Got me thinking....the strive for Power

[Grayboy]

The Thread about the 4 branch has got my old grey matter going over the Engine tuning, the lump is an ABF on 118K and although it has a FSH the previous owners haven't been the most mechanically sympathetic so thinking full on re-build (rings, bearing etc) will be needed so whilst at it I'm thinking,

Head flow £350 (12-15HP)
Machine throttle body £100 (2-3BHP more for responsiveness)
4-Branch £350 (8-10)
100 CEL CAT £150 (1-2BHP)
Cam's £400 (10-12BHP)
BMC CDA Airbox with Metal ind pipe (£300 3-4 BHP)
Stainless Exh (already got 2-3BHP)
Remap £400 (12-15BHP)

So £2,050 parts
£100 for little bits
£200 for samco hoses
£750 for consumables re-build??

so over £3,000 for between 50-65BHP but combined with 3.94 final drive and LSD & well setup chassis should make for a seriously fun car (& modern hot hatch beater) all for incl chassis for about £6K including buying it in the first place

Main question is this a realistic Budget & Power figure?!?!?!?

I'm looking to add as little weight to the car as poss hence wanting to tune the std engine, not looking for massive power (around the 200BHP mark) as it'll be my runabout for the long term (unless those numbers come up) so needs to always start and not be a pig to drive!

I know people will suggest supercharge it but won't have the time to do anything myself by then as will be headlong into a new job with lots of travel, plus from what I'm reading for total reliability will be about the same cost especially if I have to pay someone to do it?

Strictly are developing a Turbo conversion but still hush hush!

Didn't want to add the weight of a VR/R32 and the 20vt is again the same sort of dosh?



Could anyone that's tuned the ABF especially, converted or charged their MK2 give me why they chose that route, how (links would be fine), and the pro's and con's of actual driving, (tourqe steer, understeer, small powerband) etc) plus costs of what they did??

 

[Roelích]

A higly tuned n/a engine wins for me everytime.

It's just a money pit.

I say go for TB's.

 

[Fl@pper]

t/bodies

will save £100 on machining the old one and replace the cat with a pipe and refit it for mot later

save even more money and weight

 

[F2 Ed]

throttle bodies

forget remap, you need a new ECU mate

 

[Cupra Kid]

I know people will suggest supercharge it but won't have the time to do anything myself by then as will be headlong into a new job with lots of travel, plus from what I'm reading for total reliability will be about the same cost especially if I have to pay someone to do it?

If you want total reliability you don't want to be doing anything to a valver!

 

[Chrisdaman]

this is why i'm S/C the valver, it's slightly cheaper than tuning the N/A engine lol

 

[Fl@pper]

If you want total reliability you don't want to be doing anything to a valver!

ill second that - buy a motorbike

 

[Czechboy]

ill second that - buy a motorbike

^^^ The man know what he's talking about, get a bike

 

[Grayboy]

Thanks for the thoughts guys.

Looks like the it's going to be a money pit or 20vt route then as with the engine unless I do a re-build there's no point, it's done 118K with mediocre maintenance so bolting on a charger/Turbo will no doubt blow it to bits!

again Throttle bodies love them but again it'll be like sticking lipstick on a pig!

Maybe Total reliability was the wrong phrase if I wanted that I'd buy a 1.0 rice mobil what I meant was I can't have a car that's temprimental!!!

So would 200HP be acievacle?

 

[Gm8]

well if ya wanna spend money money what about a vr32 lump and 4wd

 

[Dave_R]

you wont see 50-65bhp with them mods... the most I have seen from just head, cams and remap was 196 bhp and that was on vortex forum. With a Schrick inlet cam and a stock outlet cam.

Machine throttle body £100 , I paid very little to get the tapper machined out!!! I have spent roughly £2k on my engine when I went to Stealth Racing

If you want 200+ bhp then it's either tb's, supercharge or turbo!

Or different engine, 20vT and play with that or VR6 and bolt a supercharge kit on her!

Oh and a Sports Cat... nah! I did that 1st of all and then went for a de cat, much better!

Think about a 20vT, look at Roly... I think after he brought the car and took the bits he wanted then sold the bits he didn't need he broke even, so didn't really pay anything for the swap just hard work himself!

 

[ste4232]

i charged mine for £500 - £600 but all my own work, so no labour and i have 2nd car so when i had teething issues, just park up and use my densil run about.

Id love N/A with boddies, less weight and the noise!

 

[Roelích]

Thanks for the thoughts guys.

Looks like the it's going to be a money pit or 20vt route then as with the engine unless I do a re-build there's no point, it's done 118K with mediocre maintenance so bolting on a charger/Turbo will no doubt blow it to bits!

The ABF is a very strong engine, among the strongest non-diesel lump VW have ever made.

I think it could handle TB's. Just give it a good service inc. HT lreads, cambelt, rotor arm, etc,.

 

[Dave_R]

With tb's you be safer doing the bottom end. Look at F2Stu's

 

[Dave_R]

If you want total reliability you don't want to be doing anything to a valver!

Why? Mine is no longer standard and is just as reliable as when I 1st got it!

Only had the common faults, which we all had! If you haven't tuned one... how can you know?

 

[Grayboy]

This does seem to be the flaw of the MK2, gaining power is fooking expensive!!

Yeah Throttle bodies are not really an option for that reason you need to strengthen the bottom end, so all in it'd be £5K minimum without a 4 branch, head cams etc!!!

Don't really have time or second car to charge or alike myself!

Spending the day tomorrow giving it a good old service & changing the sump and rocker seals, been off the road for 8 weeks dying to drive her again!

going to see how it goes cash wise over the next few months get the Chassis done and then weigh up my options,

I know of an 230+ TB'd ABF that's surplus to requirements but the fella spent £7K+ building it and will only accept offers and won't give an idea of what he'll part with it for, I'm going top break him down some day!

cheers guys this was always going to be a can of worms lol

 

[ste4232]

ive had no relaibilty issues! 90K on clock, most hard driving and 5k charged and still even on std head gasket!

Simple rules like dont thrash until oil up to temp, service often, etc.

 

[Dave_R]

ive had no relaibilty issues! 90K on clock, most hard driving and 5k charged and still even on std head gasket!

Simple rules like dont thrash until oil up to temp, service often, etc.

Same here, I got 85k on the clock engine work was done at 67k..... let the oil warm up and I 'll rev it to 7k, thats the peak power after all

Had the engine done about two years ago now and have never missed a heart beat (touch wood).

 

[ste4232]

Same here, I got 85k on the clock engine work was done at 67k..... let the oil warm up and I 'll rev it to 7k, thats the peak power after all

Had the engine done about two years ago now and have never missed a heart beat (touch wood).

yup, ive got limiter raised to 7.5k and only hit 3 times in 5 years of thrash. anything about 7k tails off anyway.

I brought with 40k on clock and engine already had cams, etc and had been driven hard by last owner too. i think they good solid engines!

Ive had 2 std clutches and 1 new gear box and 3 snapped gear linkages. other than than its been sound thinking its been nurburg 4 times too thats quite impressive i think!

 

[Grayboy]

Same here, I got 85k on the clock engine work was done at 67k..... let the oil warm up and I 'll rev it to 7k, thats the peak power after all

Had the engine done about two years ago now and have never missed a heart beat (touch wood).

To be honest I thing a tuned ABF lump with around 190BHP and lower final drive should really be enough for my day to day car, want and Elise next year for proper driving!

ive had no relaibilty issues! 90K on clock, most hard driving and 5k charged and still even on std head gasket!

Simple rules like dont thrash until oil up to temp, service often, etc.

Rules I've lived by since before I had a licence, drive like your Nan till the oils up to temp!

These engines are tougher than I give them due for then!!!