Non-Starting Cupra - Whats Wrong Now? (Inc Video)

[ZBOYD]

The Dealer you took your vehicle too for the lights, sounds like a bloody good Dealer. But if your vehicle was a non starter could you HONESTLY say that any of the changes have absaloutly no affect on the cause!! The Dealer made a decision on this vehicle based on the initial inspection, a front mounted intercooler four times the size of the original is pretty significant, as is the remap work and boost control devices! I don't think attitude helped either! May have been a different story if he was complaining of a rear wiper fault for example!

I have no complaints about my dealer, they have been very good. If I suspected any of my mods were causing a fault then I would consult the specialists who fitted them for their diagnosis and opinion even if that was at my own cost.

However if the car was a non starter due to a defective relay, is that really a fault of the modification? A defective relay can fail on a standard car causing it to be a non starter. It would appear some dealers at least know about the relay in this particular scenario, if its known about its a simple enough item to check.

A few years back it became common knowledge that water ingress into the ECU on Mk3 Ibiza's could easily cause them to short. If that ECU was remapped was it the fault of the customer they had the car remapped or that the manufacturer badly designed the seals or drain holes and positioned the ECU in such a place that it could potentially be sat in a bath of rain water. A hypothetical question it might be, but it isn't always just cut and dry the fault of a modification.

I do totally agree that having a professional attitude when discussing problems with a dealer though is essential. I try to offer my opinion as to what i think might be a cause and be honest. Though it can be frustrating when problems arise there is nothing productive about ranting at people only doing their job.

I would much rather have a professional relationship with dealers and help us all work together to bring about successful resolutions.

 

[seremotors]

Well said zboyd
Certain dealers have to lose the 'attitude' and be more customer focused.
Certain customers need to be more open and realistic.
We depend on our quality of service as we know we are by no means always the best-priced. Block exemption changed the nature of the business forever but most dealers still depend on consumer ignorance and play the 'fear card' There always has to be a compromise between cost and help but the current stance seems to be that money overrides everything, a very short-sighted position imo

 

[phil3012]

Only because dealers need to charge an extortionate £90 + vat per hour labour to pay for the flashy showrooms. If you dont't think that's extortion, then consider that a fully trained CISCO engineer might get £45 to £75 per hour and they do a lot more than click a few buttons on what is little more than a semi intelligent terminal. Even the average GP is only on £30 to £50 an hour!!

Essentially what is happening is that once the manufacturers warranty has expired, you lose the service trade to specialised independants who charge half the price for the same, in some cases better quality of work.

I was thinking the same, £90 an hour plus VAT is madness. In comparison to what say an IT Professional say would be charged out to a client at.

Its no wonder people don't use main dealers for servicing, especially after the warrenty has run out.

Yes I know this is probably subsidizing the new car side of business and the flash showroom etc and this is where a dealer makes their money, but should it really be this way.

Yes I accept there are some highly trainined technicians about, but I bet when my car goes in for a service some young lad does it, with no disrespect have they had much training? I bet he earns nowhere near £90 an hour, probably more like £10.

Personally two things matter to me when buying a car, the fact I can have a test drive and the price. I don't care about a flash showroom. Many dealers it takes several attempts even to speak to somebody on the phone. As long as the car is clean (which my Cupra wasn't particually inside) when I buy it, I don't care what the dealership looks like, could as well be in a warehouse somewhere, or a gravel car park.

It sounds to me as if the business model in the car industry is to pot and to be honest is it sustainable?, probably not long term.

In the last 10 years apart from standard services, one tyre and a pair of wiper blades it will be less than £300 I have spent on parts and labour on cars at main dealers.

Just thinking about it the guy in the Toyota parts department fitted my wiper blades FOC and the genuine blades were cheaper than Honda.

 

[shaunymac]

I would just like to say that I have been on the end of two completley different approches to customer service with regards to SEAT, i have a dealer very close to me but the service is truly awful! Staff are rude and very un helpful, I have bought my last 2 cars from the other dealer which happens to be a considerable distance from where I live but it speaks for volumes the staff are pleasant and helpful and have always gone out of their way to help me. I would recommend Cheshunt motors to any VAG owner!

 

[seremotors]

guys if only you knew . . . .
Phil3012, there isnt one single dealer who has a say in how their showroom looks - the car manufacturers make it a (very expensive) condition of the franchise to have certain premises, certain staff levels, certain EVERYTHING. The idea is to be like Macdonalds or KFC and have international brand identity - no matter where in the world you are, the local SEAT dealer will still look the same. And who pays for it? YOU by the ridiculous labour rates needed to finance the overheads.
If only manufacturers realised that most people are like you and dont care that the car is more important than the showroom. Renault had their head so far up their a**e when I worked for them - we had to answer the phone 'Hello, Renault (dealer name)' as they deemed themselves as doing US the favour by allowing us to sell their cars.
Shaunymac, your post just goes to show that any dealership is only as good as the people staffing it. Nice to hear a dealer getting good feedback.

 

[phil3012]

seremotors I'm sure you're right, I used to do some work for a major motor manuafcturer and they used to dictate to dealers what to do.

What is irritating though is when dealers advertise £99 for any service for cars over 3 years old... Toyoat did this and I was paying £280 for some services. I know one of the SEAT dealers near me offers a similar deal too.

It is good though to have constructive discussions with dealers and I hope some of the comments are taken on board if possible by the good dealers who frequent this forum.

 

[shaunymac]

guys if only you knew . . . .
Phil3012, there isnt one single dealer who has a say in how their showroom looks - the car manufacturers make it a (very expensive) condition of the franchise to have certain premises, certain staff levels, certain EVERYTHING. The idea is to be like Macdonalds or KFC and have international brand identity - no matter where in the world you are, the local SEAT dealer will still look the same. And who pays for it? YOU by the ridiculous labour rates needed to finance the overheads.
If only manufacturers realised that most people are like you and dont care that the car is more important than the showroom. Renault had their head so far up their a**e when I worked for them - we had to answer the phone 'Hello, Renault (dealer name)' as they deemed themselves as doing US the favour by allowing us to sell their cars.
Shaunymac, your post just goes to show that any dealership is only as good as the people staffing it. Nice to hear a dealer getting good feedback.

credit where credit is due!

 

[Al]

If you research the Copa, you will find there are mechanical differences...it is not just an ECU change and an exhaust!

Like the Cupra and the Cupra R....there are so many differences!

There is no official changes list I can find in English that gives a complete list, there are ones in Dutch...but I don't speak it!

Am I the only one who picked up on this?

 

[seremotors]

You know, irrespective of the rights and wrongs of all involved, I think we should remember that there is a guy who has spent a huge amount of time and money modifying his already expensive car. The car is fixed but it must have been gut wrenching trying to sort it all out. Not sure how I would have reacted in the same position

 

[Donnyboy]

Reading this and other threads/posts, it does seem that some dealers, as soon as they see any mods or changes, use this to either refuse to do work without charging or blame anything they can on the mods.

I do understand that some cars are highly modified, but some small changes seem to get blamed for faults. Is this an easy way for dealers to cash in and charge for anything they do on the car???

I took my Mk1 FR to a local dealer because of the slow speed fan fault. I told them what was wrong and how to fix it. They told me they didn't think it was a fault and asked if I was sure ( having had the car from new) it hasn't always done this. I was also told that if I didn't use my air-con then the fault didn't happen!! WTF!! If I did want them to look at the car then they would charge me as they didn't see any problems. I took the car to Bickets and they compared the car with another in stock, ordered parts, fixed it, gave me loan car and were great to deal with. They even txt me when I book my car in for things to remind me!!

Some dealers just don't want to know, where others do their best to maintain a good standard of work and a good reputation.

My car was standard by the way.

 

[ibiza_1.4tdi]

evreything aside in this post, just looking at dealer attitudes i do think that some dealers need to take a good look at themselves and the service they offer, i am in the middle of 2 dealerships, 1 wolverhampton (westmidlands) and 1 kidderminster. ive purchased cars from both, 3 infact and i can say the diffrences between the two are night and day, wolverhampton (barlows - to name them) were a waste of space when i had issues with my car (even though it wasnt modified) where as i have always been pleased with the service of kidderminster clarkes (credit where its due) and becuase of this i have returned time and time again, when ive had issuse or when purchasing a new car. So both myself and the dealer benifitted from having a good attitude and good comunication between themselves and myself the consumer, they sell cars and get more work and im happy because i get a car that i want and if any faults appear there resolved quickly.

 

[phil3012]

Its obvious that many people have issues with their local dealers, in all honesty I haven't come accross a good one in 11 years of owning new cars, but I'm sure there are some out there.

If the service/repairs side of the business is so critical to the survival of a dealership, why do they place so little focus on getting it right?

The number of times dealers have tried to rip me off, lied to me, forget to order items and misdiagnose things is unreal.

A little more attention in this area would see customers return time after time, rather than go to another main dealer or independant garage.

I believe they rely on the fact they are often the only dealer in that area, or have the monopoly on one for more franchises in an area. SEAT has quite a small dealer network in comparison to some, so the consumer has less choice.

 

[ZBOYD]

Slightly off on a tangent, but bringing up the issue of good and bad dealers. It now appears VW UK have now come up with a new 'rate my dealer' system on their website.

Will SEAT introduce such a function in time?

It might shake up the dealers a bit, who knows.

Started a new thread on it though, link below so might be better to discuss that aspect there.

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2152198#post2152198

 

[seremotors]

Slightly off on a tangent, but bringing up the issue of good and bad dealers. It now appears VW UK have now come up with a new 'rate my dealer' system on their website.

Will SEAT introduce such a function in time?

It might shake up the dealers a bit, who knows.

Started a new thread on it though, link below so might be better to discuss that aspect there.

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2152198#post2152198

Every dealer is obliged to log EVERY workshop job with SEAT and do telephone followups but like all such schemes, its for internal use only. I agree that a public rating would be a move in the right direction

 

[robdf2]

RBDF2, what issues do you have with your vehicle?

you have pm

 

[chris285]

just been going through the thread, i think the main points have been covered and i will not add to them already

one thing i will say as i am picking up my new mk1 fr tdi on sat is am am glad the finance is seperate, the car is mine straight off and if i want to then i can do some mods but i am not sure if i will to start with

bad luck mate with the cupra anyway

 

[Poverty]

What happened to giving the customer what they want? Or is the consumer just supposed to be told what there getting and they can either like it or lump it? QUOTE]

Maybe Im missing a point here but is that not why some people buy certain cars I think its called free choice - was anyone here here forced into buying a SEAT? Was anyone told that they could mod their car and not affect warranty? I doubt it. Make your choice, accept the consequences.

After this thread im not sure if I want to buy a Cupra anymore, will probably go japanese or german in the form of a bmw or audi with enough power so that it doesnt need tuning. Only reason why I wanted one in the first place is because its so easy and cheap to get big power out of the cupra, but seeing as some dealers and SEAT are so arsey about it all they can stuff it.

 

[Al]

After this thread im not sure if I want to buy a Cupra anymore, will probably go japanese or german in the form of a bmw or audi with enough power so that it doesnt need tuning. Only reason why I wanted one in the first place is because its so easy and cheap to get big power out of the cupra, but seeing as some dealers and SEAT are so arsey about it all they can stuff it.

Snag is this if you go with BMW or Audi - You will need to spend a lot more money to get the same performance, and you will have the same warranty issues there too.

A Subaru Impreza, Focus ST or Astra VXR on the other hand.......

(never thought I would advocate a VXR)

 

[Fl@pper]

guys if only you knew . . . .
Phil3012, there isnt one single dealer who has a say in how their showroom looks - the car manufacturers make it a (very expensive) condition of the franchise to have certain premises, certain staff levels, certain EVERYTHING. The idea is to be like Macdonalds or KFC and have international brand identity - no matter where in the world you are, the local SEAT dealer will still look the same. And who pays for it? YOU by the ridiculous labour rates needed to finance the overheads.

that's crap, we self designed and built a whole dealership to our own specification with the only proviso being from SEAT was that the colour scheme and branding was in keeping with it's Corporate Identity with a correct standardisation for sinage etc

it was all discussed with them from the start and to be honest we got nothing but praise off them for some of the ideas we as staff suggested and later implemented in the design, so much so VW actually use one of them in their required standards now

Renault however are absolutely insatiable with demands for their dealers and AUDI do indeed have a one size fits all dealer design

every building is different in it's own way and i have seen many dealers/kfc/mcdonalds that although all look 'correct' are very very diferent places to visit

 

[Poverty]

Snag is this if you go with BMW or Audi - You will need to spend a lot more money to get the same performance, and you will have the same warranty issues there too.

A Subaru Impreza, Focus ST or Astra VXR on the other hand.......

(never thought I would advocate a VXR)

im thinking RS4, M3, 335i here, would keep it longer than a SEAT and shouldnt be too much more expensive as those cars are so perfect imo, that any mod you attempt could possibly ruin it. Or just go the Evo route, only issue being is that the cupra is the fastest car I can insure at the privelege of 2.5 grand so will probably get one and keep it for a year or two until I can afford to insure a grp 20 car.