cupra wins again in this weeks auto express

[garry H bird]

having brought this weeks auto express yesterday the cupra wins again on there group gti test against the new club sport golf gti and the Honda civic type r just shows how good the cupra is even with the civic punching out over 300bhp and the silly expensive club sport
now come on seat give us a cupra r with 4 wheel drive and stick the bi-turbo diesel engine in a FR or a cupra diesel to blow the GTD away
cheers all

 

[MATTCR]

It's an awesome car. I agree, 4WD would make it even better.

 

[garry H bird]

it would be my choice every time
cheers

 

[Damo H]

Can't ever see the Leon getting AWD, would be to close to the Golf R or end up being better. Besides apart from 0-60, the Cupra is quicker than the Golf R. Just watch YouTube


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[Trettiosjuan]

now come on seat give us...

Most probably not for them to give, it's a small miracle already that VAG allowed the Cupra to be built while they even limit power on the more recent clubsport...

As for 4wd... Want it, get a Golf R. Safer just as its image, quicker of the line but not necessarily 'better' imo

 

[garry H bird]

Hi Trettiosjuan its no miracle... the cupra and the ibiza as been around for a long time under the vag group Ibiza and leon again with more power than the polo gti and golf gti so I beg to differ on this
lets all wait and see we can only hope on our wish list.

have a great day
cheers

 

[Trettiosjuan]

I know Cupra history very well, doesn't mean we should take it for granted and assume we could get even more...

 

[Damo H]

The GTi is no longer VW's uber model, it's the R. Plus you have to consider Audi and its RS3.

By that reasoning, what to stop them giving Skoda's Octavia more power and 4WD. Just isn't going to happen.


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[Trettiosjuan]

It's all about positioning with variables of production numbers, brand strength, willingness to pay and ultimately profit. Current positioning makes good sense and makes that each model appeals to different buyers and thus reinforces total sales. If they compete too much internally, the mother company looses out...

 

[ukoldschool]

or a cupra diesel to blow the GTD away
cheers all

You mean the 184 golf GTD? a bit like the 184 Leon FR which has exactly the same engine and chassis?

 

[YerMaw]

Currently i own a mk7 Golf R and I don't agree that 4wd would make the Cupra better. It would make it different, not necessarily better.

It would become a launch rocket just like the R but on the roll it would be less lively and definitely feel slower. As it stands the cupra falls into the bracket of the VAG groups fastest fwd car. Stick 4wd in it and I imagine it would be 3rd best behind the golf and the S3.

VAG carefully plan their product hierarchy and have just about every base covered.

 

[Trettiosjuan]

Currently i own a mk7 Golf R and I don't agree that 4wd would make the Cupra better. It would make it different, not necessarily better.

It would become a launch rocket just like the R but on the roll it would be less lively and definitely feel slower. As it stands the cupra falls into the bracket of the VAG groups fastest fwd car. Stick 4wd in it and I imagine it would be 3rd best behind the golf and the S3.

VAG carefully plan their product hierarchy and have just about every base covered.

Agree 100%

 

[Damo H]

Currently i own a mk7 Golf R and I don't agree that 4wd would make the Cupra better. It would make it different, not necessarily better.

It would become a launch rocket just like the R but on the roll it would be less lively and definitely feel slower. As it stands the cupra falls into the bracket of the VAG groups fastest fwd car. Stick 4wd in it and I imagine it would be 3rd best behind the golf and the S3.

Depends what you mean by best? Quality of interior, materials used, maybe, however I refuse to believe it would come in 3rd place in driver enjoyment behind the Audi S3 borefest.

VAG carefully plan their product hierarchy and have just about every base covered.

100% agree, we'll never find out if a 4WD Cupra is as boring as an S3 or more fun than an R.



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[YerMaw]

The facelift S3 is better...... but still not as good when pushed as the R is.

It always amazed me how Audi managed to take almost exactly the same pile of bits, put them together in the same order, yet end up with a car that had such a different character to the Golf. I can understand the Seat feeling different due to the difference in drive train.

The next 12 months could be interesting with the Seat and VW having facelifts. Rumour is that the R won't be getting the power hike of the S3 when it's facelifted. Not sure what that will mean for the Seat and I'm not sure if there will be a Cupra R as I'm sure the R400 project was shelved after the emissions scandal.

 

[Lentäjä]

Has to be said that Leon Cupra, Golf R and pre-facelifted S3 has the same engine, identical power figures, only difference it marketing on paper.
That is why Cupra does beat S3 and R on any gear at any speed.

R and S3 are only quicker around corners when it's damp, wet or snow.

 

[Major Tom]

I test drove a Golf R and think that the butt dyno feels as if the 4WD puts the power down much better than the Cupra, even in dry and about 100 km/h. A bit unfair comparison though, Cupra ST manual with box vs stock Golf R DSG. Love the Cupra though, just saying that you should drive em both and not just rely on what people say.

 

[Seastormer]

Drove the Golf R7 and new Civic type R and the 280 was better everywhere on the dry country roads I used then on.

 

[JMAC]

The GTi is no longer VW's uber model, it's the R. Plus you have to consider Audi and its RS3.

By that reasoning, what to stop them giving Skoda's Octavia more power and 4WD. Just isn't going to happen.


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You can get a 4wd version of the vRS. Just needs an extra 50bhp....REVO

 

[Damo H]

You can get a 4wd version of the vRS. Just needs an extra 50bhp....REVO

You are right but it's only available as a diesel so only 184bhp to start with. :-/


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[YerMaw]

The haldex 4wd system in the R and S3 doesn't greatly improve lateral grip for cornering. The VAQ differential in the Cupra and GTi does a better job here in my view and I stand by that for a lot of weather/road conditions. The current generation of haldex 4wd is better and more intelligent than ever before but it still doesn't have the ability to transfer power across the axel which is always of more benefit when we are talking about lateral forces. If you push hard into a corner in the R you will under steer, if you keep your nerve and push on you can feel the power shift and the back start to push the front in. It does feel very "hand of god" like and it does take a lot of nerve to have that faith. I sometimes think that VWs decision to fit crappy bridgestones to the R was a master stroke as the low grip threshold prevents most from driving near the point where the haldex has to do anything that remarkable in a corner.

The Haldex comes into it's own when we are talking off the line acceleration. it may be better in the wet when rolling as well but it does also add weight and the 4wd brings an element of transmission loss over the 2wd. Most R owners will happily admit that the mid range does feel slightly sluggish.

In terms of snow the haldex is great for getting you moving via pure brute force. Don't expect to stop or steer unless of course you have winters on, you are effectively sledging once going. My M135i on winters was much better in snow than the R on regular tyres. Probably quite an obvious statement.

I sound like I hate it but i really don't. The haldex 4wd has it's pros and cons as does FWD.