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Updating the inbuilt Mib2 Satnav / Mib2 tricks and lost Mib1 card solution

Taff

Full Member
Jun 10, 2002
82
0
South Wales
Sorry no update. I didn't succeed messing with the files. I am waiting for my VCDS cable from Aliexpress which could mean a 6 week wait.

Sorry.
 

CyberGene

Active Member
Apr 26, 2008
306
1
Sofia, Bulgaria
I did some experiments today but so far no luck.

My car came with the following dbinfo.txt:

Code:
PartNumber1="-----------"
PartNumber2="5G0919866E "
PartNumber3="5E0919866E "
PartNumber4="5F0919866E "
PartNumber="-----------"
ApplicationSoftwareVersionNumber="0034"
SystemName=" ECE 2013/14 "
The latest free update for VW/Skoda contains the following dbinfo.txt:
Code:
PartNumber1="8V0919866B "
PartNumber2="5G0919866F "
PartNumber3="5E0051236C "
PartNumber4="5F0919866F "
PartNumber="8V0919866B "
ApplicationSoftwareVersionNumber="0036"
SystemName=" ECE 2014    "
My research so far shows that:
1 = Audi
2 = VW
3 = Skoda
4 = Seat

And indeed 5F0919866E (which is my current map version) matches what's written on the SD-card case that came with the car.

I tried today to put the new version on the SD-card and to edit a little the dbinfo.txt, for example I changed the "PartNumber=..." line to point to the one in PartNumber4 thinking that maybe this is what's needed to point the sat nag system but alas. I have also tried to provide "-----------" but no luck.

Maybe someone with the latest leon maps can volunteer and share his dbinfo.txt (and possibly his entire map content) so we can compare what's the difference between the free VW/Skoda content and the one in the Leon. Maybe it's just some slight text file reconfiguration? I guess it may not be legal for a SEAT owner to share his entire sat nav SD content though... :(
 
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ma9mwah

Active Member
Aug 13, 2009
201
1
I'll definitely look into this once I get mine. Looking at the VW download I'm hoping its not going to be too difficult to modify to get it to work with seats. But that will mostly depend on how the official SEAT one looks.
 

CyberGene

Active Member
Apr 26, 2008
306
1
Sofia, Bulgaria
What you can do is download the VW/Skoda update and keep it on your PC and once you get your new Leon, copy your SD-card content and compare both. I guess this is perfectly legal.

I did a comparison today using the diff terminal command on my Mac but apparently most of the files were different since the VW version is newer. In your case we will be talking about same versions and a comparison will yield far more valuable information.
 

JamMonkey

Active Member
Mar 9, 2008
102
0
Cheshire
I did some experiments today but so far no luck.

My car came with the following dbinfo.txt:

Code:
PartNumber1="-----------"
PartNumber2="5G0919866E "
PartNumber3="5E0919866E "
PartNumber4="5F0919866E "
PartNumber="-----------"
ApplicationSoftwareVersionNumber="0034"
SystemName=" ECE 2013/14 "
The latest free update for VW/Skoda contains the following dbinfo.txt:
Code:
PartNumber1="8V0919866B "
PartNumber2="5G0919866F "
PartNumber3="5E0051236C "
PartNumber4="5F0919866F "
PartNumber="8V0919866B "
ApplicationSoftwareVersionNumber="0036"
SystemName=" ECE 2014    "
My research so far shows that:
1 = Audi
2 = VW
3 = Skoda
4 = Seat

And indeed 5F0919866E (which is my current map version) matches what's written on the SD-card case that came with the car.

I tried today to put the new version on the SD-card and to edit a little the dbinfo.txt, for example I changed the "PartNumber=..." line to point to the one in PartNumber4 thinking that maybe this is what's needed to point the sat nag system but alas. I have also tried to provide "-----------" but no luck.

Maybe someone with the latest leon maps can volunteer and share his dbinfo.txt (and possibly his entire map content) so we can compare what's the difference between the free VW/Skoda content and the one in the Leon. Maybe it's just some slight text file reconfiguration? I guess it may not be legal for a SEAT owner to share his entire sat nav SD content though... :(
What if you just change the ApplicationSoftwareVersionNumber="003X" to 0036 and that's it. Then just replace the maps folder.
I guess we'll get the idea as soon and someone posts a new version of the the dbinfo.txt
I'd leave the other numbers alone, as there is a possibility SEAT have a firmware lock on the device to stop this.

Matt
 

AJ

Active Member
Oct 16, 2013
250
3
Maybe someone with the latest leon maps can volunteer and share his dbinfo.txt (and possibly his entire map content) so we can compare what's the difference between the free VW/Skoda content and the one in the Leon. Maybe it's just some slight text file reconfiguration? I guess it may not be legal for a SEAT owner to share his entire sat nav SD content though... :(
I have checked my Car Info and I have the following under Navigation database:
5F0919866F 0036 ECE 2014

Is this the latest version??

 

ma9mwah

Active Member
Aug 13, 2009
201
1
It would be very interesting to see if your v36 can be loaded onto CyberGene's. That will tell us if the SD card is somehow coded to a specific car or not. From there we can then look to see what the difference between the SEAT v36 and the VW v36 that you can download.
 
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AJ

Active Member
Oct 16, 2013
250
3
It would be very interesting to see if your v36 can be loaded onto CyberGene's. That will tell us if the SD card is somehow coded to a specific car or not. From there we can then look to see what the difference between the SEAT v36 and the VW v36 that you can download.
OK, sure I will be willing to help out so it can be tested :)
So what do you guys need, just a copy of the entire contents of my SD card?
 

Taff

Full Member
Jun 10, 2002
82
0
South Wales
OK, sure I will be willing to help out so it can be tested :)
So what do you guys need, just a copy of the entire contents of my SD card?
That would be very helpful as we can also diff the contents against the VW updated version (P36_N60S3MIBS2_EU_NT_Q1.13.7z).

Can you ZIP/RAR the all the contents of your SATNAV SD card and drop it in a shared Dropbox folder or something like that? You can PM me and other a link so we can get to work on this as soon as its uploaded?


Taff :worship:
 

keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
I'm happy to get involved in this also, but seeing if its coded to a car shouldn't need different versions, just two different cars. If anyones in bolton/gtr manchester I'd be happy to meet up and swap cards for a try.
 

springerFR

Active Member
Jan 22, 2014
25
0
South Wales
navigation

Hi All
My car has a build date of Oct 2013 and has the following media software version if you need to compare
Deviec no 5F0025858F
hardware 40
software 421
Navigationdatabase
5F0919866E 0034 ECE 2013/14.

If you need me to copy my SD I would be happy to help
 

ma9mwah

Active Member
Aug 13, 2009
201
1
Hi All
My car has a build date of Oct 2013 and has the following media software version if you need to compare
Deviec no 5F0025858F
hardware 40
software 421
Navigationdatabase
5F0919866E 0034 ECE 2013/14.

If you need me to copy my SD I would be happy to help
if you can do the same as Taff suggested and pm him and myself, we can start comparing all three different version. seat v34, seat v36 and vw v36.

taff said:
Can you ZIP/RAR the all the contents of your SATNAV SD card and drop it in a shared Dropbox folder or something like that? You can PM a link so we can get to work on this as soon as its uploaded?
 

CyberGene

Active Member
Apr 26, 2008
306
1
Sofia, Bulgaria
Please PM me too.

SpringerFR, you have the same version as mine. I can compare both versions and see if they have coded them to be locked for a specific car or it is one and same content suitable for any car.

AJ, yes yours is the latest version and matches the version number of VW/Skoda one. It would be great if you can zip the contents, upload it to a shared Dropbox and PM us the link as suggested by taff.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

Romm

Guest
I had a go at copying the V36 content from the VW map update to my V34 navigation SD Card.
Like others with no luck, the Navigation keep saying 'Invalid Navigation Data'.

On the very first load of navigation data the 'System Information' did say "Navigation Database: 5F0919866F 0036 ECE 2014" just like AJs.
After removing the SD Card and reinserting it the 'Navigation Database' information is just blank.

What I did notice is that my software version was 421 during these operations and not 425 as AJ's screenshot is showing.
A software update might be a seperate file that needs to be loaded?

As seen in AJ's screenshot there is an Software Update option in the top. Tapping this option result in a message along the lines of "Update file not found".
Maybe it's a software issue where older versions of the unit can not read new navigation data?


I would be very interested in having a look at the data from AJs SD Card.

Here is a link to my V34 Navigation data if it's of interest to anyone:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v5oqyhyvzqebjs4/NavigationDataV34.zip
 

ma9mwah

Active Member
Aug 13, 2009
201
1
CyberGene, Taff and myself have been looking into this in the background. While the files from the VW v36 and SEAT v36 are identical it doesn't unfortunately allow you to copy these files onto a separate SD card, or even the official seat SD card. Are current thoughts is there must be some sort of hidden partition / copy protection on the official SEAT SD card that only allows a specific version. We are still investigating.
 

CyberGene

Active Member
Apr 26, 2008
306
1
Sofia, Bulgaria
I was also looking at this as well and also at the SD specification and info from gpsunderground and other forums, etc and here's the summary of all the info so far:

- The free and donwloadable VW/Skoda update 036 is binary identical to the 036 version which is shipped with the latest Leons.
- If you put this update 036 on the original SEAT navigation SD-card that came with your car (and if the SD card is older version, for example 034), the update won't work => obviously the protection is on the SD card
- If you use another SD card and backup your working navigation content to it, it won't work => again, the protection is linked to the SD card
- If you format your original SD card and then restore your backed up content, it will work => so, the protection is not in the visible partition of the SD card but is rather on a hidden partition
- Reading the SD specification, we see there is so called "Protected Area" which is part of the SD card that is not accessible through the normal filesystem operations and its content is (mostly) read-only and created by the manufacturers of the SD-cards
- The protected area contains, among other data, the so called CID which is a 128-bit data identifying the manufacturer of the content, an ID of the content, etc.
- Certain manufacturers of GPS software, such as Garmin, use the CID to lock the content to that particular SD-card. You can copy the content to another SD-card, however when the GPS hardware reads the content, it will also read the CID and will expect it to match certain values
- There are however certain manufacturers of SD-cards who sell SD cards with CID that is user writable (which seems to be some kind of violation and probably illegal). I haven't yet discovered brands/models and I suspect those are some Chinese unknown brands. That needs to be researched. I guess eBay would be a good place to look for such.
- Even if you find such SD-cards, it seems there's not much information and available software to write the CID, however there are some partial successes with that, see the links I will post.
------------------------

So, there are multiple approaches:

1. Since VW and Skoda allow using the free updates, their units are probably not checking the SD-card validity. Maybe we can use VCDS to make SEAT units allow navigation content on any SD-card.

2. By using SD-cards that allow CID writing, we may be able to program the CID to match the one expected by the unit. Reading CID is possible with some software on the Internet, however it requires SD-card reader connected to the PCI bus of the computer and not USB one. Most built-in laptop/desktop card-readers are PCI. Writing the CID is another challenge though.

3. Using some SD-card adapter which is hooked to some intermediate hardware unit (faking the CID on CID-read command) and then just relaying all the signals to a regular SD card can trick the unit into thinking the original SD-card is inserted. This is a rather nerdy approach and I am not sure if there are guys here who are that good with such stuff :)

And here some links:

http://www.digitalspirit.org/file/index.php/obj-download/docs/sd/TOSHIBA_SD_Card_Specification.pdf

http://gpsunderground.com/forum/general-information/6929-why-copied-sd-card-not-working-your-device.html

Some success with writeCID
 
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JK1

Full Member
May 15, 2002
531
2
Bedford
Visit site
What does the Update Software button actually do?

Just thinking from a dealer perspective they wouldn't want to have hundreds of SD cards to swap out (and be left with hundreds of out of date cards), they would have a few master update cards and update the one already in your car?

You'd probably need someones newer SD card, try plugging it in to Slot 2 and press Software Updates, copies the data over, and your card is updated?

As CyberGene says it's the card itself that is important.
 
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niggle

Rollin' on 17s, baby!
Jan 28, 2014
461
2
Huddersfield, West Yorkshire
2. By using SD-cards that allow CID writing, we may be able to program the CID to match the one expected by the unit. Reading CID is possible with some software on the Internet, however it requires SD-card reader connected to the PCI bus of the computer and not USB one. Most built-in laptop/desktop card-readers are PCI. Writing the CID is another challenge though.

3. Using some SD-card adapter which is hooked to some intermediate hardware unit (faking the CID on CID-read command) and then just relaying all the signals to a regular SD card can trick the unit into thinking the original SD-card is inserted. This is a rather nerdy approach and I am not sure if there are guys here who are that good with such stuff :)
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In my experience most built-in SD card readers are internal USB 2.0 devices rather than hanging off the PCI bus. This explains their relatively poor performance, 20 - 30MB/s maximum even when using a UHS-1 card that will comfortably read/write at 60MB/s.

SD cards essentially use the SPI standard so using something like an Arduino or Raspberry Pi would indeed be an effective way of writing directly to the card and avoiding the file system. Alternatively, a cheap USB to SPI adapter could be used on a conventional PC. SD card emulator hardware also exists but is relatively expensive.

Our Leon won't be delivered until April but I would be more than happy to join in this research project when I get my hands on the SEAT SD card.

I wonder if SEAT feel the need to adopt a mobile phone/ink jet printer business model for navigation updates? The hardware cost to the end user is low/free and profit is recouped by charging for map updates.

As I understand it VAG sat-nav hardware uses Navteq map data. Interestingly, my Garmin portable sat-nav also uses Navteq maps. I paid £99 for the Garmin last year and this entitles me to free quarterly map updates for life.
 
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keithjeb

Active Member
Nov 1, 2013
187
1
Have you tried dd to copy the data from one card to another at a block level rather than file level? I don't have a spare 8GB card or I'd try it with mine.
 
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