Timing Chain Snapped - Out of Warranty

[Nath.]

Cheers mate

If it doesn't run properly then surely no one will buy it or do you mean sell it before it gets any worse?

Will it get worse and run worse as time goes on?

Thanks Jon

Yes exactly, if it doesn't run right as a result of valve damage it will get progressively worse

The garage that have done the work should be able to do a compression check and have a good idea as to weather all the valves are shutting properly or not

 

[wigjonnyp]

Thanks for the replies

I picked my car up last night and he told me that the timing chain has been fixed but in the process a couple of valves have been bent

I have drove my car 3 time now and when you start it up it chugs really bad and feels like it's going to cut out.

I drove up my road this morning, I had my foot down on the accelarator and it was really struggling and only going about 5mph.

Now when the car actually gets going, it's alright and runs fine, it is just when the revs are low.

The garage has said it's going to be another £500 to get the valves fixed on top of the £750 i've already paid. The car's only worth £2000

Should the garage not have fixed this when the engine was stripped for the timing chain? If it's not fixed properly should I pay? Does it defo need doing?

Any help appreciated again, i'm really depressed over this

Cheers Jon

 

[mosheff]

I think the garage should have fixed it when the engine was stripped down . Its similar to my problem with a garage who charged me £800 for replacing some valves and timing chain etc but put it back together missing a still faulty piston . I rang consumer trading and they told me to get an independant report on the car but that costs over £200 that way you can take action against the garage .
I rang an engine report specialist who was happy to just discuss it on the phone he said the garage should have done two tests on mine before it was reassembled which whould have shown the piston to be faulty a leak down test and compression test . They will say they have done them but can't have or else they would have known a piston was faulty if they did the tests i can only conclude that the results were ignored . They have the car in bits and want me to pay arround £1500 + for replacement engine or me pay them to reassemble the car when its still got this expensive fault . Im having the car collected and taken somewhere else and hope people notice a breakdown company taking a car away from them as opposed to being delivered and wonder why ! I might try even get it on youtube with me waving a plackard !

 

[wigjonnyp]

Cheers mate, it's really pissing me off and I don't know what to do.

I should canccel my cheque, refuse to pay and go to trading standards about it

Is anything like that possible?

 

[mosheff]

Wigjonnyp please can you edit that last post

 

[wigjonnyp]

I'l try, i'm not very good at computer stuff though

 

[mosheff]

I would ring trading standards if I were you wigjonnyp and see what they advise they are very helpfull

 

[Nath.]

In my experience of these sort of things not paying puts you in trouble, you should pay something that way you are still keeping with the sale contract

 

[RUM4MO]

I just can't believe two outfits trading as garages managed to mess up this sort of job - they obviously either don't care or are not competant. Neither of these listed problems, ie bent valves and damaged pistons are unique to this engine after a camshaft drive system failure. Cars have been breaking chains and belts for at least 40 years - not a new unknown sequence of events - almost all engines currently in use in UK owned cars are interferance engines - meaning that valve, head and/or piston damage is highly likely when cam drive is lost or overwise gone out of sync with the crankshaft. Surely both of you will get swift resolution to your problems (I really hope so), this is another reeason why car owners don't always trust their garages. On a more positive note, its always better to get garages that are linked to some professional body to carry out this sort of intensive work - they should always be expected to follow best practise - and cough up if they didn't. I am assuming that both of you did not try to get your garages to do the bare minimum of work to get the engine working again - and they tried their best to oblige but have now cost you a fortune by making a bad judgement.

 

[mosheff]

I went to the local dealership franchise for the car and they insist the piston burning a ltr of oil ever 100 miles is a different thing alltogether although it wasn't doing it before they "repaired "it. Iv argued with them and main customer service . How I wish Id just let our regular mechanic deal with it .
Im taking it out of there now and depending on what this garage were its now going say I might yet go to small claims court with it .

 

[scottg121]

Hi all,

Not sure if this post is still valid.

I have exactly the same problem\fault I have a

Seat Ibiza 1.2 2003 about 54K

And been told the Cam chain and tentioner needs replacing. Local garage told me this is a common fault on the 1.2 specifically my age car. Been quoted £290 include parts and labour. I am now on the phone to Seat number is 0500 222 222. Chap seemed to agree with me the cam chain should never get a fault like this and should last the age of the car. Hes taken my details and checking if compensation is in order. If not then I will be writing direct to them. Also local seat garage quoted me £295

 

[mosheff]

Hi We did a repair at the main dealership over £800 but it still had problems as one of the pistons was damaged so the £800+ was a complete waste of money .
I rang a engine specialst and he said that two tests will show if the pistons are damaged so you need to ask them to do these tests .The main dealer obviously didnt and so were were left with the choice of paying over 2k for a new engine or scrapping it . They wouldnt give us any refund on the £800 and Seat head office were not interested .
We took the car to another garage in the hope they could get an engine from a scrap dealer but after two months got fed up of waiting for him to aquire one as they are very few and far between . We sold the car to the mechanic for a few hundred as it was without an engine so we lost the car and the cost of the waste of time repair ! Needless to say i wouldn't touch another Seat with a bargepole and if you have one in this age/mileage group either get rid of it or at least get a modify kit installed ASAP !

 

[RUM4MO]

Just another word of warning, these engines were fitted to Skoda Fabia + Volkswagen Polo + Seat Ibiza - so "jumping ship" to another of these VAG marques will not mean escaping from this potential problem - its a VAG problem not a Seat problem. BTW, VAG are continuing to use a variant of this engine today and for the near future, they are adding a TSI variant with over 100PS - so it could be that most petrol engines fitted to Fabia +Polo + Ibiza will be 1.2 3 cylinder ones!

 

[scottg121]

Agree with the above, issue seems related to the 1.2 3 cyclinder and not just ibiza related. I am really surprised in how much of a known fault this is. Independant garage knew all about it and had at least 4 ibizas had come in and Seat dealer knew about the fault.

So why have Seat not released a recall of the cam chain and tentioner kit for the cars effected??

Any how seat uk customer care seem helpful so far! I have a case number and checking against my VIN number details so time will tell.

 

[RaggedLob]

What gets me going is that, as said before, VW and Skoda accepted that a problem existed and modified the engine accordingly, but Seat didn't seem to get involved..

Instead, there is a kit on sale ( i understand about £250) that has to be factory fitted.. why should we have to splash out for VAG design screw ups? Surely this should bring about some sort of recall, or even just a guarantee that if something goes wrong, we will be reimbursed..

This smacks of a bit of a cheat, that only goes unnoticed by the general public because Seat isn't a large multinational, therefore public pressure is lacking..

 

[RUM4MO]

The sad but maybe correct way to resolve the issues with this engine, after trying the usual dealer fixes and talking to the VAG marque UK importer, would be to collectively (Fabia + Polo + Ibiza) contact Watchdog at the BBC - I'm sure that all VAG marques importers would squirm a bit after a big bit of publicity. I'd reckon that it would take that to change any attitudes as the fear of losing market share at a time when business is slow should influence them.

As to what anyone with this problem does for transport in the mean time - I can't answer that!

One final point as a "non 1.2" VAG owner, there does seem to be quite a lot of people with these engines not having a problem - and dealer's techs saying that they are not seeing many failures - but I can see that when it does happen to YOU it is a big problem that should not have happened and should be modified out of the engines FOC.

 

[tombarnsley]

sorry to sound like a noob nut does this happen on the 1.4 75ps model too

 

[RUM4MO]

sorry to sound like a noob nut does this happen on the 1.4 75ps model too

No no, differant problems there maybe - or none if you are lucky - that engine has a cambelt but its best to change it every 4 years or 60,000 miles - whichever comes first. The different problems could be piston ring wear, I'd hope if it is the later BBY etc engine then that would not be a problem, but postings do crop up critisising that engine - its a lazy inflexable engine below 3000 RPM and a bit rough above that - but its okay I suppose, my wife's Polo 9N has that engine and at seven years and 60,000 miles, it does like a bit of oil now and again - maybe 0.5 litre every 2000 > 3000 miles.

 

[mixupz]

Can't believe this may have potentially happened to me
Tried to start It this morning first time although it may have been a subconsious thing it sounded like something chain like had droppped, then it just wouldn't start.... Mileage is 37k . What to do? I really can't afford the full cost that people have quoted to get work done....

 

[joeg]

Polo same issue - timing chain

All,

I apologies if you feel I am posting on the wrong manufacturer's forum, although I also share the same grumbles that I have read in these forums. My partner has a 53 plat VW polo 1.2 12v. On monday morning when she tried to start the car to go to work it wouldn't start. AA came and failed. The car was then towed to the local VW Stealer and we were told that the timing chain had gone due to the tensioner and had damaged a valve. I know I know change the record!
When I looked on the internet for this fault I was shocked at the frequency this fault happens on Polo's, Ibiza's and Fabia's.
Our car has been in our possesion from new and is a 2nd car in our household with only 34,000 miles on the clock.
The car is still sitting at the stealership waiting for us to authorise the £550 repair (although may be more if their is further engine damage).
Needless to say I have been straight onto VW however they are terrible to deal with as they can't offer any technical info as their customer team are effectively non customer facing. I find this ridiculous, however the garage and vw are trying to get us a good will payment even though we have been told by the dealership that we are not a loyal vw customer even though we bought the car from new from a vw dealership and had the 1st 2 services done at a VW dealership.
My argument to them has been that 1)this is clearly a well known VAG engine fault on a part that is supposed to last the life time of the vehicle and at least more than 34k.
2)Had they known that there is a tensioner fix to this issue and they could tell me that we didnt get serviced at a dealership then they should have contacted us in writing to get the car sorted prior to the timing chain going and damaging the engine. 3)I have also reviewed the owners manual and nowhere does it state that this part needs to be maintained/replaced(apparently they check this in vw services).

Anyway, I want them to cover some of the cost. Have you guys had any joy getting compo from Seat and can you share any info on how you dealt with the fault. I have read on this forum that Watchdog has been discussed and I totally am behind this. This is not a consumable part and therefore it shouldn't break and if VAG are getting so many problems with this they should be recalling this car IMO. Beware if you have this engine and it hasn't went belly up yet. This has to fall under the sales of goods act as being unfit for purpose which supercedes the car being out of warranty. I will go legal with this if I am unsatisfied with VW's response.
Incase you are wondering I have posted on VW fan sites however they do not seem to be as technically astute as the contributors to this website. If you have had any joy from the manufacturer with this problem then please let me know how you were successful. Sorry for the length of this post.

Cheers

Joe