What is your engine and car type? I have a lot of datasets, maybe I can cook something up for you.

Risk of bricking is fairly limited. So far I've flashed over 1500 driving profiles datasets to my cars, some a bit more experimental than others... 0 bricks
And the good thing is.. it isn't even firmware being replaced, just the parametrization inside a specific part of the gateway. I love the control it gives me over each specific part.

 

[Peller]

One of the most annoying things seems to have a hardware fix. It's for the Golf R but I'm sure the fix would work on the Leon

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk

 

[serdar_18fr]

- make it remember the profile you were using when you shut down the car
- make it remember the S mode of your gearbox after restart
- make the car think it has other driving profiles than it actually has
- add controls that you couldn't modify normally
- show all controls that are changed by the driving profile. Most profiles from factory have hidden or grouped settings
- change whether or not the driving profile button LED is on/off/blinking
- give you full control over what's being shown in your driving profiles menu

Added the soundaktor, and gave me full control. (Currently I'm using a more functional selection than just on/off, I can choose Sport/Normal/Comfort. Sport = always on. Normal = Only on when gearbox is in S, Comfort = always off).

A slider for DCC, with additional sporty/comfy settings

Hi there again

On the first post in this thread, I wrote that "I thought there might be a parameter to override this behaviour and start the engine in last selected mode too. Anybody looked into this?". So I guess I was right thinking this whole thing should be customizable

Anyway, the car already remembers the last profile I was using, but not for the engine (my gearbox is manual so no issues there).

I know this only because I read it in the user manual.
I didn't verify it by driving the car and checking its throttle response, but I assume what the user manual states is correct anyway.

In your response you wrote about remembering the gearbox mode but there was no mention of doing the same for the engine.
If it is possible through these hacks, I'd be very happy if you give me some pointers on where to start.

Also, it would be nice to able to turn off the interior engine sound.
I even don't know whether my 1.4/125ps engine has this feature or not.
But if it has, it would be nice to hear the difference.

As for the DCC, I have three settings: Comfort, Normal, Sport.
If its current comfort and sport settings are already pre-set at the limits of each end, I wouldn't bother to have more control on it.
But if I would be able to go further i.e. more comfy or more sporty, then I may consider to have this hack too.

Anyway, thanks again.

Cheers,
Serdar

 

[CupraRST]

What is your engine and car type? I have a lot of datasets, maybe I can cook something up for you.

Risk of bricking is fairly limited. So far I've flashed over 1500 driving profiles datasets to my cars, some a bit more experimental than others... 0 bricks
And the good thing is.. it isn't even firmware being replaced, just the parametrization inside a specific part of the gateway. I love the control it gives me over each specific part.

@Chillout
That would be absolutely great! Extra control over even more settings is always a good thing! From what I've been told, some Audi and VW models already give more control over more settings than SEAT does. Is this true?
My car is a 2019 SEAT Leon Cupra R ST, with 2.0 engine and DSG7. It has a Stage 1+ tune on ECU and TCU, with now 397 PK and 528 Nm. But I guess both ECU and TCU settings will not be changed or interfered by changes made in the parameters within the multimedia centre?

I have to add that the ECO mode settings within the individual setting are changed, the are now the same as the OEM settings within the OEM Comfort mode. But I think those changes are not made in the multimedia centre, but within ECU and/or TCU.

The same goes for the Start/Stop system, it is now programmed to work the other way: at start it is now off, but it can still be turned on. As far as I know this is also programmed in ECU and/or TCU.

 

[Chillout]

@Chillout
That would be absolutely great! Extra control over even more settings is always a good thing! From what I've been told, some Audi and VW models already give more control over more settings than SEAT does. Is this true?

It depends. The mechanisms are 100% identical, only the datasets are much different.
VW has some more fun features, like the DCC Slider and Ambient colors linked to the profile.
But all of them have 1 thing in common: the manufacturers are not showing all the controls that are available.
Most of the cars have grouped settings, that only show up as "Engine" or "Drive", while techically this will modify the controls:
- gearbox
- engine sound
- engine
- soundgenerator
Stuff like that

My car is a 2019 SEAT Leon Cupra R ST, with 2.0 engine and DSG7. It has a Stage 1+ tune on ECU and TCU, with now 397 PK and 528 Nm. But I guess both ECU and TCU settings will not be changed or interfered by changes made in the parameters within the multimedia centre?

Gearbox and Engine have several modes, sport/eco/normal. The controls on the screen determine what mode is being used. Sometimes the Engine will only switch to Sport when the Gearbox is also in Sport mode. Otherwise it will stay in Normal mode.
A tune is just a change of the map which is used by a specific driving profile. Changing the profile will not change what's set on the ECU/TCU.

The same goes for the Start/Stop system, it is now programmed to work the other way: at start it is now off, but it can still be turned on. As far as I know this is also programmed in ECU and/or TCU.

Start/stop cannot be turned off by driving profiles. It can be turned back on again when setting a specific profile, but it will not turn off.
When you've changed the ECU/TCU startstop settings, they will not be touched.

 

[CupraRST]

It depends. The mechanisms are 100% identical, only the datasets are much different.
VW has some more fun features, like the DCC Slider and Ambient colors linked to the profile.
But all of them have 1 thing in common: the manufacturers are not showing all the controls that are available.
Most of the cars have grouped settings, that only show up as "Engine" or "Drive", while techically this will modify the controls:
- gearbox
- engine sound
- engine
- soundgenerator
Stuff like that



Gearbox and Engine have several modes, sport/eco/normal. The controls on the screen determine what mode is being used. Sometimes the Engine will only switch to Sport when the Gearbox is also in Sport mode. Otherwise it will stay in Normal mode.
A tune is just a change of the map which is used by a specific driving profile. Changing the profile will not change what's set on the ECU/TCU.



Start/stop cannot be turned off by driving profiles. It can be turned back on again when setting a specific profile, but it will not turn off.
When you've changed the ECU/TCU startstop settings, they will not be touched.

@Chillout
To resume this and making sure that I understand this correctly:
All parameters that are being used wirthin settings are stored within ECU/TCU and are not being changed, just chosen from.
Combinations of settings are preset within the different modes. Those modes are actually stored within the menu of the multimedia system.
What you are doing is making new and/or more extensive menu options within the multimedia system, mostly (or only?) within the Individual menu options.
Is this the correct way to look at it?

The settings that are chosen within the Individual menu options (either OEM options or your new or improved options) don't interfere with the preset (OEM) settings in the different modes? Or do they sometimes, like with the chosen setting for interior engine sound?

 

[Chillout]

@Chillout
To resume this and making sure that I understand this correctly:
All parameters that are being used wirthin settings are stored within ECU/TCU and are not being changed, just chosen from.

Correct

Combinations of settings are preset within the different modes. Those modes are actually stored within the menu of the multimedia system.

Not entirely. The FPA dataset holds the settings. The infotainment system only displays them or allows you to select them. Or make your individual profile.

What you are doing is making new and/or more extensive menu options within the multimedia system, mostly (or only?) within the Individual menu options.
Is this the correct way to look at it?

Yes, I enable controls in the menus that weren't avaiable before. But not only in the individual options. I add stuff to each profile.

The settings that are chosen within the Individual menu options (either OEM options or your new or improved options) don't interfere with the preset (OEM) settings in the different modes? Or do they sometimes, like with the chosen setting for interior engine sound?

No, they don't interfere. In the individual options you can select between the settings from the other profiles. So if you choose sport for Engine sound, you will get the same setting as is set in the Sport mode.

 

[CupraRST]

Correct


Not entirely. The FPA dataset holds the settings. The infotainment system only displays them or allows you to select them. Or make your individual profile.



Yes, I enable controls in the menus that weren't avaiable before. But not only in the individual options. I add stuff to each profile.


No, they don't interfere. In the individual options you can select between the settings from the other profiles. So if you choose sport for Engine sound, you will get the same setting as is set in the Sport mode.

@Chillout
Wow, having more options in Individual is already great, but having more options in ALL modes is fantastic!

 

[Chillout]

It's so much fun
Currently I'm doing the same with the Soundaktor firmware. Maybe we can have some different sounds there ;-)

 

[CupraRST]

It's so much fun
Currently I'm doing the same with the Soundaktor firmware. Maybe we can have some different sounds there ;-)

@Chillout
New sounds to choose from, that sounds nice!

That brings me to the question if different models Seat Leon or Cupra (MK3. MK3.5 without GPF, MK3,5 with GPF, MK4, hatchback or Sportstourer) produce different sounds in their soundaktor. From what I know from my own Cupra R ST (MK3,5 with GPFs), this sounds different (more natural) from what I hear in several Youtube videos from the MK4 Cupra Sportstourer 2.0 (that sounds more boxer like). Does anyone know about differences between different models through the range and years?

 

[Chillout]

As for the DCC, I have three settings: Comfort, Normal, Sport.
If its current comfort and sport settings are already pre-set at the limits of each end, I wouldn't bother to have more control on it.
But if I would be able to go further i.e. more comfy or more sporty, then I may consider to have this hack too.

I see I never replied to this question.. having the slider means you can go stiffer than sport, more comfy than comfort.