Toledo TDI cooling issues

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
Cooling system is acting up on my Toledo.

started by loosing coolant,

I have flow through the system, i can see it trickling back from the small return pipe on top of the header tank which makes me think the waterpump is ok
Also the heater matrix heats up and cools down, on idle it's generally cold but has been known to get warm with the engine. but is always warm above idle speeds. But also fades away at high rpms, like when over taking something...

I thought it might be blocked and the coolant was a manky brown colour, so i flushed it.
flushed clean and clear, however all the pipework was stained with an orangey deposit, like rust if you will.
on re-filling the system it was a painstaking process, and took a while to do.
After all this it started blowing coolant out the header tank overflow, and built up excessive pressure - the top and bottom rad' hoses were firm with internal pressure.

This led me to thinking the thermostat was stuck and therefore removed it (I've ordered a new one to be safe)

after flushing and re-filling it the second time the overflowing has simply gotten worse, i now cannot go 500yds without the coolant level raising in the tank.
Only does it under load though, when it's idling it's fine and everything settles down, the coolant level returns to normal and the pipes remain soft.
Drive it, and it overflows and expands again, but stays that way until you either let it cool naturally or release the pressure by venting the header tank.

a guy from my local motorworld was being nosey and reckoned it'd had radweld in it at some time in it's life. Now i dont know what readweld looks like so could be a load of bunkum.

It has been suggested to me of HGF and gasses leaking into the cooling system, but there is no unusual odour there at all, and no mayy on the dip-stick etc
exhaust gasses from the tail pipe are clean and clear also.....Bizzarre

Help?
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
I saw that too,
i was actually referring to what pressure e.g PSI - BAR i should be seeing in the cylinders
i read somewhere last night that it's around 500psi / 35bar....cant remember where the page was now as i've read SO many different articles in the last 48 hours my brain hurts lol
 
Sep 29, 2008
835
1
Bradford
two words.................................. water pump,
dont fook about changing anything else it wil be a waste of time, change the water pump and timing belt while you're at it,
this happened to mine last year, spent ages trying different things, finally removed the water pump to find it had come off the shaft, david at sere motors on here supplied mine for around 100 notes all in, also do you know that it is crucial that you refill the coolant system with G12 coolant from any vag dealer, £10 per litre and you will need two minimum.
 

dvance

Active Member
Mar 23, 2010
273
0
Well excuse my ignorance but from what I've tinkered with the engines of my previous cars and my dad's I would imagine the pressure you would be looking to see would be 19.5 atm or about 280-90psi, as the pressure at the lowest compression point would be when you're in the exhaust cycle so won't that be 1 atm?
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
two words.................................. water pump,
dont fook about changing anything else it wil be a waste of time, change the water pump and timing belt while you're at it,
this happened to mine last year, spent ages trying different things, finally removed the water pump to find it had come off the shaft, david at sere motors on here supplied mine for around 100 notes all in, also do you know that it is crucial that you refill the coolant system with G12 coolant from any vag dealer, £10 per litre and you will need two minimum.

Hiya, Picked the car up tonight after having timing belt, water-pump (metal impellor) and thermostat in it. And the car's still overheating and loosing coolant.

It's when you give it some beans to overtake another car or when it's going uphill that it cooks and rises to about 110 / 115*, driving on flat's is fine and she rests at 90* The heater also goes cold

Next thing i'm gonna try is a new header tank and cap. Cos if that cap aint holding pressure properly then i guess it could cause problems...

After that all i can think of is:
Blocked Heater matrix / Radiator
Cylinder head or Head-gasket problem still
 

dvance

Active Member
Mar 23, 2010
273
0
Should it not be extremely easy to check the header tank and cap? Like get somebody to rev the car inside until it starts cooking while you look at the header tank and cap (well stay at a reasonable distance if there's going to be pressure released)? Any leaks from the header tank should be quite apparent, as to pressure -- I suppose you could try to undo the cap, but you should be extra careful while doing that so you don't get massive burns. Then again don't do it so you don't get hurt :)
 

Seatmann

Rough around the edges
Sep 16, 2010
5,568
9
Scotlanda
Your head could be leaking pressure slightly when you're giving the car boot. You don't always get get an oil and water mix which turns the oil choclatey (yes like coco pops). The majority of times it's between the cylinder and water jacket. It only has to be a tiny leak because of the high pressures involved. It might be worth getting an exhaust gas anyliser in the header tank to see if it can measure any gases. Most garages will do it for a small fee and it could help rule it in or out.
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
Think i might have gotten to the bottom of it...
It's had a new header cap (Genuine) and already has made an improvment.
Car no longer overheats, but does build up considerable pressure in the rad pipes...
me and my mechanic then noticed the bottom of the rad was stone cold as is the bottom hose all the way through to the thermostat where it becomes slightly warmer.

Suspect blocked rad at present.

No trace of HGF after looking at the results of a leak test and he also added a sort of dye into the coolant which glows flourescent green under UV light. had that running through it for a day or two and drove it every way possible, tidily right up to thrashing the hell out of it for 20 miles with no sign of leaks anywhere.
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
UPDATE::

Got a new Rad' 650mm and plumbed it in..

It's made no difference to be honest.
My cooling system is till under a great deal of pressure, and the bottom hose remains stone cold, as does the entire core of the radiator.
Top hose gets warm progressively.

Has had New thermostat and water-pump in the couple of months (metal impellor pump)

The heater blows hot and cold. But unly goes cold when under load, like overtaking or pulling up-hill.

I've had it examined and my mechanic can find no trace of HGF after doing a leak test and a dye test in the coolant...

I'm stumped....
 

Seatmann

Rough around the edges
Sep 16, 2010
5,568
9
Scotlanda
I would be consideing the head gasket. If you are absolutely sure that the thermostat is in the right way and you've tried a new water pump etc then there's nothing really left apart from the gasket bud. Your symptoms all suggest that it probably is, the coolant will be getting burnt off more than likely. If it's only a tiny leak which has only just started then the head will be fine.
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
On giving the car an oil and filter change i decided to flush the coolant one last time, but this time started by using a bottle of Holts Speed flush.
went for a spin to run the stuff through the system, good oppertunity to see some mates a few miles away then came home tonight

opened the door and could smell the distinctive smell of a hot engine.
popped the bonnet to check coolant level as the guage squealed at me comming up my driveway, and could instantly taste coolant in the air under the bonnet.
driveshaft is soaked
subframe is soaked, and there's coolant marks on my sump - yep, it would seem it's leaking from the water pump which is only a month or two old!!

peeed off? Much!

So it looks like it's going back to Aberystwyth to be stripped. Replace the water pump, new temp sender (got a gut feeling it aint reading right - just a hunch), Head off, skimmed and new gasket.

If it still aint right i'm getting rid of it as fast as...
 
Last edited:

akchappers

Active Member
Jun 27, 2010
3,069
7
Gillingham Dorset.
But if it was the NEW pump which was fitted and now caused further damage or problems surely the garage is liable for the bill because it would seem to me that if it was the water pump in the first place you wouldnt have these problems now if the garage hadnt done the job wrong\ fitted a defective pump! I would be miffed too!
ak
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
I supplied parts for the job, bought the waterpump from vwspares.co.uk (AVS car parts)

the guy that did it is a family friend who dosn't cut corners

it'll most likley go back to him to investigate the cause of the leak (i'm guessing due to the huge pressure in the cooling system that it's suffering with - and it only started leaking after whacking some speed flush through it, so..)

tbh i'm beginning to loose my rag with it and the decision to get rid of it is beginning to get a lot closer
 

Russhowe

Active Member
Aug 31, 2010
72
0
Lampeter, West Wales, UK
Well i've almost got it all apart, just waiting for a 10mm long reach socket as mine seems to have gone walkies...
judging from where the coolant stains are (pink) it seems to get more concentrated toward the bearing on the waterpump (near the belt gear) so hopefully that's all it can be.

Other suggestions i've had are:
Cracked head?
Cracked Block?
Leaking headgasket (on the edge / corner)

more info as it develops
 
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