Where are you in Yorkshire Jay?
I'm in Sheffield if you want a spin in my mapped Polo GTI.![[B)]](/forums/styles/seatcupra/oldforumsmileys/shades.gif "Cool [B)]")
Haha that would be epic mate, well im in leeds but i think a lil yorkshire remapped meet is in order
Jay
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JabbaSport Remap for 1.4 TSI(Take Two!)
- Thread starter Jay1990
- Start date
Haha that would be epic mate, well im in leeds but i think a lil yorkshire remapped meet is in order
Jay
Im half with you on this. Revo havnt really anything to gain from it, and seat/ vw have everything to lose. I think the updates that have been rolled out since my10/11 and the fixes seat are putting in old cars are working.
Jay
Revo went through three engines sorting out the mapping on the 1.4TSI and from what I hear fell out with VAG over it. So it was in their interest to sort it and as a company they couldn't sell a product if it wasn't fit for marketing. They use aggressive settings when testing to prove how far it is safe to take the engine and then pull back from the limit to what they see as a safe tune.
I agree, REVO understand this engine more than anyone now. They have pushed it to its limits, then extrapolated their maps, the OEM VAG map and all the logs etc to ascertain the true causes and failures (in their opinion of course) and brought out amended codes to reflect it.
So the question is, have other tuners got it right first time, or they soon to follow revos footsteps of engines going pop??
Looking at my dyno graph on stage 1 mine made 206.5bhp & 223lbft, so the torque figure is low on Jays map.
Haha that would be epic mate, well im in leeds but i think a lil yorkshire remapped meet is in order
Jay
^^^This is a great Idea
They obviously have no idea how to run the car on the dyno then, because of the 4 seperate ones i have used, they all managed to do it in 4th.
Using it in gear that is not a 1:1 ratio will potentially skew results. Post up your graphs. Its easy to see if the torque is way out.
HP at any given point = Torque x RPM ÷ 5252 and its pretty much bang on the money everytime as proven below.
Jasons stage 2 @ 5700rpm
Hp@5700rpm = (190lbft x 5700) / 5252 = 206Hp which is bang on what the graph says at that rpm
My stage 2 @ 6300rpm
Hp@6300 = (178lbft x 6300)/5252 = 213hp again bang on.
So essentially if the Hp is high, the rpm is also high as it is a function, if one goes up, so does the other and vice versa. hence why yours seems low, with what is a high Hp figure.
Using it in gear that is not a 1:1 ratio will potentially skew results. Post up your graphs. Its easy to see if the torque is way out.
HP at any given point = Torque x RPM ÷ 5252 and its pretty much bang on the money everytime as proven below.
Jasons stage 2 @ 5700rpm
Hp@5700rpm = (190lbft x 5700) / 5252 = 206Hp which is bang on what the graph says at that rpm
My stage 2 @ 6300rpm
Hp@6300 = (178lbft x 6300)/5252 = 213hp again bang on.
So essentially if the Hp is high, the rpm is also high as it is a function, if one goes up, so does the other and vice versa. hence why yours seems low, with what is a high Hp figure.
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The graphs are on my works pc but i'm going down tomorrow so will ask them about it and get them to do a run in 4th for you guys. They ran it in fourth and got different figures but said that there computer/dyno was saying it was too short. I dont know about it, Im not there at the moment.
As Ive said I would rather trust someone else's dyno(goes for any tuners like AMD ect) anyway and will be going to RSTuning. but at the end of the day its just figures and so long as it drives right thats all that matters. I read a thread the other day on here about awsome gti I think they had a RR day and everyone has massive torque figures and everyone was going on about it as well.
As Ive said I would rather trust someone else's dyno(goes for any tuners like AMD ect) anyway and will be going to RSTuning. but at the end of the day its just figures and so long as it drives right thats all that matters. I read a thread the other day on here about awsome gti I think they had a RR day and everyone has massive torque figures and everyone was going on about it as well.
With a troublesome engine as this seems to be, it needs to be right & not just a bought in map too though.
Granted you can't take number too seriously, because of the dyno variances, but then again if they've invested their time actually developing the map, they'd just as well not bother if it's under performing.
REVO and SEAT should work together to solve this, SEAT pays REVO for the fix and we costumers getting free remaps
They do in a way. Revos cupra blew a piston and they had a falling out with seat over it refusing to repair under warrenty. They needed to prove it so went through the entire code with a fine tooth comb. After finding out some of the coding was causing exessive heat buildup and there are rumours of deliberate bore wash written into the seat code to bring block temps down, they gave the info to seat. A month or two later there was an update available which revo said was a step in the right direction. Coincedene?
I understand that but I asked them not to take torque too far. I didn't realise all you lot were getting 220+ ft/lb from stage1's thats a (in my eyes) big jump from around 185ft/lb. I emailed them saying I was expecting around 200-210 and a similar torque figure, so maybe they can make it more aggressive and they havnt went all out on it?
Well I will try get all the answers when I go down tomorrow.
Im pretty sure they havnt just stuck a map on it they found off the internet/ect. I was with them most of the day while they were looking at all the ecu hex codes(?) finding what maps were what ect. Im sure its kinda in their interest for this map to go well as otherwise they have wasted a week and will gain nothing from it?
Ive had one in the last 2k ish now. Would have been one every journey before so i do believe 100% the shorter plugs and new parameter code from revo is the solution. Ive been in contact with revo after that random misfire and they told me that if everything has been updated hardware wise from seat then the 1.5year of misfiring problems I've had has caused damage to the engine. They said i was probably in early stages of piston ring faliure brought on by the last 1.5years of borewash. I'd only just had the car back from seat though and they did a compression test and was fine. I spoke to someone at my seat garage whos worked on my car who asked me to check the oil for a thin layer of petrol and do a smell test. There was a definite smell of petrol and there was a layer on top idicating that the rings are failing(btw all the tsi's come with uprated piston rings since august). Reason the compression test didnt show anything before is because the engine is not under load. Compression test today showed cylinder 2 compression less than it should be, engine to be stripped tomorrow and hopfully will show cylinde/piston ware and I can get a new engine. My point is i believe its my engine now, not the map. So confident of this that if I get a new engine, I will be putting the revo plugs in with their new map.
Im only bringing the misfiring issue up because I dont want you to end up going through the crap I have over the last year or so and because revo have said there is a problem with the seat engine management code then im assuming that jabba would want to re write that too. Revo missed that bad code so theres no shame on them if they havnt realised it.
This is what I mean though torque and power are related. Higher power = higher torque. You have an alleged 211hp but with torque that seems comparatively low.
Well guys I've just got back from a nice long weekend drive up in the lake district(circa 300miles plus all the miles back from Jabbasport so done around 450miles so far), hence the no updates. No the cars not blown up or had any lights come on so far and no fault codes are apperaing on my OBD scanner ect. The car was ran again in 4th and 5th while I was down there and I am waiting on Kev to send me every dyno run that was done with the car (lots!) so I can post all the graphs up. The print out I have with me is in 5th and therefore is wrong according to you guys as the torque is lower than it should be and the power is high. When ran in 4th there is a marked torque increase for the first few thousand RPM.
Anyway, Figures are figures and no matter what there will always be arguments. At some point I will probs have it on RST's DD Rollers.
Kevin mentioned that the intake while much better than the standard Forge set up is causing a hold up at higher revs because of the filter's forge use and also because The pipework I have from grill to filter (all 3 inchs of it lol) isnt as wide as the gap that lets air in, I was aware of this but I need to design a grill intake set up to get the most air into the engine as possible.
So, How does it drive?
I have to say driving around normally the car is no different its really nice and just like a cupra is. first thing I noticed though is you get used to using a certain amount of throttle to pull out at junctions ect (more so in areas where you live) and I have noticed that the car felt like it was jumping more than I was pressing(ie, extra power) so You can feel it if you've driven the car lots. I took it for a test drive down @ Jabba on there nice open quiet roads and when you boot it there really is a bigger pull from the car, it doesn't slow up at all where as over NSL speed would start to taper off it still pulls strong into "you'll get into serious trouble" speeds. standstill starts are most impressive, its like the cupra we all know and love but with more- There is no discernible step where power snaps in its a very smooth progressive map and after driving the Fabia(64 rampaging horses...) around my perception of speed was altered massively, didnt take long to get used to it though and with the GF in she could tell when I was powering along that there was more going on under the bonnet than before.
On the motorway I had a bit of fun and ended up going faster than I had been before in the car, still not near its top speed but the way it got there was very impressive, can feel the extra power pushing through the wind at higher speeds.
Its unfavourably been wet and raining all weekend where we have been so its a bit dangerous/pointless to try time any events. Now im back in Leeds its slightly better. Ive been out and did a couple of runs with a half full tank and just myself in the car. I measured 0-60's before with my Scanner( with less petrol and the spare/tools out of the boot) so Have something to compare them by.
Standard 0-60/40-60mph with no spare/tools.
JabbaSport Remap and spare/tools in the car. (semi wet roads with wheelspin)
So if it was a dry day with a good start I can see quite big differences between standard and mapped. I havnt done any timed 50-70 ect times yet as its hard to find safe places to do so living in a city.
In conclusion, Im really enjoying the map and the car greatly, the extra ompff is great fun on country roads when you can get the power down and I havnt noticed any drop in mpg at all so far.
EDIT:
Also, I have to say a big Thank the Guys at Jabba- Kevin of course for mapping the car and also Mentioning that he has all the VAGCOM systems so I now have locking/unlocking confirmation, Bluetooth Music(not yet tested), No cornering fogs/reverse fogs. Kevin was a really nice guy and I asked to have it rolling roaded again so they had to move 4/5 cars out of the way for me with no fuss.
Jason
Anyway, Figures are figures and no matter what there will always be arguments. At some point I will probs have it on RST's DD Rollers.
Kevin mentioned that the intake while much better than the standard Forge set up is causing a hold up at higher revs because of the filter's forge use and also because The pipework I have from grill to filter (all 3 inchs of it lol) isnt as wide as the gap that lets air in, I was aware of this but I need to design a grill intake set up to get the most air into the engine as possible.
So, How does it drive?
I have to say driving around normally the car is no different its really nice and just like a cupra is. first thing I noticed though is you get used to using a certain amount of throttle to pull out at junctions ect (more so in areas where you live) and I have noticed that the car felt like it was jumping more than I was pressing(ie, extra power) so You can feel it if you've driven the car lots. I took it for a test drive down @ Jabba on there nice open quiet roads and when you boot it there really is a bigger pull from the car, it doesn't slow up at all where as over NSL speed would start to taper off it still pulls strong into "you'll get into serious trouble" speeds. standstill starts are most impressive, its like the cupra we all know and love but with more- There is no discernible step where power snaps in its a very smooth progressive map and after driving the Fabia(64 rampaging horses...) around my perception of speed was altered massively, didnt take long to get used to it though and with the GF in she could tell when I was powering along that there was more going on under the bonnet than before.
On the motorway I had a bit of fun and ended up going faster than I had been before in the car, still not near its top speed but the way it got there was very impressive, can feel the extra power pushing through the wind at higher speeds.
Its unfavourably been wet and raining all weekend where we have been so its a bit dangerous/pointless to try time any events. Now im back in Leeds its slightly better. Ive been out and did a couple of runs with a half full tank and just myself in the car. I measured 0-60's before with my Scanner( with less petrol and the spare/tools out of the boot) so Have something to compare them by.
Standard 0-60/40-60mph with no spare/tools.
JabbaSport Remap and spare/tools in the car. (semi wet roads with wheelspin)
So if it was a dry day with a good start I can see quite big differences between standard and mapped. I havnt done any timed 50-70 ect times yet as its hard to find safe places to do so living in a city.
In conclusion, Im really enjoying the map and the car greatly, the extra ompff is great fun on country roads when you can get the power down and I havnt noticed any drop in mpg at all so far.
EDIT:
Also, I have to say a big Thank the Guys at Jabba- Kevin of course for mapping the car and also Mentioning that he has all the VAGCOM systems so I now have locking/unlocking confirmation, Bluetooth Music(not yet tested), No cornering fogs/reverse fogs. Kevin was a really nice guy and I asked to have it rolling roaded again so they had to move 4/5 cars out of the way for me with no fuss.
Jason
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