DPF Experiences

[_Hellfire_]

Just Voted and...

I voted - no problems

Company (leased) vehicle)

Owned from new December 07 - currently 3500 mid-January 08.

Generally motorway driving - 4-5K month.

My driving style changes with my change in music - depends what I've got on at the time. More often than not - sedate 60-70 motorways, occasionally spirited driving upto 60 across the Pennines from Sheffield - Manchester. Occasionally spirited on the A69 to Scotland or the M56 to Wales... I cover the north half of Britain.

At the end of the day - I work for a major Automotive Supplier - if I have any problems with DPF it WILL be fixed by Seat 'under warranty' - we do not take kindly to being sold a Lemon.... enough said.

I will keep you informed if any problems arise.

Regards


Steve

 

[soupy1983]

In the last 2 weeks my light has came on 3 times, 2 of which sent the car into safe mode. Each time took back to the dealer and got the car re-gened. First time light came on, i did some research, one fella had his come on 9 times, threw the car back at the dealer, got a replacement car, light came on, kept driving to clear it then the filter overheated and set the car on fire, now in court with SEAT direct.

major design fault in the system. And what baffled me was i drive my car hard, and rev it out alot, and the light came on when cruising @ 80 on the motorway! But touch wood, the car has been grand since i last cleared the light

 

[FRTDI170]

Voted a while ago, but.....

Starting to think about what I'll do once warranty expires. Don't fancy getting hit with a £2000 bill out of the blue. Another 18 months left on warranty but thought I'd test drive a Cupra and see if it persuades me to change sooner

Booked in for Friday whilst they repair my near side wing mirror which is extremely temperamental when it comes to folding out on start up....

 

[MrEdge_]

I have a remapped FR TDI (estimated at 220 BHP / 425 Nm) and never had any trouble with the DPF.

 

[_Hellfire_]

I have a remapped FR TDI (estimated at 220 BHP / 425 Nm) and never had any trouble with the DPF.

Could you give me more details about the re-map please, I'm intrigued. What Chip, who did the fittng etc - TA!!

Steve

 

[MrEdge_]

I'm from Holland, so that's the first issue you'll have to overcome

Anyway, my dealer is a well known tuner in Holland. They're called DGM and offer this remap to 209 BHP / 425 Nm (measured on several TDI's).
It was a lot of work to remap, because of the DPF, the temperatures in the exhaust etc etc.

Some of the flow-probes in the exhaust system have been replaced by ones that are heat resistant. The whole procedure costs around 600 euro (dunno the euro/pound conversion rate at the moment) and you won't loose the warranty on your car.

Since the remap it drives like a petrol car. The turbo picks up at +/-1900 RPM instead of the original 2100 and lasts till it hits the red zone (you can pull to 5400 RPM but that's really no use). It's always responsive and extremely fast. It eats remapped Leon MK I FR TDI's for breakfast

And again: never had any trouble with the DPF

I've been driving it carefully and pushing the limits from time to time. When my car was serviced last week, the guy who tuned it told me (after a test drive) that he believes it will easily hit 220 BHP when measured. I'll do that this summer.

So anyway, if you're interested: www.seat-sport.nl is their site. Don't be fooled by the looks, they really know what they do.

 

[hundleton1]

From reading people who have problems with the DPF seem to have ongoing issues but some people never have problems at all, it does seem to be more of an issue with some cars more than others, i still have never seen the light and my mate who has had his since release has also never seen the light, and he drivers like a tart.

 

[SpursMadDave]

From reading people who have problems with the DPF seem to have ongoing issues but some people never have problems at all, it does seem to be more of an issue with some cars more than others, i still have never seen the light and my mate who has had his since release has also never seen the light, and he drivers like a tart.

I think you hit the nail on the head there, if you actually look at the figures from the poll 66% never seen the light and another 20% have seen it but it clears quickly, seeing as its seemingly an experimental thing that seems pretty good to me...

 

[SpursMadDave]

I'm from Holland, so that's the first issue you'll have to overcome

Anyway, my dealer is a well known tuner in Holland. They're called DGM and offer this remap to 209 BHP / 425 Nm (measured on several TDI's).
It was a lot of work to remap, because of the DPF, the temperatures in the exhaust etc etc.

Some of the flow-probes in the exhaust system have been replaced by ones that are heat resistant. The whole procedure costs around 600 euro (dunno the euro/pound conversion rate at the moment) and you won't loose the warranty on your car.

Since the remap it drives like a petrol car. The turbo picks up at +/-1900 RPM instead of the original 2100 and lasts till it hits the red zone (you can pull to 5400 RPM but that's really no use). It's always responsive and extremely fast. It eats remapped Leon MK I FR TDI's for breakfast

And again: never had any trouble with the DPF

I've been driving it carefully and pushing the limits from time to time. When my car was serviced last week, the guy who tuned it told me (after a test drive) that he believes it will easily hit 220 BHP when measured. I'll do that this summer.

So anyway, if you're interested: www.seat-sport.nl is their site. Don't be fooled by the looks, they really know what they do.

Two questions.... is your fuel economy any better/worse since the remap and i cant see a translation button on that site...

 

[mister.c.]

seeing as its seemingly an experimental thing that seems pretty good to me...

Given that Citroen / Peugeot first put them as standard fit on their cars in 2000, it would appear hardly an experimental piece of technology.

Well only in the backward world of VAG diesel design.

 

[Min Jeeta]

My 56 FR 170 is currently in the service center after going into limp mode with around 26k on the clock.

I generally drive it quite hard with regular trips of over 150 miles a day mainly on motorways or A roads.

My DPF light came on and as I had have this happen once before I knew the routine to clear it. After driving for sometime trying to clear the light at at rev's up to 3k, it decided to go into limp mode as I pulled away from a roundabout and lost power nearly causing an accident, I then had it towed to the Seat garage.

The car has been into the service center for a week know and I am not able to get an answer as to who is going to pay for this.

It is a private lease fully maintained, I had 3 days paid use of a hire vehicle and need my car for work daily, I am now paying for a hire car and a lease car and no closer to finding out when it will be back or who is paying for the hire and repair.

I am getting very very pi55ed of with this now
I do not consider the way I drive to be a prime candidate for this.
The last time it came on I had been sat i gridlock for 2-3hrs which I can understand causing a problem, it cleared no problem!

I have only just got the car back from the dealer after having 2 door control modules after the battery going completly dead 3 times.

Otherwise a good car


Update,
I now have the car back which after all the hassle did put a smile on my face.
The problem was caused by a sensor terminal plug getting wet, located beneath the air filter apparently.
maybe a common problem if people are getting intermittent faults.

 

[LeonGTI]

Hi there, having almost decided on the FR TDI over the TSI, i'm still a little concerned about the DPF issue. 65% have had no problems but thats still 35% that 'have seen the light'.

My drive is 15 miles each way to work across country roads (50-70mph) but tend to cruise in 6th for most of it. Is it advisable to go Diesel if this is gunna cause problems?

Thoughts asap please as can still change mind before lease deal is finalised.

Cheers

 

[AndyVTR]

30 miles a day I'd go petrol.

 

[JonoUK]

I'd go with AndyVTR. Petrol for me. You'll probably rarely get to 2k with that sort of driving. My car's barely warmed up after 15 miles, well 10 and 8 and a bit of those are on A roads. Usually stuck behind some nobber who thinks 35-40mph is fun.

With that kind of mileage you'd not really seen any benefit whatsoever from diseasel economy, and certainly not in the FR, whicih guzzles fuel when it's cold. At least mine does. Gives me up to and above 50mpg on my 35 mile each way commute, though (including the guzzling bit). Depends if the road's clear. I tend to always get 44 or so. Only once did I manage to make it not reach 40mpg on the run, that was a fun day

You should love your car, and the risk of DPF problems that you *might* encounter depending on how many sparrows were farting on the day it was built (or something like that) would probably ruin the enjoyment of it.

TFSI is where you should be heading, methinks.

 

[cambobfr]

Hey folks,
Had my TDi FR 2 weeks tomorrow. Picked it up used, one of those which was previously a company car to a Seat employee. 7600 on the clock.
I clicked on the 3rd option in the poll - Seen DPF light, had problems, clear DPF. In fact, the Emissions warning light came on about 3 miles after I picked it up! A week later the DPF light came on. Now then, just prior to buying the car, I seriously grilled the salesman over the DPF, and his fleet manager colleague and basically got them to
a) reassure me I was very unlikely to have problems with it and give me some statistics on failure (I almost had them giving me an oath over it!)
and
b) tell me that it *would* be covered by warranty!
So, when the DPF light came on I naturally reported the problem; the 1st attempted response was to say it was my driving style. Of course, having pre-read all about the DPF I was prepared for this promptly and purposely lost my rag on the phone (it does a lot of good, believe me!) and told them that you can't do 800 miles in a week and blame it on urban driving or driving style (I had them record the mileage when they took the car in to diagnose the fault to prove it).
They promptly booked it in and diagnosed it as a fault with a pressure sensor in the 'exhaust' - I believe they meant the sensor which is pretty much part of the DPF (I've seen the diagrams of the DPF). They couldn't source the part for two days and I had a lot of driving to do over the coming days including an airport run and I made that very clear to them - they told me it would be fine.
250 miles later, a little trip round town prompted the 'coil' warning lamp and loss of turbo.
I spoke to them over the phone with little success - the response was, drive it down the road a bit and call the breakdown assistance line (they won't pick you up from home) - that's the only way you'll get a replacement car for your airport run. Of course, when I started the car up again, it was fine. So, I figured, they're not gonna want me losing my rag in the showroom like I did on the phone and they were gonna have serious egg on the faces after the promises they'd made - so I drove over there.... damn were they nice to me! Take a seat sir, would you like a coffee? Our service manager will be over shortly. In the end, I spoke to the service manager and my salesman together - they moved my car to the top of the job list for the following morning when the sensor would arrive and promised it would be ready by mid-day (it was actually ready at 10:45!). The sales guy also said that I could borrow his car in the event that they couldn't fix mine. Result.

From all this, I would say, don't be afraid of the DPF problems, just be well armed. Get names! Ask them on the phone and if they've got an employee picture board in the showroom - take a look at it. Don't ever let them fob you off with 'driving style' or 'urban driving'. The car, *I know* can do approximately 1000 miles without regeneration (mine did) and it only takes 15mins of minimum 1400rpm at 50mph to clear the DPF and if you can't do that the car has a fail-safe where the ECU will override exhaust gas control to let extra heat into the DPF - it will attempt that at 60% saturation and will try for 30mins?(I'll check that!) One more thing, whilst talking to them I told them I knew the next stage after the coil lamp was going to be red lights, all stop! (in retrospect that actually means you probably need a new DPF - big job and expensive!) The guys almost went pale at that prospect.
My *only* worry is what the state of the DPF will be in 3 years time (after 3 years use) combined with being out of warranty at that time.

I've got a copy of the DPF training material (I probably shouldn't say where I got it) and I can scan and post the interesting bits if anyone's interested, and of course IF it doesn't infringe copyright.... I might have to paraphrase it instead? In essence tho', having read it, it should be pretty difficult for the car not to be able to perform regeneration. Most problems (I think, as someone has already suggested) seem to be caused by sensor malfunction (temperature in someone's case, pressure in mine).

All credit to my local dealer, Marshalls of Cambridge, who really pulled the stops out to get me back on the road and make sure I was covered for when I really needed a car. Great guys.

Finally, to Min Jeeta who wrote
>> The car has been into the service center for a week know and I am not able to get an answer as to who is going to pay for this.

They are!! Assume that and don't accept anything else. From your post, there's no way it's your fault! Ie, driving style/urban driving. Your mileage is proof. If they even suggest it's your fault or anything other than the car at fault, *give them hell* and tell them not to insult you. And if they still keep it up, tell them you'll get on the phone to Seat UK and start naming names (and how long it's been with the dealer!). They really won't want that. Hope that helps.

Bob

 

[Min Jeeta]

Bob,

Thanks for the news, my thinking behind this is....

The service center the car was taken to had probably had the same kind of symptoms on other vehicles which they cleared without needing any repairs, when this didn't work they almost immediately blamed the actual DPF without really testing.

The service tech's are not skilled enough to be able to look at the wider picture of how the DPF system is controlled. I myself used to be a service engineer albeit in a different field but I was perfectly capable of diagnosing a sensor/transducer fault either by a user interface (laptop) by knowing what temps or pressures would be expected at a given situation or by physically testing inputs and outputs voltage/resistances.

Either way, I am still trying to get the cost of the hire car reimbursed as it is obviously not my fault if the service people can't diagnose a fault or even provide a loan car.

Otherwise I love the car, I don't really blame Seat for the sensor getting wet, although it shouldn't shi7 happens, but shouldn't take a week and half to see a sensor fault.

Funny enough I got it back the same day I lost my rag and threatened legal action and media

 

[cambobfr]

Hey Min Jeeta,
Yeah, sounds like they didn't really know what they were doing with sensor testing on the DPF and as a result didn't really put the effort in to find the fault on your car. And to be honest, if these cars were doing what they're supposed to and clearing the DPF's by themselves then they wouldn't have to do it in the workshop. I've had mine back two days now and I've noticed today that it's started 'choking' slightly already. Not a problem by any means, but still rather annoying. I'm thinking if I start to get persistent problems with it then I'm going to try one of the Miltek downpipes (if the Golf one will work on the Leon).
Bob

PS. Funny that, about losing your rag, it really does help.

 

[brainless toe]

I have a 56 plate Fr 170 pd, do quite high mileage, got the car in October 2006, and I am almost due the 30k service.

Average around 100-150 miles when out on the road, drive the car relatively hard (ave mpg since last reset approx 2.5k through winter months 39 to gallon) although recently in warm weather seen some 42-43. Tend to run the car 90% of the time on BP Ultimate, although last month or so gone back to standard diesel. Ultimate does make a difference to smoothness and acceleration...It is a quick car!

I have seen the DPF light about 5 times and doesn't seem to be a real pattern to when it comes on. Light always cleared no problem, as voted.

However, I do often get a rocking sensation when stationary at lights, also recently experienced similar rocking in 4th gear at 40mph. Performance can vary, sometimes the car feels really quick, yet other times just feels mild.

Spoke to one dealer (where bought car from) and sales man said, when you get the rocking just rev the engine up quite high, but this has no effect. Another dealer said that the new 07 models are a big improvement on the DPF.
Stop using the Ultimate Diesel, was thinking maybe the DPF didn't know how to deal with this grade of fuel. Car is slightly better but not cured.

Anyway recently saw the threads on hear for the new Cupra K1, and as a result of my experiences with the DPF decided I should change. Car arriving Mid March

Think if the DPF was spot on then I would have kept the car and got it Revo'd.
Previously owed an Altea 2.0tdi Sport 140pd and never experienced any of the above.

My Verdict : Really love the car, but truly believe its the DPF technology for VAG is not quite right yet, and think could potentially put a lot of people off from going diesel. I was truly converted but now find myself moving back to the other side.

Anybody else experienced the rocking sensation either stationary or in gear?

 

[cambobfr]

Yeah, I've had the rocking sensation, but only if I rev it very slightly and take my foot off - car gives kind of a jolt.

As for the DPF, since reading this forum, I've already decided that if I have problems with the DPF then I'll get it replaced with something else. So far, I've not seen the light come on once (other than the initial problems).

 

[SpursMadDave]

Given that Citroen / Peugeot first put them as standard fit on their cars in 2000, it would appear hardly an experimental piece of technology.

Well only in the backward world of VAG diesel design.

Sorry but isnt the FR the first Seat with a DPF? Sorry if im wrong but thought that was the case...