"ECS HKS BOV Kit" Any expirience?

[Scotty_b]

Ah ok, i will have a read up on why its there and what the pros and cons are of removing it on the beezer threads as i want to paint my rocker cover red and it looks plain ugly in the way!

 

[CupraSteve]

why is everyone so obsessed with dump valve sound? it seems a bit silly to spend a lot of money and risk the running reliability of your car just to obtain a louder sound?

 

[Scotty_b]

Each to there own isnt it. Why dont people all drive 1.0 cars rather than bigger lumps as you can only go so fast anyway? Why have a cupra when a sx will get you from A to B as well?
Why do some people like blondes and not gingers? Why do some people like taller people?

Just personal taste fella, no ones forcing you to have one

 

[Pabs]

big up to you scotty - totally agree - its MY car - i do what I want to it! Fed up with all these comments of people questioning why - its cos I want to!

On a more subdued note - I'd prefer a BOV noise to the wooshy noise I get at the moment with my CAI. And, if these BOV's work without ruining reliability as you say, then theres no reason I shouldnt do it!

Its the whole reason i bought this thread back up - if it risks the car running then I wont do it - but as you can see/read there are people who have managed to run them fine.. so i'm trying to find out if I can run one without issues.

 

[RobDon]

Running a BOV will not kill your car, remember that a DV and BOV vent EXCESS boost pressure, not the boost the motor requires, so in theory it should make little difference. There is slightly more lag with a BOV as a DV helps keep the turbo spinning, but it's not a big difference.

Remember that many, many turbo cars have airflow meters too, yet tons of them run with BOV's not DV's.

If you want to run one and can with no issues and enjoy the sound, then go for it, screw the haters and naysayers (they'll always be around anyway).

 

[Pabs]

HEHE thanks for the backup rob

Personally, still not sure myself. Hoping to see some more people running them successfully before I lash out my dosh...

 

[RobDon]

Fortunately I was one of the lucky ones, but before fitting it I had no idea if it would work or not, I figured I'd be able to sell it no problem to a Jap turbo car owner without much hassle if it didn't work.

 

[Pabs]

yeh, understood rob. ideally would be good if i had to sell it, to be able to sell it for what i paid, without making a loss.

I might remove the reservoir next weekend, and see how that goes, and then figure out what i'm gonna do from there.

 

[cupra@180]

After reading this and other threads I'm going to jump straight in and buy one!!!

"Pabs hijacked your thread on scc sorry mate not stalking you just interested in the bov whole reason I bought turbo car really (childish ahhh well looks like she was right all along)".

 

[Pabs]

excellent - u do that. And let me know if u succeed or not


then, if u succeed, i might get one

Good luck on finding a source tho - ECS are good apparently but be wary of import tax on any of these foreign dealers.

 

[Mr Roboto]

Cool

Has there been any LCR running these BOV's?

 

[Scotty_b]

Ive run a bailey Atmos a few times at shows and had no problems there and back (some shows have been 250 mile round trip). I generally use it so people go "what the hell was that!" Had no problems so far but then i only run it for a weekend like that as the sound does get to me after a while (What can i say im a sleeper/rat look man at heart)

Would love to here a BOV on one tho

 

[Icecavern]

Cool

Has there been any LCR running these BOV's?

I ran one on my revo'd LCR for a while until the near death experience. Sounded great, tempted to remove the vaccum gubbins and get another one actually if that fixes the problem I had

 

[dj_hektik]

All I can say is GO FOR IT.

I got a GReddy RS BOV, but with a recirculation pipe connected back to the TIP.

I installed a CAI and the BOV at the same time, so im not sure what boosted performance but the car is definitely faster. the BOV sounds amazing, especially in first 3 gears.... No issues at all, except maybe a bit pricey.

The EIP Kit I bought was very easy to fit, designed for the Golf GTi, and comes preassembeled, basically all you need to do is remove engine cover, remove DV and pipe, remove DV vacuum pipe, install BOV on intercooler pipe, connect vacuum pipe and thats it.

 

[CupraSteve]

Running a BOV will not kill your car, remember that a DV and BOV vent EXCESS boost pressure, not the boost the motor requires, so in theory it should make little difference. There is slightly more lag with a BOV as a DV helps keep the turbo spinning, but it's not a big difference.

Remember that many, many turbo cars have airflow meters too, yet tons of them run with BOV's not DV's.

If you want to run one and can with no issues and enjoy the sound, then go for it, screw the haters and naysayers (they'll always be around anyway).

there is actually an article kicking around somewhere iv read from a guy that truley knows his stuff and he outlined exactly why an atmos DV is not good esp for VAG engines, heres a direct copy of it

A modern engine management system, ie the Bosch Me unit fitted to 1.8T's has "adaptive" learning on the fuel, ignition and airflow side.

Because Me is a Torque based structure it's calculation of engine torque verses driver demand is critical to the driveability of the car and it's performance / durability.

When you fit a "leak" in the intake system (open circuit valve) the original calibration of the MAF sensor to manifold and cylinder filling modeling will not corespond. However due to the 20% allowance in the long term adaptive values the ECU will relearn you engine and "leak"

At idle the inlet model calculated airflow will exceed the MAF meters measured output, and depending on the state of your particular components - ie MAF ageing / contamination, throttle plate leakage, Fuel tank purge vapour concentration this may, or may not push the adaptive to it's 20% limit. If it hits the limit the ME unit will run in FMEM mode (Failure mode and effects management) causing reduced system efficiency. The Me unit will use the switching signal from the lambda sensor to return fuelling to lambda 1, storing the correction as a map agaisnt airflow. and add this correction to the fueling calc when operating at non closed loop conditions, ie WOT, fuel injector reenstatment (after overrun shut off, traction control intervention etc.) Now depending on how you drive and how sensative you are this may or may not be felt by the driver during certain manovevers. The throttle plate position will also learn the new airflow to maintain control of idle speed, but you may notice poor engine load rejection, ie turn on the aircon and the engine speed varries etc. or engine speed flares on starts or when operating PAS when parking.

However in all cases this will result in "incorrect" fueling. Now by "incorrect" i mean, not as the manufacturer intended. A post MAF leak will cause rich operation initially, but the adaptives will pull fuel out and become negative. This tends to cause a rich to lean spike on tip outs and other throttle transient. Now it is extremely diffucult for an untrained observer to spot these effects as they occur mainly on throttle transients, when the average drive may not notice. Therefore you could say "why do i care?". Well, any AFR excursion from the intended fuelling set by the manufacturer will result in non-standard engine operation. because of the adaptives this is unlikely to cause immediate engine problems, but over the course of time will change things like catalyst ageing, exhaust and turbo charger valve durability etc. Manufactures spend millions accruing miles on development fleets so hopefully the customers don't get landed with big bills as time goes on, and with most modern cars life'd at 150k miles (min design life) this is a big task.
It is unlikely that this will result in any performance loss, as at WOT the system is open loop, but you may see the result of an open circuit valve oas over fueling on gear changes etc. (a tell tail puff of black smoke is what you can see, a 1200 degC Catalyst is what you can't see, as excess fuel when injection reenstates and excess air from overrun shut off period combine in cat)

Now as you can see this is a seriously complicated subject and i haven't even mentioned the dreaded EOBD or OBDII words yet. Typically Bosch Me units have approximately 9000 calibratable parameters (constants, maps etc) and an engine calibration program will take a team of 8 calibration engineers 18 months to do the basic mapping and OBD validation. These days it's no problem to do the basic fuel and spark mapping, maybe 4 weeks on a midlimit engine on a dyno, but the diagnostics and emmisions devs takes years.

Moral or the story, before you start playing with something you don't understand, find someone who does!(And not just thinks they do!)

(for anyone thinking, "hey what makes me such an "expert" on this subject?" then i'd better mention the last 10 years i've spent as a senior calibration engineer at Cosworth and Prodrive!)

 

[Tallpaul]

I think everyones read that article 'Cuprasteve'.

If you don't want to do it, then don't.

 

[CupraSteve]

just pointing out that those who are saying "my car didnt go into limp mode" etc etc doesnt mean that someone elses car wont. Or that it is actually "fine" to run these atmos DV's.

There is method and science to point out why its not good, however there is no science i have seen to point out why iits fine, other than the odd few people that have had no problems

 

[Ruddmeister]

I think we know the 1.8T is not designed to run with a BoV, and we know some people have had issues running a BoV in the past.

However, other people like Robdon seem to be running fine.

If you want to do the mod, do it, it's your car but there are no guarantees either way.

Personally I like the BoV sound, reminds me of 80's Rally Cars at full chat, then again it also reminds me of Chav's in Nova's and Corsa's etc.....which isn't so good.

 

[dj_hektik]

So basically it's OK if the BOV is fitted with a pipe that recirculates the air back into the TIP, as the air mass readings will be consistent with the stock DV

 

[Ruddmeister]

just pointing out that those who are saying "my car didnt go into limp mode" etc etc doesnt mean that someone elses car wont.

It's a fair point and I think Pabs also mentioned something similar to this earlier in the thread.