A little help/advice please guys

N3V3T2

Guest
Hi all,

I'll be attending my first track day in August, at Donnigton, and due to male bravado and winding up between my mates and i there is quite a lot of bragging rights at stake. I would like to make sure the LCR is the quickest out if the 4 cars there. The car is pretty much standard, running Goodyear Eagles all round but with DS2500's on the front with EBC grooved and dimpled discs on the front (standard on the rear) and super dot4 brake fluid. I should have a stage 1 chip (either REVO or Jabbasport i thnk).
What i need to know is have i got a chance against a standard Honda S2000, a Jap import Honda Integra type R (210 BHP) and a slightly track prepared Pug 309 GTI ( nearly standard engine but stripped out, lowered and running semi slicks)?
If i haven't what do i need to do to give myself a chance? not spending too much money and not invalidating insurance if possible, obviously being faster is more important so I might have to do whatever is needed. It would stop some abuse about the LCR being just a cheap golf and not handling, which would be very nice

thanks
Steve
 
The only things you can do that won't invalidate insurance (since any modification will invalidate insurance) is probably to strip out anything you don't need. Lose all dead weight.

Use the most bang-for-buck petrol you can get your hands on but the least that you can get away with...

And make sure the other drivers have a couple of drinks before they get out on the track ;)

Technical stuff will be wasted if you don't want to make alterations to your insurance - although apparently a lot of companies are letting people off with minor modifications without charging extra.
 
Poss suspension changes, but you should have the 'Teg and the 309 without too much grief!
S2000 may be a diff story, how good is the driver, round a track the are ok, but if the are in the right hands they can be very good!
You'll prob just have with him on the straights but think he'll make up some time in the bends, just my guess!
 
Having chased an S2000 round Donnington in a Revo'd LCR I can tell you that you will have your work cut out. The other driver was probably better than me too.

My first purchases would be a strut brace, set of anti-roll bars and a remap.

EDIT*
Also one tip.... take a tyre pressure gauge and pump, check your pressures after your first session (they will be way high) and let some air out to suit........you'll need the pump for the drive home to make sure they are back to normal road pressures.
 
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I was thinking about strut braces and anti-roll bars, as these can be removed fairly easily and the insurance will never know, that was more what i was thinking when i said not invalidate insurance. I just didn't want the answer of "get an FMI and as exhaust and get the head skimmed" type of answer. Will an ARB make much difference or would i be wasting my time? do I need an expensive one or will a cheap one do? so many questions, so many possibilities yet so little time.

Thanks for your help so far,

Steve.
 
Biggest suggestion I'd offer is to not go to your first track day looking for a **** waving contest, it will end in tears. The LCR is too fat and heavy to cut it on the track in any significant way, especially when compared to the cars you've mentioned (even more so if your mates are familiar with the track or just being on track). Take your time, build pace gradually, and if there is instruction on offer, get some. You won't feel much of a hero when you've spanked your pride & joy.
 
Have to agree with Paul above, tracking a car is a risky business, of which you meationed you didnt wanna put anything on that will invalidate your insurance... by being on track might invalidate your insurance, did you know that... !? and also are you going to get insurance for that day on the Leon...Track Use insurance i mean?
 
If it's an open track make sure you dont go out at the same time as your "mates", if it's sessions or you find yourself out at the same time as your mates then dont get within 300mtr of them ... one than that will get you is trying to race.

The difference on your first track day is like going from a 1.8 deisel Lada to the LCR - you will brick yourself on how different it is from normal roads.........

For learning see if you can find someone that will give you a few passenger laps first, then find a slower car (yes SLOWER!!!!) and ask them if you can follow them around for a few laps to learn a bit more about the "racing line" and braking points - then after that go out and have fun :)

But as others have said, do not try racing/beating anyone else on your first track day... it wont end well.........

As for making yor car go better on the day ..... again as others have said Tyre preasures when warm and the best fuel you can get. also clean the throttle-body the day before, check ALL fluid levels, calabrate the TB after cleaning, check air filter for crud, wheel bolts are tight (before. DURING and after the day) and even the wheel hub bolt is OK (i generate that much heat i loosen mine off when on-track!!!).

Also when you come off the track - stick a stone/wedge under the rear wheel DO NOT use the handbrake and open the bonnet & put the A/C ON to let the extra heat get out (why A/C on - have a search).

Enjoy :)


Dave
 
I have checked with the insurance and was told that I was insured to the track, and from the track, but not whilst on the rack, which is fair enough! and have been told by a friend (who works for an insurance company) that if i do crash, i should try to tow it away from the track then push it into a ditch, make a claim from that, i think this is a bit risky though, and quite stupid, but a thought.

I have had 10 laps of tuition round Silverstone, in a caterham, I know the leon will be very different from a 7, but like I have been recomended, I will start slow and quicken up through the day. I have also done a couple of track days on my bike round Donnington, so it's not an unfamiliar track, i just need to learn the lines from a cars point of view rather than from a bike.

Tyre pressures have been mentioned a lot but no-one has said what pressures to run (sorry if I have missed that bit) standard pressures but just keep adjusting for the increase with heat?

I have done a search for the A/C advice but haven't been able to dig up anything, I'm normally pretty good with the search function, most questions I have I can find answers to so can you explain? I would have thought that the A/C would put extra load on the engine and create heat, maybe cooling the engine and turbo down more slowly but that's all i can think of, sorry.

Thanks again guys
 
Hey - unusual for someone to have a go at searching on here, but by your comments you gave it a go & reasoned why should/not use A/C ... :)

When you come to a stop and the water in the car cools down enought the fans will stop - if you put the A/C on when you stop the fans will keep going so givving the water extra cooling :)

Some would say B/S to this, but i've tried it and it does work quite well, water temps come down quicker and stay down better.

As for tyres, just keep them at the standard pressures until you are used to the car enough that you will feel anything if/when changing them.

Good that you've been out on track before, how hard do you push when on 2-wheels ??


Dave
 
all those cars are very closely matched, what will seperate the cars is the driver, and the driver only. all 4 of those cars are reasonable weapons around the track, and fairly equally powered taking into account the power to weight ratio etc

whoever is the better driver will win the day
 
The best advice i can give is get an instructor to show you round it'll help you get your lines, tyres pressures should be lowered slightly in my experience but only by a 5-10 psi at most, as the heat generated by track use will cause them to rise.

Another mod worth trying, is some water wetter in the cooling system, this helps keep the cooling system temp down on heavy track use.

If you have the time to do some mods it's worth getting some ARB's & strut braces, which will help out no end.
 
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DodgyDave said:
Good that you've been out on track before, how hard do you push when on 2-wheels ??


Dave
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say i'm slow, no chicken strips and the knee has been known to touch the floor, but with 4 mates that race I know I am a long way off being quick, but i enjoy it and that is what I will hopefully get from tracking the LCR.

From the comments I'm getting it looks like a strut brace and ARB are needed, is this a case of needin both or does one make more difference than the other?

Only the 309 GTI has been on track before so there is similar experience with the other 2, that could mean that it all ends in tears:cry:, I'm just hoping to have fun, if I were to be quicker it would be a bonus and give me bragging rights. Hopefully I'll progress and may be i'll be good enough to do an SCN track day!!
 
Its a track day, not a test day! Get out of your head about being quickest or good enough, there is no bench mark to meet - only to make sure you enjoy yourself and learn some new things.

Donington in a car is very different to a bike. I did it the other way around, having done Donny around 12 or so times in the car before taking the bike up there for the firsttime. It felt like a totally different experience! Is it the full GP circuit or the club circuit? If its the full GP job, don't under estimate how hard the Melbourne Loop is on the brakes, that little bit of extra track causes the car considerably more grief than you can imagine. You've been braking hard for the Foggerty Esses, then braking hard again for the loop, then hard again for Goddards - its a brake killer for a heavy car! You get to Redgate and find the pedal goes to the floor. Trust me, the gravel there is deep ;)
 
Reg said:
Its a track day, not a test day! Get out of your head about being quickest or good enough, there is no bench mark to meet - only to make sure you enjoy yourself and learn some new things.

Donington in a car is very different to a bike. I did it the other way around, having done Donny around 12 or so times in the car before taking the bike up there for the firsttime. It felt like a totally different experience! Is it the full GP circuit or the club circuit? If its the full GP job, don't under estimate how hard the Melbourne Loop is on the brakes, that little bit of extra track causes the car considerably more grief than you can imagine. You've been braking hard for the Foggerty Esses, then braking hard again for the loop, then hard again for Goddards - its a brake killer for a heavy car! You get to Redgate and find the pedal goes to the floor. Trust me, the gravel there is deep ;)
Click to expand...

My brakes suffered around Donny and the disks warped like hell, they went back fine once back down to normal temps.

If you get a chance maybe look at changing the fluid to some decent Motul stuff, Bill at Badger5 supplied me with some excellent stuff.


N3V3T2 said:
From the comments I'm getting it looks like a strut brace and ARB are needed, is this a case of needin both or does one make more difference than the other?
Click to expand...

The ARB's will change the car massively but they are not cheap £300 - £350 for Neuspeed parts plus fitting and you need to advise your insurance company.

Depends whether you are serious about mod's or not......I get the impression you want cheap / quick fixes which TBH you are not going to get

TBH from what I have read above I'd take the jibes and mickey taking from my mates, keep a distance from them on track and try and learn and enjot the day as much as possible......If you go to the track with the attitude above (i.e, being quickest) you'll bin the car and it'll all end in tears
 
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Cupraloon said:
tyres pressures should be lowered slightly in my experience but only by a 5-10 psi at most, as the heat generated by track use will cause them to rise.
Click to expand...

If you mionitor the pressure after the first session and the pressure has risen from say 33 to 43 then I'd say look to take out 5-10psi......maybe experiment a bit

However 2 things;-

Remember when the tyres cool for the first lap back out you will effectively have underinflated tyres till the temps get back up i.e, less grip so be bl00dy carefull

And for the drive home put the pressures back up accordingly
 
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