Crize's Boost.

[DPJ]

Leon 1.8T. stage1 by P-Torque, reversed ForgeDV, blue spring now - same symptoms with a green spring. Crize is concerned his boost may be fluctuating. He logged 115 and 114 to show reguested boost, actual boost and duty cycle.

Monday	2	March	2009	00:21:16						
06A 906 032 SJ		1.8L R4/5VT         0010								

	Group A:	'114				Group B:	'115			
		Engine Load	Engine Load	Engine Load	Charge Pressure		Engine Speed	Engine Load	Charge Pressure	Charge Pressure
	TIME	(specified)	(spec. corrected)	(actual Value)	Solenoid Valve	TIME			(specified Value)	(actual Value)
Marker	STAMP	 %	 %	 %	 %	STAMP	 /min	 %	 mbar	 mbar
	0.54	171.4	150.7	25.6	0	0.24	2000	25.6	990	1010
	1.14	171.4	150.7	74.4	95.3	0.84	2000	26.3	990	1010
	1.75	172.2	147.8	106	95.3	1.44	2160	87.2	2030	1170
	2.35	172.9	143.3	139.1	95.3	2.05	2360	123.3	1990	1590
	2.95	172.9	152.2	155.6	76.1	2.65	2680	154.9	2020	2030
	3.56	172.2	161.2	172.2	77.6	3.25	2960	153.4	2150	2010
	4.16	171.4	170.1	178.2	75.7	3.86	3320	166.2	2190	2090
	[I]4.76	169.2	168.7	164.7	95.3	4.46	3680	177.4	2200	2200[/I]
	5.37	167.7	167.2	169.2	79.2	5.06	4000	177.4	2190	2270
	5.97	166.2	165.7	169.9	85.9	5.68	4360	163.2	2130	2050
	6.57	165.4	164.2	164.7	82.4	6.28	4680	167.7	2080	2120
	7.19	164.7	162.7	160.2	86.7	6.88	5000	161.7	2040	2010
	7.78	163.2	161.2	157.9	95.3	7.48	5280	158.6	2020	1980
	8.39	161.7	159.7	155.6	95.3	8.09	5560	157.9	2000	1940
	9	160.2	156.7	86.5	0	8.68	5800	154.1	1960	1900

Monday	2	March	2009	00:23:50						
06A 906 032 SJ		1.8L R4/5VT         0010								

	Group A:	'114				Group B:	'115			
		Engine Load	Engine Load	Engine Load	Charge Pressure		Engine Speed	Engine Load	Charge Pressure	Charge Pressure
	TIME	(specified)	(spec. corrected)	(actual Value)	Solenoid Valve	TIME			(specified Value)	(actual Value)
Marker	STAMP	 %	 %	 %	 %	STAMP	 /min	 %	 mbar	 mbar
	28.67	168.4	150.7	85	95.3	28.36	1880	75.9	2030	1030
2	29.27	171.4	150.7	109	95.3	28.97	2000	97.7	2060	1300
	29.87	172.2	149.3	131.6	95.3	29.57	2120	120.3	2020	1570
	30.48	172.2	146.3	154.9	80.4	30.17	2280	143.6	1990	1860
	31.08	172.9	144.8	152.6	76.1	30.78	2440	157.9	1970	2070
	31.68	172.9	150.7	151.9	76.9	31.38	2640	149.6	2010	1980
	32.29	172.2	155.2	152.6	77.6	31.99	2800	153.4	2070	2010
	32.89	172.2	159.7	158.6	78.8	32.59	3000	155.6	2140	2040
	33.49	172.2	165.7	163.2	79.6	33.19	3160	159.4	2150	2090
	34.1	171.4	170.1	167.7	81.2	33.8	3360	166.2	2170	2110
	34.7	170.7	170.1	171.4	82.7	34.4	3560	169.9	2180	2140
	35.31	169.2	168.7	171.4	81.2	35	3760	172.9	2170	2200
	35.91	167.7	167.2	169.2	82.7	35.61	3960	167.7	2170	2160
	36.51	166.9	165.7	165.4	81.6	36.21	4160	169.2	2140	2170
	37.12	166.2	164.2	165.4	81.2	36.81	4360	165.4	2120	2110
	37.73	166.2	164.2	163.9	82.4	37.42	4520	161.7	2090	2070
	38.33	165.4	162.7	160.2	82	38.02	4720	162.4	2060	2050
	38.93	165.4	161.2	160.2	83.1	38.63	4880	159.4	2030	2000
	39.53	164.7	161.2	159.4	83.1	39.24	5040	160.2	2010	2020
	40.13	163.9	159.7	158.6	85.9	39.84	5160	159.4	2010	1970
	40.75	163.2	158.2	160.2	89	40.43	5320	160.2	2010	1970
	41.34	162.4	158.2	157.9	92.9	41.05	5480	159.4	2000	1960
	41.95	160.9	155.2	156.4	95.3	41.65	5640	157.9	1980	1950
	42.66	159.4	152.2	154.1	94.1	42.35	5800	153.4	1920	1920
	43.26	158.6	150.7	9	0	42.96	5880	127.8	990	1650

	81.37	171.4	149.3	101.5	95.3	80.97	2000	80.5	2080	1090
3	81.97	172.2	147.8	129.3	95.3	81.67	2160	115	2020	1490
	82.58	172.9	144.8	157.1	78.4	82.28	2320	142.9	1990	1850
	83.18	172.9	146.3	149.6	74.9	82.88	2520	156.4	1970	2070
	83.79	172.9	152.2	151.9	77.3	83.48	2720	149.6	2040	1970
	84.39	172.2	158.2	165.4	76.5	84.09	2920	154.9	2130	2040
	84.99	172.2	164.2	159.4	78.4	84.69	3120	166.2	2160	2170
	85.6	171.4	170.1	172.2	78	85.29	3360	172.9	2170	2220
	86.2	170.7	170.1	175.9	79.2	85.9	3560	166.2	2180	2060
	86.8	169.2	167.2	166.2	84.3	86.5	3760	169.2	2170	2090
[I]	87.41	167.7	165.7	170.7	78.8	87.12	3960	174.4	2170	2240[/I]
	88.02	166.9	165.7	167.7	83.5	87.71	4200	162.4	2140	2050
	88.61	166.2	164.2	162.4	80	88.31	4360	169.9	2110	2170
	89.23	166.2	162.7	164.7	82	88.92	4560	160.9	2070	2050
	89.82	165.4	162.7	159.4	82	89.53	4760	161.7	2050	2060
	90.43	165.4	161.2	161.7	82.4	90.13	4920	160.2	2030	2010
	91.03	164.7	159.7	159.4	83.9	90.73	5080	159.4	2010	2000
	91.63	163.9	159.7	160.2	86.3	91.33	5240	159.4	2010	2000
	92.23	163.2	158.2	159.4	87.1	91.94	5400	158.6	2000	2000

	116.37	172.2	146.3	25.6	0	116.07	2200	24.1	990	1010
	133.98	172.2	147.8	107.5	95.3	134.28	2320	124.1	1990	1610
	134.58	172.9	144.8	140.6	95.3	134.88	2600	155.6	2000	2060
4	135.18	172.9	150.7	156.4	75.3	135.49	2920	154.1	2130	2000
	135.79	172.2	159.7	167.7	77.6	136.09	3280	163.2	2170	2090
	136.39	171.4	168.7	179.7	79.2	136.69	3640	174.4	2190	2150
	136.99	169.9	168.7	169.9	89.8	137.3	3960	181.2	2200	2300
	[I]137.61	167.7	167.2	171.4	78.4	137.9	4280	163.2	2150	2040[/I]
	138.2	166.2	165.7	173.7	88.2	138.5	4640	172.9	2090	2140
	138.81	165.4	164.2	169.2	80	139.12	4960	160.9	2050	2000
	139.41	164.7	162.7	160.9	85.5	139.71	5240	161.7	2030	1980
	140.02	163.9	161.2	158.6	91	140.32	5520	158.6	2020	1950
	140.61	161.7	158.2	156.4	95.3	140.93	5760	155.6	1970	1910
	141.23	158.6	155.2	151.9	95.3	141.52	6000	150.4	1940	1860
Monday	2	March	2009	00:26:58						
06A 906 032 SJ		1.8L R4/5VT         0010								

	Group A:	'114				Group B:	'115			
		Engine Load	Engine Load	Engine Load	Charge Pressure		Engine Speed	Engine Load	Charge Pressure	Charge Pressure
	TIME	(specified)	(spec. corrected)	(actual Value)	Solenoid Valve	TIME			(specified Value)	(actual Value)
Marker	STAMP	 %	 %	 %	 %	STAMP	 /min	 %	 mbar	 mbar
	0.01	171.4	150.7	72.9	95.3	0.3	2080	88.7	2050	1160
	0.6	172.2	149.3	103.8	95.3	0.91	2200	118.8	2010	1540
	1.21	172.2	147.8	133.8	95.3	1.51	2360	147.4	1970	1900
	1.81	172.9	144.8	157.9	76.5	2.11	2560	152.6	1990	2000
	2.41	172.9	147.8	148.9	76.1	2.71	2760	149.6	2060	1990
	3.02	172.2	153.7	154.9	77.6	3.32	2960	157.9	2140	2060
	3.62	172.2	159.7	160.2	80	3.92	3200	164.7	2160	2130
	4.22	172.2	165.7	166.2	80.8	4.53	3400	168.4	2170	2160
	4.83	171.4	170.1	172.9	81.6	5.13	3600	175.9	2170	2180
	5.43	169.9	168.7	172.2	80.8	5.73	3800	169.9	2180	2150
	6.04	168.4	167.2	172.9	82	6.34	4040	171.4	2180	2180
	6.64	167.7	165.7	166.9	82	6.94	4200	168.4	2140	2140
	7.24	166.9	165.7	166.9	80.8	7.54	4400	165.4	2100	2110
	7.86	166.2	164.2	162.4	81.2	8.16	4600	163.9	2060	2080
	8.46	166.2	162.7	162.4	80.4	8.75	4760	159.4	2040	2040
	9.06	165.4	162.7	160.9	82.7	9.37	4960	160.2	2030	2030
	9.67	165.4	161.2	158.6	83.1	9.96	5120	159.4	2010	2020
	10.26	164.7	159.7	159.4	84.3	10.56	5280	158.6	2010	2000
	10.86	163.9	159.7	159.4	86.3	11.17	5440	158.6	2000	2000
	11.48	163.2	158.2	157.9	88.2	11.78	5560	157.1	1990	1970
	12.08	161.7	155.2	157.1	93.7	12.37	5720	154.1	1970	1930
	12.68	160.2	153.7	151.9	95.3	12.99	5840	152.6	1930	1920
	13.29	158.6	150.7	150.4	95.3	13.58	5960	150.4	1920	1890
	13.89	157.1	147.8	147.4	95.3	14.19	6080	146.6	1790	1830
	14.49	154.9	146.3	147.4	87.8	14.79	6200	145.1	1680	1840

On a couple of the runs above, I can see a quirk at around 4000-4200 rpm where the boost dips before recovering. See the first run, there's a curious 95% in duty cycle. Overall, it looks healthy to me and actual boost follows requested closely. I don't think there's an N75 problem.

On 114 loads, everything looks hunky-dory.

 

[Damoegan]

I think I've still got some logs you done for me, Dave, if you want me to put them up to compare with?

 

[Crize]

Thanks Dave!

Indeed, only when flooring, boost peaks, gets back a bit, then peaks again only to cut back for the second time. Sometimes there is one more cycle like this before settleing.

Fluctuation is within 0.15 bar but you can feel it when driving.

My question were:
1. Could it be a faulty N75?
2. Should I consider a swap with an N75 J? (n.b. AUQ engine, standard K03s)


Any input is more than welcome..


Cheers!

 

[DPJ]

I've PM'd Will from P Torque to ask him to have a look.

 

[Damoegan]

I tryed a N75h(or race valve) when I had stage 1 p-torque and it caused the same boost fluctuation. So I would say it could be the N75.
Is there anyone you could lend a different N75 off to try?

 

[Damoegan]

I've PM'd Will from P Torque to ask him to have a look.

You might wait a little for a reply, Dave, as Will's workshop got broken into and quite alot of ££££ of damage done last week.

 

[DPJ]

Have a look at the lines I've made italic. Looks like the ecu is asking the N75 to cut boost. Load corrections give some clue.

 

[Damoegan]

I see what you mean, Dave.

How long has it been like this? Has it always been like this since it was mapped?

 

[DPJ]

Where did peak torque come in on st1, Damien?

 

[Crize]

Uh! Sorry about Will! Seems a nice guy!

I tryed a N75h(or race valve) when I had stage 1 p-torque and it caused the same boost fluctuation. So I would say it could be the N75.
Is there anyone you could lend a different N75 off to try?

Afraid not.. I'll make some phone calls tho.

How did you get rid of the fluctuation, after all?
(My mechanic said earlier: "trey and find someone with the same maps as you and ask him!" )

 

[Crize]

Yep!
Like this since fitted the remapped ECU, last Monday!

 

[Damoegan]

Where did peak torque come in on st1, Damien?

Here is my graph with stage 2 over the top of stage 1

My stage 1 logs

Group A:	'115		Group B:	'031	
Engine Speed	Engine Load	Spec. Boost	Actual Boost	Lambda Factor	Lambda Factor
 /min	%	 mbar	 mbar		
760	22.6	980	980	0.984	1
2360	93.2	2010	1090	0.961	1
2560	130.8	2020	1570	0.945	0.953
2840	163.2	2010	1990	0.938	0.945
3280	169.9	1980	2100	0.938	0.945
3680	164.7	1970	1950	0.938	0.945
4040	160.9	1950	1950	0.922	0.945
4360	162.4	1890	1900	0.938	0.945
4720	157.9	1820	1840	0.93	0.922
5080	153.4	1770	1730	0.875	0.883
5320	150.4	1740	1740	0.852	0.852
5600	145.9	1710	1690	0.828	0.828
5840	141.4	1670	1670	0.797	0.805
6040	135.3	1580	1620	0.797	0.821
6240	127.8	1540	1560	0.813	0.813
6400	123.3	1500	1480	0.813	0.821
6520	116.5	1470	1490	0.805	0.828
6600	113.5	980	1520	0.774	0.945
5680	12.8	980	1080	1.991	1.047

 

[Damoegan]

How did you get rid of the fluctuation, after all?

Went back to standard N75.

Yep!
Like this since fitted the remapped ECU, last Monday!

I also had a similare problem with my stage 1 map too. Took it back to Will and he done some investigation and found that part of the standard map (EGT map) that he normaly does'nt touch was interfering with Will's map causing the ECU to pull back on the timing.

Will adjusted it and that solved the problem.

If I were you I would just give Will a ring in the morning. I'm sure he will take a look and sort it out without a problem

 

[DPJ]

Boost's a lot stronger on the Leon map than yours was, Damien.

Which could be a clue. Looking at your plot, peak torque comes at about 3800 - It's like his ecu is pulling back for a moment after it hits peak torque.

 

[Damoegan]

Boost's a lot stronger on the Leon map than yours was, Damien.

Which could be a clue. Looking at your plot, peak torque comes at about 3800 - It's like his ecu is pulling back for a moment after it hits peak torque.

Yea, thats where it was pulling back on the timing, Dave.

Strange that the Leon map would request more boost than the ibiza map

As you can see, it no longer does that now though peaking at ~1.5bar and holding much longer now.

 

[Crize]

I see!
So.. no N75 problem!

 

[Damoegan]

I see!
So.. no N75 problem!

Possibly not mate.

 

[DPJ]

I'm curious as to why the boost is so aggressive on a st1 map.......

 

[Crize]

Well, I'll try and contact Will.


And lads.. thanks a lot!
(As promised Dave) Beers if you come to Bucharest ..or me in UK!

 

[Damoegan]

Stage 2 boost

Group A:	'115			
	Engine Speed	Engine Load	Spec. Boost	Actual Boost
TIME	700-6800 RPM	15-150%	990-1800 mbar	<=1800 mbar
STAMP	 /min	%	 mbar	 mbar
0.51	2400	86.3	2100	1340
1.41	2680	85.1	2190	1750
2.22	3000	85.1	2130	2070
3.02	3440	85.1	2060	2210
3.82	3840	85.1	2030	2160
4.62	4280	85.1	2010	2090
5.55	4680	85.9	1960	2050
6.45	5080	87.5	1970	2010
7.26	5360	87.5	2020	1910
8.14	5720	87.5	2040	1850
8.96	5960	87.5	1990	1790
9.87	6200	87.5	1920	1810