Cupra vs Cupra ST vs M240i

[Cupracabra]

Hello,

I'm new to the forum but not entirely new to Cupra's.
Right now, I have a BMW M240i manual and a Golf GTI Mk5 as a "family car".

I have been looking at Cupras for a while now and I have driven a FR Mk2, Cupra R Mk2, Cupra 280 and a Cupra ST 300 DSG.
I really like the Cupra R mk2 as a driver's car, but I want something newer with the EA888.3 engine. So, I drove a manual Cupra 280 and loved it. I found a really cheap GTI mk5 so I bought it instead of a Cupra as I already have a M240i.

But now I have started thinking about getting a Cupra again. Perhaps I should sell my M240i (auto) and get a cheaper manual Cupra 280 hatchback to free up some money. But I'm afraid I will miss my M240. My second option is to keep my M240 and save for a year and replace my GTI with a Cupra.

If I were to replace my M240 I would definitely go for a manual Cupra 280/290/300 hatch. But If I were to replace my GTI down the line, perhaps I should go with a manual Cupra ST instead and have it as a family car (the are pretty rare in my country though).

Should I replace my M240i with a Cupra?
How does the FWD Cupra ST compare to the Cupra hatch?
How much slower is the heavier ST and which one would you choose in my position?

 

[Damo H]

Hello,

I'm new to the forum but not entirely new to Cupra's.
Right now, I have a BMW M240i manual and a Golf GTI Mk5 as a "family car".

I have been looking at Cupras for a while now and I have driven a FR Mk2, Cupra R Mk2, Cupra 280 and a Cupra ST 300 DSG.
I really like the Cupra R mk2 as a driver's car, but I want something newer with the EA888.3 engine. So, I drove a manual Cupra 280 and loved it. I found a really cheap GTI mk5 so I bought it instead of a Cupra as I already have a M240i.

But now I have started thinking about getting a Cupra again. Perhaps I should sell my M240i (auto) and get a cheaper manual Cupra 280 hatchback to free up some money. But I'm afraid I will miss my M240. My second option is to keep my M240 and save for a year and replace my GTI with a Cupra.

If I were to replace my M240 I would definitely go for a manual Cupra 280/290/300 hatch. But If I were to replace my GTI down the line, perhaps I should go with a manual Cupra ST instead and have it as a family car (the are pretty rare in my country though).

Should I replace my M240i with a Cupra?
How does the FWD Cupra ST compare to the Cupra hatch?
How much slower is the heavier ST and which one would you choose in my position?

On the hatch VS ST front.

0-60 think its 0.1 second (comparing FWD), but in real world driving most of the time you don't know your driving an estate. Although its heavier its supposed to be more aerodynamic (The reason Seat gave when it went quicker round the ring), so balance out I suppose top end.

Only thing I'd say, is the clutch's can be problematic and one of the weaker points of the manual. I went DSG on my 280 ST (white one in my sig) and never regretted it.

That being said if you're looking at the newer 300's the better drivers car is the FWD car, not the 4Drive. In the UK we only got the 2 options, 300 ST Manual FWD and 300 ST DSG 4Drive. Although if you're not in the UK, the best car is available, 300 ST DSG FWD The 4drive feels like a bigger heavier car than the FWD.

 

[Cupracabra]

On the hatch VS ST front.

0-60 think its 0.1 second (comparing FWD), but in real world driving most of the time you don't know your driving an estate. Although its heavier its supposed to be more aerodynamic (The reason Seat gave when it went quicker round the ring), so balance out I suppose top end.

Only thing I'd say, is the clutch's can be problematic and one of the weaker points of the manual. I went DSG on my 280 ST (white one in my sig) and never regretted it.

That being said if you're looking at the newer 300's the better drivers car is the FWD car, not the 4Drive. In the UK we only got the 2 options, 300 ST Manual FWD and 300 ST DSG 4Drive. Although if you're not in the UK, the best car is available, 300 ST DSG FWD The 4drive feels like a bigger heavier car than the FWD.

Thanks for the reply!

Yeah I also saw Seat's quote that it is supposed to be more aerodynamic. There is surprisingly little info about the lap and record. To have an estate with this kind of performance is really impressive. But in my mind I want absolute performance, so hatch, fwd, no panoramic etc. But I also need to think about practicality.

We actually have the DSG FWD combo here in Sweden. But I love manual so that is my preferred choice. i have heard about the weak clutch's. Is the gearbox weak as well or can you just change the clutch and be done with it?

 

[Seriously?]

Thanks for the reply!

Yeah I also saw Seat's quote that it is supposed to be more aerodynamic. There is surprisingly little info about the lap and record. To have an estate with this kind of performance is really impressive. But in my mind I want absolute performance, so hatch, fwd, no panoramic etc. But I also need to think about practicality.

We actually have the DSG FWD combo here in Sweden. But I love manual so that is my preferred choice. i have heard about the weak clutch's. Is the gearbox weak as well or can you just change the clutch and be done with it?

It's not just SEAT.
From the era when I was into motorsport, in the British Touring Car Championships in the mid 90's, Tom Walkinshaw Racing ran Volvo 850 wagons, admittedly mainly because Volvo UK liked the marketing coverage of an estate car racing, but also because the wagons naturally created more downforce.

 

[Damo H]

Thanks for the reply!

Yeah I also saw Seat's quote that it is supposed to be more aerodynamic. There is surprisingly little info about the lap and record. To have an estate with this kind of performance is really impressive. But in my mind I want absolute performance, so hatch, fwd, no panoramic etc. But I also need to think about practicality.

We actually have the DSG FWD combo here in Sweden. But I love manual so that is my preferred choice. i have heard about the weak clutch's. Is the gearbox weak as well or can you just change the clutch and be done with it?

In theory a clutch upgrade is all you need, but the clutches are very subjective on performance vs weight and feel. I am aware of at least one gearbox that completely failed (and had 3 clutches too. But they were running 500 hp.

 

[Mr Mustard]

If you sell the M240i you know you will miss the straight 6 B58 engine, (got a 340, had a 235), but the SEAT is going to be a more agile, more fun on the right roads. And gives you the interaction of manual. Beemers are more of a GT car.

 

[Jay280]

I have just done the opposite change, had a manual cupra 280. Fantastic car, kept it 7 years!! Now got a manual M240i. Only had it a couple of months so early days. In all honesty the only part I miss about the cupra so far is (as mentioned above) the agile sure footed handling.
If the change was the other way I would definitely miss the straight line speed/ torque of the B58, plus the build and interior quality is much better.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

 

[jcbmally]

Hello,

I'm new to the forum but not entirely new to Cupra's.
Right now, I have a BMW M240i manual and a Golf GTI Mk5 as a "family car".

I have been looking at Cupras for a while now and I have driven a FR Mk2, Cupra R Mk2, Cupra 280 and a Cupra ST 300 DSG.
I really like the Cupra R mk2 as a driver's car, but I want something newer with the EA888.3 engine. So, I drove a manual Cupra 280 and loved it. I found a really cheap GTI mk5 so I bought it instead of a Cupra as I already have a M240i.

But now I have started thinking about getting a Cupra again. Perhaps I should sell my M240i (auto) and get a cheaper manual Cupra 280 hatchback to free up some money. But I'm afraid I will miss my M240. My second option is to keep my M240 and save for a year and replace my GTI with a Cupra.

If I were to replace my M240 I would definitely go for a manual Cupra 280/290/300 hatch. But If I were to replace my GTI down the line, perhaps I should go with a manual Cupra ST instead and have it as a family car (the are pretty rare in my country though).

Should I replace my M240i with a Cupra?
How does the FWD Cupra ST compare to the Cupra hatch?
How much slower is the heavier ST and which one would you choose in my position?

Welcome to the forum. Always go with what you want as you will always regret it if you don’t, all very good cars but the 6 pot engine is so sweet. I’d swap the Golf out if it was me.

 

[Cupracabra]

In theory a clutch upgrade is all you need, but the clutches are very subjective on performance vs weight and feel. I am aware of at least one gearbox that completely failed (and had 3 clutches too. But they were running 500 hp.

That's good the hear. Are these upgraded clutches not good for daily use?

If you sell the M240i you know you will miss the straight 6 B58 engine, (got a 340, had a 235), but the SEAT is going to be a more agile, more fun on the right roads. And gives you the interaction of manual. Beemers are more of a GT car.

I have just done the opposite change, had a manual cupra 280. Fantastic car, kept it 7 years!! Now got a manual M240i. Only had it a couple of months so early days. In all honesty the only part I miss about the cupra so far is (as mentioned above) the agile sure footed handling.
If the change was the other way I would definitely miss the straight line speed/ torque of the B58, plus the build and interior quality is much better.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

That's what I'm afraid of. I love my M240i, but I wish it was manual. I have not seen 1 manual M240i for sale here in Sweden so it's more or less impossible to get one. Luckily the ZF gearbox is great with the B58.

Welcome to the forum. Always go with what you want as you will always regret it if you don’t, all very good cars but the 6 pot engine is so sweet. I’d swap the Golf out if it was me.

Thanks!
I think that's what I will do. The Golf won't last forever either. The best thing would probably be to get a manual weekend car (m240) and a DSG Cupra as a family car.

The question is whether to get a ST or hatch to replace the Golf. The ST is the most practical choice of course, but I don't want to sacrifice performance. Jordi Gené said that the aero on the ST is better then the hatch, but I can't find any real numbers on that.

 

[Damo H]

That's good the hear. Are these upgraded clutches not good for daily use?

I believe some are, think its a paddle one that's still stock feeling, think the make was RTS.

But I'm far from an expert on them.

 

[Cupracabra]

Have you guys seen any Cupra ST Vs Cupra, 100-200km/h times for FWD?

 

[Cupracabra]

I have made up my mind regarding the hatch vs estate question. I will get an estate and replace my Golf. I will keep the M240i for now as my weekend/daily car when my wife needs the Cupra.

The final decision is between a manual and DSG. My wife will probably drive the Cupra as much as I do. She can drive stick, but definitely prefer an auto.
I really want a "high" hp FWD manual car, but I know the DSG will be a lot better as a daily. And I can always replace the M240i with something manual down the line. But FWD is more fun to drive with a manual then a RWD with a manual (had a 335i manual before). My heart says a manual Cupra and my brain says DSG.

I will tune it so an upgraded clutch is definitely needed if I go with the manual. Perhaps that will make it a worse daily if I don't find the perfect replacement.

 

[Peller]

I have made up my mind regarding the hatch vs estate question. I will get an estate and replace my Golf. I will keep the M240i for now as my weekend/daily car when my wife needs the Cupra.

The final decision is between a manual and DSG. My wife will probably drive the Cupra as much as I do. She can drive stick, but definitely prefer an auto.
I really want a "high" hp FWD manual car, but I know the DSG will be a lot better as a daily. And I can always replace the M240i with something manual down the line. But FWD is more fun to drive with a manual then a RWD with a manual (had a 335i manual before). My heart says a manual Cupra and my brain says DSG.

I will tune it so an upgraded clutch is definitely needed if I go with the manual. Perhaps that will make it a worse daily if I don't find the perfect replacement.

Do what I did, get a BMW 340i Estate, best of all worlds. You will not find a better car. Period

Sent from my moto g31(w) using Tapatalk

 

[black_sheep]

Do what I did, get a BMW 340i Estate, best of all worlds. You will not find a better car. Period

Sent from my moto g31(w) using Tapatalk

Sorry to hijack the OPs thread. I've been looking at M340i estates, but am tempted by the 840i. Similar price for 18-24 month models, so heavily depreciated 8 series looks good value.

 

[SuperV8]

Sorry to hijack the OPs thread. I've been looking at M340i estates, but am tempted by the 840i. Similar price for 18-24 month models, so heavily depreciated 8 series looks good value.

I've spent a lot a time/miles in a 330e (2017) the end of last year - lovely car, lovely steering BUT the suspension was way to hard for me as a daily driver - This car had the m-sport suspension & brakes. On a rare (in the UK) nice smooth road is was lovely - but the majority of the roads are not and I was glad to hand the keys back, long journeys were tiering.

 

[black_sheep]

I've spent a lot a time/miles in a 330e (2017) the end of last year - lovely car, lovely steering BUT the suspension was way to hard for me as a daily driver - This car had the m-sport suspension & brakes. On a rare (in the UK) nice smooth road is was lovely - but the majority of the roads are not and I was glad to hand the keys back, long journeys were tiering.

My wife has a F31 2019 320d with M Sport suspension, 19" wheels/RFT tyres and brakes and find it so much more forgiving than the Cupra, hence the bias for the next car.

 

[SuperV8]

My wife has a F31 2019 320d with M Sport suspension, 19" wheels/RFT tyres and brakes and find it so much more forgiving than the Cupra, hence the bias for the next car.

Interesting, I haven't driven a Cupra so don't have that for a frame of reference.
It was the pitching moment on rutted motorways I found unbearable. Maybe i'm just getting old
Does your F31 have Adaptive M Sport Suspension? or passive?

 

[black_sheep]

Interesting, I haven't driven a Cupra so don't have that for a frame of reference.
It was the pitching moment on rutted motorways I found unbearable. Maybe i'm just getting old
Does your F31 have Adaptive M Sport Suspension? or passive?

Both the Cupra and the 3 Series have the adaptive suspension. The adaptive suspension on the 3 Series wasn't listed on the options when we bought it, but can be configured via the iDrive.

 

[SuperV8]

Both the Cupra and the 3 Series have the adaptive suspension. The adaptive suspension on the 3 Series wasn't listed on the options when we bought it, but can be configured via the iDrive.

The 3 series I drove had passive M sport suspension.
I have not driven the adaptive suspension version but there are some reviews comparing both and they tend to suggest the adaptive is nicer/less bumpy/less tiring.

 

[Peller]

I did see some great lease deals on the 840i, they had 10 cars up on offer. Folk on Pistonheads were trolling them! The eventual asking price was near £800 p/m

Sorry to hijack the OPs thread. I've been looking at M340i estates, but am tempted by the 840i. Similar price for 18-24 month models, so heavily depreciated 8 series looks good value.