results of my rolling road run

majesty78

Active Member
Oct 6, 2008
490
2
Austria
Totally disagree with what majesty says. The number are on the high end of the scale but if you do a web search diesel VAG engine are well known to produce more then factory quoted numbers. Here is just a few examples
Seat Leon PD150 : http://www.superchips.co.uk/curves/vag150pd.pdf
VW Golf Mk6 2.0 140TDI : http://www.superchips.co.uk/curves/VW20TDiCR140PS.pdf

Forget those dyno runs, they are all made by tuners!

So thats clear that they give higher numbers on stock, because if not, they wouldnt reach their "fairy tale" numbers when remapped...

Look at OEM engine dynos and you will have accurate readings...or do you think a big player like VAG would sell cars with more than 10% overpower which would mean that they come in conflict with law (taxes and so on...)

Greets, Alex
 

MattFrench

No poke without smoke
Jan 16, 2007
112
0
www.rsfrench.com
Forget those dyno runs, they are all made by tuners!

So thats clear that they give higher numbers on stock, because if not, they wouldnt reach their "fairy tale" numbers when remapped...

Look at OEM engine dynos and you will have accurate readings...or do you think a big player like VAG would sell cars with more than 10% overpower which would mean that they come in conflict with law (taxes and so on...)

Greets, Alex

No car is ever the same, It is a known fact that factory bhp varies. It has been found that as a trend with the vag tdi engines they tend to make larger bhp's. You comenting that all our rolling roads are rigged is harsh to say the least and is not very constructive. There is the fact of a rolling road lottery, I agree that some tunners claim to achieve higher bhp's and there are trends of certaine dynos giving a inflated value.

Who cares what bhp your running. Its how it goes thats inportant:)
 

MattFrench

No poke without smoke
Jan 16, 2007
112
0
www.rsfrench.com
yep!! some, Others No. Maybe in Austria there just 10% less!:D

I agree with most of your posts, But there are alot of Rolling Roads here in the uk that are accurate. Otherwise they would not be used.

Use your own judgement, with what is forum talk and actual facts.

Majesty, what I dont understand with refernce to my hybrid remap, is that its smoking loads on full boost, stable 1.9 bar. I chose this. The standard injectors have more to give, So it appears the turbo is still the bottle neck. Not the injectors. Im due to increasing cooling of intake temps to reduce the smoke, and get a better burn and consequently more power.
 

majesty78

Active Member
Oct 6, 2008
490
2
Austria
When your car smokes it has not neccesary have to do anything with the injected quantity of fuel.

The timing of injection is most important, if you start to early, you wont have excessive smoke, but therefore you have cylinder peak pressures which bust your headgaskt sooner or later ( to name the least damage), but if you inject to long after TDC, the combustion efficiency is going down the hill rapidly.
This is, because the piston is on its way down again already and you dont have the possibility anymore to burn this fuel what is still injected.
The combustion process is incomplete then and the whole process loses efficiency, it generates more useless/damaging heat and makes the car smokey.

And as a second, its not only the turbo which must be able to deliver enough mass air flow, also the cylinder head must be capable to flow the neccesary amount of air for clean combustion.
And guess what: The PD head is restrictive, its no kind of "free flow" thing.
If you want a clean A/F ratio, then the head is at its end at 230bhp, the air flowing through the head then reaches super sonic speed around the valves which gives an uncontrollable instable airflow which is again ruining any kind of efficiency.

All these things just let me smile of 240+hp numbers, given by UK- tuners, and NO, its not different measuring in Austria, its kind of different anywhere else than in UK.

I dont mind that, i am happy with my maxed out injectors and "crappy" 210hp, cause i know its a fast car anyway.

And i know, none of those tuners claiming those 230-240hp numbers will EVER say their numbers a inaccurate.
For a simple reason: Business. (Just think how many people who paid for getting this kind of power would knock on their door, when they would ever say: "Yes, its correct, we cant make 240hp with stock injectors....")
Hell would break loose for them...

Have a nice evening,
Alex
 

MattFrench

No poke without smoke
Jan 16, 2007
112
0
www.rsfrench.com
Thanks for all the info alex made perfect sence. And I do agree with your statement about business, too many people get hooked up on what bhp so tunners fudge figures. but not all.

I would like to see some pics of your wmi install sometime, send me some pics and logs you got, as im fitting a devils kit to mine when my nozzels get here.

Cheers
Matt
 

seat_lion

Active Member
Oct 26, 2006
174
0
Edinburgh, Scotland
to be fair my 110 TDi made 120bhp before my remap, my standard mk2 leon cupra made 260bhp like all standard leon cupras that have been RR'd have proven they produce more power than the stated 237bhp claimed by the book figures

its not an uncommon thing for Seat to sell cars with more power than what the book figure is.
 

cyphnar

Active Member
Feb 19, 2009
183
0
Swindon, Wiltshire
Well that got a bit out of hand ;)

Hi guys, i had my pd150 (05 plate, 35k miles) on the rolling road today (Circuit Motors @ Castle Combe).

As far as i know it is standard, apart from a green cotton panel filter and running on v-power.

From my results and looking round on this forum, i suspect that a previous owner may have had it mapped.

Here are my results (27 degrees c ambient temp)

Max power at flywheel - 177.6 bhp @ 4047rpm
Max power at wheels - 155.2 bhp @ 4019rpm
Max torque - 265.4 lbft @ 2754rpm


The other cars that were tested when i was there were as expected, or a bit under. There were 3 Clio 172's there and they all came off at 168 - 176bhp, spo i dont think the rolling road is giving optimistic readings.

The tester also commented on the amount of smoke being more than expected, which also points to being mapped, etc.

What do you guys think? What do you think has been done, map wise?

Thanks

mjt, how did you find the rolling road at circuit motors? they're pretty close to me (probably the closes rr) do you think it's worth a look? also what kind of prices etc?

Chers,
-Cyph
 

mjthompson

Guest
Well that got a bit out of hand ;)



mjt, how did you find the rolling road at circuit motors? they're pretty close to me (probably the closes rr) do you think it's worth a look? also what kind of prices etc?

Chers,
-Cyph

cyphnar, from what i have heard, the dyno at circuit motors is pretty good. A mate of mine is a member of a car club / forum for owners in the south west (mainly around cirencester / malmesbury as far as i can tell!), he said he was going to one of their rolling road days and said i should go along.

As there was about 12 cars going, paul from circuit motors did it for £40 a car. He does two power runs and gives you printouts of the results and graphs etc. He seems pretty knowledgable and can tune most cars by what i am told, he is experience in what he does and if you want to talk through results in more detail, he will.

I guess you can just give him a call and see when he would be able to do it for you and for how much.

Hope this info helps.

Matt
 

javorb

Guest
tuning box can be attached to the fuel temp sensor (front right of block on the fuel line)or if it is digital it will be a piggy back loomed onto the 3" round plug that sits on the back of the head(with lots of wires)
 
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