PD150 Timing

S10EAT

Active Member
Jul 31, 2010
401
8
Eastbourne
Just a quick question, what should a healthy PD150's timing be in VAG-COM?

Because mine is looking a little advanced but haven't got anything else to compare it to!



Could this be the reason for my lack of power?

Thanks,

S10EAT
 
Jan 28, 2009
703
1
Glasgow
I did this last night but will have to do it again as I lost the screenshot I had!! Doh!

What should I be seeing on a healthy engine then?

I do remember roughly what figures it had.
Your timing could be spot on but you may not have a healthy engine.
Do you remember what your syncro angle was?
 

S10EAT

Active Member
Jul 31, 2010
401
8
Eastbourne
Yes I do actually it was definitely out of spec, -1.1 if I remember correctly, specified is between -3.3 and something else? Thanks
 
Jan 28, 2009
703
1
Glasgow
-1.1 is ok to be honest. Any less and your belt would be stretching under load. Try get some data and post it up.
What symptoms are you experiencing with the car?
 
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S10EAT

Active Member
Jul 31, 2010
401
8
Eastbourne
Symptoms: Shocking MPG: 32-38 no matter even if driven like a granny!! Stuttering at around 2500 rpm when putting your foot to the accerelator. It's had an oil and filter change in the last 1000 miles and it's still crap, best mpg I've achieved so far is 43 mpg and that was on a very long run.

Feels like it's lacking power fuel related possibly hence I was looking into timing as the cause.
 
Jan 28, 2009
703
1
Glasgow
Your boost log is absolutely fine, everything else inc timing looks good too apart from inj quantity.
Regarding inj quantity the deviation you see is the correction or adjustment that your ECU makes to maintain smooth idle. Normally if the correction that the ECU makes is too high then that generally points to the injectors having troubles or a worn CAM.
Usually when the correction factor is greater or equal to a value of 1.0 mg/stroke (positive or negative) you will generally begin to notice some operational issues like what your describing.

Have you run a diesel purge? When was the last time you changed your fuel filter?
If you have not done any of these recently (last 10k miles) then I would firstly change the fuel filter, and do a diesel purge (liqui moly is what I use). And fill the fuel filter with liqui moly (or some other additive) bleed it and run the car. Check out values after a little running and see if its improved.

Secondly I would look at your CAM to see if its ok (looking very closely at the #4 cylinder lobes - the exhaust lobe usually goes first).
Then I would do a compression check (or can be done before inspecting CAM). If these are all good, then I'd say its time to start looking at possible injector(s) issues.
Thanks
 

S10EAT

Active Member
Jul 31, 2010
401
8
Eastbourne
So the positive figure on injector 4 is signs of wear or damage to cam lobes.

I ran some liqui moly diesel purge through the system about 1500 miles ago, fuel filter is about 6000 miles old, air filter is new.

So you reckon I should run another lot of it in the fuel filter (In the tank last time) then change the filter then?

Would a dodgy glow plug on injector four cause bad injector spray? Only reason I ask is the EML came on recently for an electrical fault with glow plug 4, before this light though that figure was still high, if it's not working then could it be causing soot build up on startup, without the glow plug to assist?

Many thanks for the useful info!!! Much appreciated.
 
Jan 28, 2009
703
1
Glasgow
Lol at the graph, that's for older engines like mine :D

But anyway you can check the cam for wear

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/camshaft-inspection-replace-vw-tdi.htm

Other thing is the injector loom, fitted a new one to friends AJM PD115 and it fairly made a difference to the thing. Injector balance was spot on, throttle pedal response was improved, mpg and power.
Very good point...I've seen this cause issues, although quite rear I wouldn't rule it out.
 

S10EAT

Active Member
Jul 31, 2010
401
8
Eastbourne
Lol at the graph, that's for older engines like mine :D

But anyway you can check the cam for wear

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/camshaft-inspection-replace-vw-tdi.htm

Other thing is the injector loom, fitted a new one to friends AJM PD115 and it fairly made a difference to the thing. Injector balance was spot on, throttle pedal response was improved, mpg and power.
I'm still adjusting to the pd engines mate! Don't know what knowledge or techniques I can use for what i used to use on my common rail diesel before this one!

Injector loom is an interesting suggestion, was your friends a bit stuttery through the revs?

Can anyone comment on my previous post about glow plug no 4 and whether if this hasn't been warming up cylinder four properly for a while perhaps its more sooty than the rest of the cylinders? Just a theory!

Thanks,
 
Jan 28, 2009
703
1
Glasgow
Unlikely, this seems more like a fuel issue.
Easy to remove the glow plugs, switch 3 with 4 use deep 10mm socket to remove the plugs. Check for yourself, start eliminating things one by one.
 

Seatmann

Rough around the edges
Sep 16, 2010
5,571
9
Scotlanda
Basically a diesel works by compressing air to such a degree that the air is red hot, then fuel is injected into the hot air and explodes on contact. The glow plugs are just there for when the engine is really cold, just to give it a little help warming up and burning the fuel while it's warming up.

Not sure about the stutter but his was just lacking all round really. It's just looking at your group 13, there seems to be a bit of variance between the injectors. After fitting his new loom all the injector readings were identical.

I'm not saying that's what the problem is with yours but worth googling around for more info on it.
 

S10EAT

Active Member
Jul 31, 2010
401
8
Eastbourne
Well i have an update to this.

Recently i've used liqui moly diesel purge, I've had a terraclean done on the engine and I've just replaced the injector loom with a brand new one.

Just been for a test drive, loom seems to have made a difference to pick up and smoothness but the injector balance has remained roughly the same.

0.02,-0.61,-0.89,1.46

I had a look for cam wear while i had the cam cover off and by the looks of things the cam is all shiny and no signs of scrapes/scratches, so thats good news.

Am i right in thinking now that this must be injector 4 needs replacing/balancing?

Many Thanks,

S10EAT
 
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