Help to understand the EA211 1.4 TSI engine

[Ninjakebab]

Hi guys,

So I'm struggling a bit to find proper diagrams and resources to understand the 1.4 TSI engine.
More specifically I have some questions about the air/liquid intercooler and the particle filter (GPF):

1. I cannot figure out if the liquid for the intercooler loop is a separate coolant loop with its own radiator in the front?
   If not, then I can only imagine it's part of the regular coolant system with temperatures of 80-90°C - which is a lot.
   
   
2. I read somewhere that this loops also cools the turbo, are other components included in this?
   
   
3. Where is the GPF located in the exhaust system?
   
   
4. Does the GPF have pressure sensors before and after for monitoring, or is it a passive filter that does its own thing?
   The reason I ask is for hypothetical reasons, like taking a Formentor off the road where GPFs aren't required by law.

When my warranty period is over I am looking to upgrade the intake and intercooler, maybe the exhaust. So I'm looking to understand it all better, since looking in the engine bay of a fancy modern car is getting more confusing.

Can you guys help answer these or send me in the direction of resources that can help?

 

[Rizzt]

1, intercoolers does not have liquids. It's an air cooler. Turbo pumps the air to the manifold inlet and passes the intercooler. Just Google how an intercooler works.

2, most turbos have an active oil cooler. Similar to an engine oil cooler. With radiator.

3, don't know on this car.

4, yes, Especially diesel cars, DGF. No, on modern petrol engines, GPF. But some manufacturers have a sensor behind just to measure the pressure. So you do not f*** with it.

 

[Stuo]

1, intercoolers does not have liquids. It's an air cooler. Turbo pumps the air to the manifold inlet and passes the intercooler. Just Google how an intercooler works.

2, most turbos have an active oil cooler. Similar to an engine oil cooler. With radiator.

3, don't know on this car.

4, yes, Especially diesel cars, DGF. No, on modern petrol engines, GPF. But some manufacturers have a sensor behind just to measure the pressure. So you do not f*** with it.

1. Some engines do have water cooled intercoolers, some are integrated in to the inlet manifold and both have an additional low temp coolant circuit (common header tanks) for this purpose. I don't know this engine (should get mine in a few weeks) so not sure if it is air/air or air/water.

2. If it does have air/water intercooler it is unlikely to cool the turbocharger, the main cooling circuit will do that. It may cool the gearbox but, as I say, I don't know this exact engine.

3. GPF will be close coupled to the engine, probably in the same canister as the catalytic convertor.

4. Yes, it will almost certainly be fully monitored probably and OBD compliance regulation.

 

[Ninjakebab]

1, intercoolers does not have liquids. It's an air cooler. Turbo pumps the air to the manifold inlet and passes the intercooler. Just Google how an intercooler works.

I think you're misunderstanding my question.

The intercooler in this engine is in fact an air to liquid heat exchanger. The radiator in this case just contains the liquid, and is positioned inside the intake manifold.
My question is what circuit this liquid is part of, and how the liquid is cooled. I'd like to get some temperature readings.

 

[Stuo]

I think you're misunderstanding my question.

The intercooler in this engine is in fact an air to liquid heat exchanger. The radiator in this case just contains the liquid, and is positioned inside the intake manifold.
My question is what circuit this liquid is part of, and how the liquid is cooled. I'd like to get some temperature readings.

The water pump almost certainly has 2 pumps driven on a common shaft.
There is an HT circuit (engine coolant) and LT circuit (intercooler)
They will have a common header tank, so it looks like a single circuit but they are, in fact, discreet from each other.
Each circuit will have its own radiator.
Because the heat rejection in to the intercooler isn't as high the radiator it has the capacity to maintain lower temps (probably max normal 45degC - 50degC)

 

[Rizzt]

1. Some engines do have water cooled intercoolers, some are integrated in to the inlet manifold and both have an additional low temp coolant circuit (common header tanks) for this purpose. I don't know this engine (should get mine in a few weeks) so not sure if it is air/air or air/water.

2. If it does have air/water intercooler it is unlikely to cool the turbocharger, the main cooling circuit will do that. It may cool the gearbox but, as I say, I don't know this exact engine.

3. GPF will be close coupled to the engine, probably in the same canister as the catalytic convertor.

4. Yes, it will almost certainly be fully monitored probably and OBD compliance regulation.

I think you're misunderstanding my question.

The intercooler in this engine is in fact an air to liquid heat exchanger. The radiator in this case just contains the liquid, and is positioned inside the intake manifold.
My question is what circuit this liquid is part of, and how the liquid is cooled. I'd like to get some temperature readings.

AHH, did not know that. Now you guys made me curious. Never heard of air/water intercooler before. Need to Google that. I'm an old man.

 

[Ninjakebab]

AHH, did not know that. Now you guys made me curious. Never heard of air/water intercooler before. Need to Google that. I'm an old man.

All good.
The benefits should be less fluctuations in charge air temperature, also at a standstill, since the thermal capacity of the liquid circuit is high.
Another benefit is a much smaller air volume on the pressure side of the turbo, so quick spool up.

BUT I have a feeling the dimensions of the one in the 1.4 TSI engine is a bit on the low side, so we're stuck at higher charge air temps compared to a regular FMIC (air/air).

The water pump almost certainly has 2 pumps driven on a common shaft.
There is an HT circuit (engine coolant) and LT circuit (intercooler)
They will have a common header tank, so it looks like a single circuit but they are, in fact, discreet from each other.
Each circuit will have its own radiator.
Because the heat rejection in to the intercooler isn't as high the radiator has the capacity to maintain lower temps (probably max normal 45degC - 50degC)

Thanks!! This is exactly some of my thoughts! I was able to track the hoses and could see that it appeared to be part of the main HT circuit.
Just gotta find the radiator and see whats going on.

Either upgrading the radiator to something bigger, or swapping the entire system for an old fashioned FMIC is on my to-do list for sure.

 

[Stuo]

Some manufacturers also employ electric pumps for the turbo water cooling and/or intercooler water cooling to help with low vehicle speeds and turning off the engine when it's hot.

 

[Ninjakebab]

Some manufacturers also employ electric pumps for the turbo water cooling and/or intercooler water cooling to help with low vehicle speeds and turning off the engine when it's hot.

Yeah I think that's the version I heard for this one. Makes a lot of sense for a Hybrid car especially.

The only concern I might have in that case is upgrading the coolant radiator, since lowering the temperature of the coolant in that circuit would introduce a larger thermal gradient across the turbo. That could end up being harmful, but I'll have to taker a better look to understand what's what.