Car wont start.

[STU3Y]

No I live in kent.

 

[azzydot]

No I live in kent.

that's very far, can u explain which wire u added on new ?


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[STU3Y]

see post 65, it's the one with the blue connector

 

[azzydot]

1. lifted back seat can hear pump very easily when turning ignition.

2. removed pipe one and turned ignition. About 20ml of diesel comes out every time. nice and clean.
what next

Can u open both pipes on the inejctor rails and blow in it ? May clear any dust that's builded on the lines ? worth a try takes 5 mins


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[MJ]

Can u open both pipes on the inejctor rails and blow in it ? May clear any dust that's builded on the lines ? worth a try takes 5 mins


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The fuel rail on a pd is in the cylinder head.

This fault really doesn't come across as an alternator or battery fault.

If it was then you'd experience slow, reluctant cranking then none at all.

A discharged battery reads <11.5 v

Don't be surprised if the voltage drops over a period of days, this is normal.

If you want to check for draw/drain the you need the multimeter set to amps,
Change the leads into the fused circuit (if it has one) then disconnect the live terminal of the battery. Lock all the doors and flick the bonnet catch over simulating that it's closed. Then you plumb the multimeter in as follows - red on the battery post, black on the battery clamp.
Lock the car and after a few minutes check the reading.

You should find nothing more than 0.05amps maybe a bit higher but anything above 0.5amp indicates an issue.

 

[azzydot]

The fuel rail on a pd is in the cylinder head.



This fault really doesn't come across as an alternator or battery fault.



If it was then you'd experience slow, reluctant cranking then none at all.



A discharged battery reads <11.5 v



Don't be surprised if the voltage drops over a period of days, this is normal.



If you want to check for draw/drain the you need the multimeter set to amps,

Change the leads into the fused circuit (if it has one) then disconnect the live terminal of the battery. Lock all the doors and flick the bonnet catch over simulating that it's closed. Then you plumb the multimeter in as follows - red on the battery post, black on the battery clamp.

Lock the car and after a few minutes check the reading.



You should find nothing more than 0.05amps maybe a bit higher but anything above 0.5amp indicates an issue.

Sorry I was thinking it's petrol didn't really read all the topic and info


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[Dan FR]

For ease of viewing

Full list of possible causes, comment if you can assist with any of the above, even the ones already answered. Your expertise and experience will be much appreciated. Please remember that this fault only occurs after the car has sat for 3-4 days, and does not occur other than that.

1.GLOW PLUGS
Unlikely due to operating temp of 14 degrees - not checked Not the issue

2. FUEL FILTER
Unlikely as no running issues - replaced now anyway Unlikely but now ruled out

3. BATTERY AMPS
Unlikely as cranks well, not checked properly but on multimeter shows, 12.64 engine off, 10.61 when started, 14+ while running. Also battery condition lense still shows as green on battery itself, Is that considered ruled out? Not the issue as it cranks over fine

4. FUEL PUMP (under back seat) - possible
Can be heard to prime, and delivers fuel into filter housing when ignition cycled. Ruled out?Not ruled out, you need to check it is flowing fuel correctly, a quick squirt with the ignition doesnt indicate this, i would disconnect the injectors to stop the car starting and then crank the engine over and check whether fuel squirts out continuously. Also disconnect pipe and run this test next time it is playing up and failing to start

5. CRANK SENSOR - possible
Possibly checked using torque app, revved at 211 first crank then 838 running, 117 second crank 838 running. (All of this is while the problem isn't present)
Need to check if revs rise when cranking next time engine fails to start.
Where is it? Not the issue

6. CAM SHAFT SENSOR
Unlikely as would cause delay in start rather than failure to start.
Where is it and How do you check this?would throw a fault - not the issue

7. INJECTORS
Unlikely as should throw up fault code - not checkedNot the issue

8. NON RETURN VALVE
Where is it and how do I check this??? Not sure of the setup on the BKD, but it IS possible, again all points back to fuel starvation. check fuel is pumping toward engine when cranking

9. FUEL TEMP SENSOR
Where is it and how do I check this??? With VCDS or possibly Torque app, wouldnt stop it starting though but it would run like a bag of ****, so im going to say very unlikely

10. STARTER MOTOR
how do I check this??? Not the issue, but to check, disbale car from starting and turn the car over constantly and check with torque app for cranking speed

11. INJECTOR SEALS
how do I check this??? Are you getting fuel in the oil etc? highly doubt this is the issue

12. HIGH PRESSURE FUEL PUMP
Where is it and how do I check this??? This is the tandem pump on the side of the engine - no idea how you would check it though.

13. COOLANT TEMP SENNSOR
Where is it and how do I check this??? Check reading with VCDS/Torque app. Should read ambient when cars been left overnight and car should run i nthe low 90's when up to temp

14. ELECTRICAL DRAIN ON BATT BY DASHCAM
Believed to switched so unlikely unless someone knows different. See above post with pic Not the issue or you would have a flat battery, which you dont

Sorry for long time responding, dont get a minutes peace on the weekend. My thoughts above

 

[Dan FR]

From whats been described it clearly isnt a battery or starter issue, its either electrical or a lack of fuel, i still think its a lack of fuel and you need to check fuel flow when the issue is present, or just fit some clear pipe so you can visually see any fuel (and more importantly - any air)

 

[MJ]

You see the thing with the injector seals is the unit injectors have 4 seals. When the begin to fail the cause a minute air gap which allows the integral fuel rail in the head to fill with air whilst allowing a very tiny amount of fuel into the bores, the air lock prevents starting and gives the impression of fuel running back. Once the engine starts and warms up the gap is filled, preventing any excess fuel from entering the bore or making its way up the injector or past the rings into the oil system.

This is something I've come across a couple of times.

 

[Dan FR]

Ah, see that i haven't come across before, but i don't work with cars on a daily basis Is that common on the BKD engine then? How do you diagnose short of changing the injector seals?

 

[azzydot]

Ah, see that i haven't come across before, but i don't work with cars on a daily basis Is that common on the BKD engine then? How do you diagnose short of changing the injector seals?

Injector seals are easy to spot for any leaks, ign so it's not started up but priming the fuel and then check the rails for any leaks, also get a long tube one in ear and other end in the rail and listen to each seals for any leaks


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[MJ]

It's not very common at all. I've changed about 3 sets of unit injector seals in 12 years but it worth a look.

I'm afraid it's complete guess work based on the events in question.

 

[MJ]

Injector seals are easy to spot for any leaks, ign so it's not started up but priming the fuel and then check the rails for any leaks, also get a long tube one in ear and other end in the rail and listen to each seals for any leaks


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As before buddy - they're inside the cylinder head

 

[azzydot]

As before buddy - they're inside the cylinder head

Ahh sorry keep forgetting, it's the long inejctors goes inside looks a bit like coil pack ? Thin and goes inside which can't see only the wire


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[MJ]

Yep, that's the one

 

[STU3Y]

All of the last comments are bit out of my depth.

Fuel pump - how do i disconnect the injectors to test as described

Also how do I prevent the engine starting to check the starter

coolant temp sensor seems to show on torque app as described.

With regards to the injectors, how would I tell if there is fuel in the oil, I know that sounds stupid but cant help but think, when I checked the oil a couple of days ago, and wiped the dipstick on some tissue it seemed quite thin and had appeared to have a hint of green colour on the tissue. Not sure of its just be paranoid.

 

[STU3Y]

From whats been described it clearly isnt a battery or starter issue, its either electrical or a lack of fuel, i still think its a lack of fuel and you need to check fuel flow when the issue is present, or just fit some clear pipe so you can visually see any fuel (and more importantly - any air)

Where exactly would I fit this pipe and where would I obtain it from? What size etc? pictures of location if possible

 

[STU3Y]

You see the thing with the injector seals is the unit injectors have 4 seals. When the begin to fail the cause a minute air gap which allows the integral fuel rail in the head to fill with air whilst allowing a very tiny amount of fuel into the bores, the air lock prevents starting and gives the impression of fuel running back. Once the engine starts and warms up the gap is filled, preventing any excess fuel from entering the bore or making its way up the injector or past the rings into the oil system.

This is something I've come across a couple of times.

is this something that the rac could check if I had to call them out again? could this be caused through use of a diesel additive for 2 tanks of fuel?

 

[STU3Y]

with regards to cranking speed, is this just measured in revs and should it be above 250 or 280

Could battery drain not cause the cranking speed to drop just enough that the injectors wont fire up

 

[MJ]

is this something that the rac could check if I had to call them out again? could this be caused through use of a diesel additive for 2 tanks of fuel?

Not really, no.

with regards to cranking speed, is this just measured in revs and should it be above 250 or 280

Could battery drain not cause the cranking speed to drop just enough that the injectors wont fire up

Should be over 250. Poor amperage would cause a noticeably slow cranking speed.