12v vr6 swap?

[gingee_1mcupra]

So I have a mk1 leon cupra. The headgasket is on its way out and the engine is a bit tired being at 190k miles. Was looking into vr6 swap. Has anyone done it, does it fit easily or is it an expensive nightmare and I'm better off just rebuilding A 1.8t with maybe a couple of upgrades for power. Any help is appreciated!

 

[Alexis27]

Very possible, but they're expensive second hand - £900+. Would be more cost effective to just buy an R I would have thought.

 

[mty12345]

Tthe VR6 has less power and torque than the standard 180bhp curpa, and you have practically zero tuning options as it's a N/A motor. To fit it you're going to need to splice the VR6 loom and the cupra's loom together, plus add custom engine mounts, driveshafts and numerous other parts. It would be a **** load of work, and unless you have a LOT of electrical and mechanical skills, plus lots of time and money, then rebuilding the 1.8t is by far the best option.

Anything is possible with the 1.8t, Bill @badger5 just posted a video of a one making over 800hp the other day.

 

[gingee_1mcupra]

Very possible, but they're expensive second hand - £900+. Would be more cost effective to just buy an R I would have thought.

Yeah, whichever engine I end up getting, I will rebuild it completely before I fit it, it was either going to be an auq/bam 1.8t or a 12v vr6 because I love the noise of the vr6

 

[gingee_1mcupra]

Tthe VR6 has less power and torque than the standard 180bhp curpa, and you have practically zero tuning options as it's a N/A motor. To fit it you're going to need to splice the VR6 loom and the cupra's loom together, plus add custom engine mounts, driveshafts and numerous other parts. It would be a **** load of work, and unless you have a LOT of electrical and mechanical skills, plus lots of time and money, then rebuilding the 1.8t is by far the best option.

Anything is possible with the 1.8t, Bill @badger5 just posted a video of a one making over 800hp the other day.

I like to think I have the mechanical ability to do it being a mechanic, the splicing the loom is what I'm worried about. Also I'm aware its possible to get great power from the 1.8t, that's alot of money too. I appreciate the input though, the loom is something I hadn't thought about tbh

 

[mty12345]

I like to think I have the mechanical ability to do it being a mechanic, the splicing the loom is what I'm worried about. Also I'm aware its possible to get great power from the 1.8t, that's alot of money too. I appreciate the input though, the loom is something I hadn't thought about tbh

Yeah the electrical part is by far the hardest bit, as the VR6 ECU isn't going to comunicate with any of the other modules in the leon including the dash, abs and airbags etc. That would give you constant fault codes and would be a coding/electrical nightmare for a road car that has to be MOT'd etc.

Yeah i wouldn't suggest spending £20k on 800hp, but there are 1.8t builds for all budgets and power levels. One of the most catered for platforms out there.

 

[gingee_1mcupra]

Yeah the electrical part is by far the hardest bit, as the VR6 ECU isn't going to comunicate with any of the other modules in the leon including the dash, abs and airbags etc. That would give you constant fault codes and would be a coding/electrical nightmare for a road car that has to be MOT'd etc.

Yeah i wouldn't suggest spending £20k on 800hp, but there are 1.8t builds for all budgets and power levels. One of the most catered for platforms out there.

Yeah definitely, I do like the 1.8t platform and i have spoken to badger 5, they were saying for about 400hp reliably, I was looking at roughly 25-30k including all the supporting mods including boring it out to 1.9l. On the other hand, I have driven a mates mk3 vr6 with 509hp for about 15k. Obviously that doesn't include the price to swap the engine into the leon admittedly and I 100% agree that's gonna be a lot of money, time and effort and that's kind of what I'm trying to decide. Atm I think I'd be looking stock power for both engines(180hp for the cupra and roughly 230hp for obd2 2.8 vr6)

 

[mty12345]

From your original question, i assumed we we're talking about a home build costing a few grand, built by you in your garage/kitchen using second hand parts, not a 400bhp race engine built by the UKs best 1.8t tuner using top end, brand new parts!

A built 400hp motor and a stock AUQ are about as far apart as you can get. Two completely different ends of the spectrum, and little point spending money rebuilding a stock AUQ when those parts would have to be binned if you plan to build something hardcore like that. Same with the vr6, 509hp is obviously with a turbo conversion, so all the parts for that vs a stock one would also be completely different.

I think you need to work out what you are trying to achieve before you spend any money, and if you're gonna be spending upwards of £20k then you could easily buy a newer cupra and mod that to 400hp for way less than a mk1. They have bigger engines, bigger turbos and direct injection as standard.

 

[BadBoy03]

From your original question, i assumed we we're talking about a home build costing a few grand, built by you in your garage/kitchen using second hand parts, not a 400bhp race engine built by the UKs best 1.8t tuner using top end, brand new parts!

A built 400hp motor and a stock AUQ are about as far apart as you can get. Two completely different ends of the spectrum, and little point spending money rebuilding a stock AUQ when those parts would have to be binned if you plan to build something hardcore like that. Same with the vr6, 509hp is obviously with a turbo conversion, so all the parts for that vs a stock one would also be completely different.

I think you need to work out what you are trying to achieve before you spend any money, and if you're gonna be spending upwards of £20k then you could easily buy a newer cupra and mod that to 400hp for way less than a mk1. They have bigger engines, bigger turbos and direct injection as standard.

Sound advice as always from mty ?This man knows what he's talking about.
Mty can you just check over my car? ? ?

 

[gingee_1mcupra]

From your original question, i assumed we we're talking about a home build costing a few grand, built by you in your garage/kitchen using second hand parts, not a 400bhp race engine built by the UKs best 1.8t tuner using top end, brand new parts!

A built 400hp motor and a stock AUQ are about as far apart as you can get. Two completely different ends of the spectrum, and little point spending money rebuilding a stock AUQ when those parts would have to be binned if you plan to build something hardcore like that. Same with the vr6, 509hp is obviously with a turbo conversion, so all the parts for that vs a stock one would also be completely different.

I think you need to work out what you are trying to achieve before you spend any money, and if you're gonna be spending upwards of £20k then you could easily buy a newer cupra and mod that to 400hp for way less than a mk1. They have bigger engines, bigger turbos and direct injection as standard.

I am definitely talking about a homebuilt engine but with new parts as I plan on keeping the car for a very long time so I want to build the engine properly. I have just had my standard ko3s rebuilt so I don't want to go too far in terms of power. That was further solidified by the 20k price tag of a 400hp built mk1 leon.
As for what you were saying about spending the money doing it to a newer cupra. I don't like new cars that much and I am overly-attached to my little ginger mk1 leon and I want to see it fly like a rocket ship lol. I would definitely say that would be a good move for someone who is just chasing numbers though.
Maybe I will have the 1.8t for a while and then maybe 5 years down the line when I'm a bit of a better position I'll put the vr6 in it maybe even with a cheeky turbo lol.

 

[mty12345]

I am definitely talking about a homebuilt engine but with new parts as I plan on keeping the car for a very long time so I want to build the engine properly. I have just had my standard ko3s rebuilt so I don't want to go too far in terms of power. That was further solidified by the 20k price tag of a 400hp built mk1 leon.
As for what you were saying about spending the money doing it to a newer cupra. I don't like new cars that much and I am overly-attached to my little ginger mk1 leon and I want to see it fly like a rocket ship lol. I would definitely say that would be a good move for someone who is just chasing numbers though.
Maybe I will have the 1.8t for a while and then maybe 5 years down the line when I'm a bit of a better position I'll put the vr6 in it maybe even with a cheeky turbo lol.

Yeah i completely get what you mean, i love the mk1 too and have no plans to get rid of mine either.

If i was you i'd rebuild the AUQ to stage2+, with forged rods (and new pistons if you need them) Rebuild the head with decent valve gear, FMIC, and then either go for a K03 based hybrid using the existing set-up or upgrade to the BAM setup and use something K04 based. That way you'll have a nice driveable motor with a reliable 260-300bhp, and the internals will be ok if you choose to go big turbo later. If you did it all yourself i would guestimate you'd be looking around 4-5k for the parts.

 

[mty12345]

Sound advice as always from mty ?This man knows what he's talking about.
Mty can you just check over my car? ? ?

Pmsl, i think you know them as well as i do by now