Would you change fuel?

[DOLBY]

I cant believe this debate keeps going on and on and on. The moderators should keep throwing these threads in the scrapyard.

Why do people buy performance cars and put crap fuel (ok 95 isnt crap but it certainely isnt good for the car) in them?. People these days are so naive it is unreal. Sorry to sound like this, but i see it all the time. Expensive powerful cars and their owners going to asda fuel station or something equally naff to fill up.

All the people that say they dont notice no difference are talking crap, as mine ran like poo till the £10 i put in was swiftley burnt out the car. There was none of this adaption talk that people talk about. As soon as i left the petrol station my car felt terrible, but i needed to do it to get home as the V power pumps had run out. THE 98 PETROL IS BETTER FOR THE ENGINE IN THE LONG RUN. Even if you dont 'feel' it, the engine will prefer it....end of. And still it works out around a fiver extra per tank over the 95 stuff.

Here is a fact for you, my friend has a LCR and had it mapped for £99 at jabba. Couple days later he reakoned it didnt feel like 265 bhp. So took it to rollers and it made about 240 bhp. The reason? It was set up for 95 ron petrol. He recently had another RR and it made 280 on v power.......SO GO FIGURE

 

[York]

I cant believe this debate keeps going on and on and on. The moderators should keep throwing these threads in the scrapyard.

Why do people buy performance cars and put crap fuel (ok 95 isnt crap but it certainely isnt good for the car) in them?. People these days are so naive it is unreal. Sorry to sound like this, but i see it all the time. Expensive powerful cars and their owners going to asda fuel station or something equally naff to fill up.

All the people that say they dont notice no difference are talking crap, as mine ran like poo till the £10 i put in was swiftley burnt out the car. There was none of this adaption talk that people talk about. As soon as i left the petrol station my car felt terrible, but i needed to do it to get home as the V power pumps had run out. THE 98 PETROL IS BETTER FOR THE ENGINE IN THE LONG RUN. Even if you dont 'feel' it, the engine will prefer it....end of. And still it works out around a fiver extra per tank over the 95 stuff.

Here is a fact for you, my friend has a LCR and had it mapped for £99 at jabba. Couple days later he reakoned it didnt feel like 265 bhp. So took it to rollers and it made about 240 bhp. The reason? It was set up for 95 ron petrol. He recently had another RR and it made 280 on v power.......SO GO FIGURE

Lol nice read. It's wasn't a thread of which is better, it was purely a thread to see what problems I could have if I changed the fuel. Seen as the car had ran on 95 Ron for nearly 30k of it's life. I will be using the v-power from now on.

 

[CupraRmark]

BUT !!! if you take a modded car for a map running Vpower then its set up to run that then obviously it will need to run vpower or super equivalant,if you dont your gonna see poo results if 95 is then used....
if you had a map and the mapper mapped the car because lets say you told him things are tight atm and you only use 95 unleaded etc and he should then set that car up as best as possible on the fuel you mostly use in the tank then if you use 98 supers then hopefully the ecu will adjust and give you some extra benefits anyway, but as stated it wont work the opposite way i.e the first section...
my absolute out the showroom standard LC doesnt really make much difference that you hardly feel but even so i run V power, tesco 99 just seems to burn around 20-40 miles less....

 

[traumapat]

So why would a remapper inform you that they can but generally dont map for higher octane fuel and 95 Ron is fine...

Tuners going to have poor results on 95ron compared to a tuner mapping engines to use 99ron. Ecu will retard the engine to stop pre dentonation.

Jabba have always recommended decent fuel pre mapping, at least a couple of tanks.

 

[Fadel]

It's like Usan Bolt, instead of eating a very healthy and protein filled diet to get the best out of his body he can he sits and eats McDonalds and tins of Irn Bru.

Ye but he just ate chicken nuggets...

 

[t0m]

Tuners going to have poor results on 95ron compared to a tuner mapping engines to use 99ron. Ecu will retard the engine to stop pre dentonation.

Jabba have always recommended decent fuel pre mapping, at least a couple of tanks.

Yep.. AmD suggested I use V-Power or Tesco 99 pre mapping to get the best results. No problem really as it has nothing but V-Power.

I don't think my car is shy on the power either so it certainly seems to work

 

[CJRamze]

Ye but he just ate chicken nuggets...

I was just thinking that!
Bad analogy really, Probably the only athlete I know that eats like that

I cant believe this debate keeps going on and on and on. The moderators should keep throwing these threads in the scrapyard.

Why do people buy performance cars and put crap fuel (ok 95 isnt crap but it certainely isnt good for the car) in them?. People these days are so naive it is unreal. Sorry to sound like this, but i see it all the time. Expensive powerful cars and their owners going to asda fuel station or something equally naff to fill up.

I agree, putting 95 Ron fuel in a high performance car like an Aston or a GTR or a tuned Subaru or Evo is rediculous.
Your car will generally run like crap as its designed for a higher octane.
However the LCR isn't, and with a stock ECU theres little to no performance increase in using premium fuels.

All the people that say they dont notice no difference are talking crap, as mine ran like poo till the £10 i put in was swiftley burnt out the car. There was none of this adaption talk that people talk about. As soon as i left the petrol station my car felt terrible, but i needed to do it to get home as the V power pumps had run out.

So your telling me that all the people who run supermarket fuels who claim that it feels no different are talking crap? Thats a pretty bold statement from someone who doesn't drive everyone else's car...
I think its you personally that "Feels the difference" I dont think it feels any different at all but your "Looking for it to feel better" because you've paid more where as I'm comparing the fact that its cost me considerably less to use supermarket fuels
I've filled up with both, and dependant on how poor I am at the time depends on which fuel I can use. The Margins in performance are small and for people that are driving back and forth to work during the week 95Ron is fine.

THE 98 PETROL IS BETTER FOR THE ENGINE IN THE LONG RUN. Even if you dont 'feel' it, the engine will prefer it....end of. And still it works out around a fiver extra per tank over the 95 stuff.

Generally the premium pumps are over 10P per L more expensive than standard and as the tank is 55L and your looking at £5.50 minimum.
I'll agree thats not that much, However some people dont have premium nearby and when they do sometimes its more than 10P extra (my local one is) People like yourself (But not yourself specifically so dont think I'm singling you out) give the impression that their damaging their cars by using 95Ron.

Here is a fact for you, my friend has a LCR and had it mapped for £99 at jabba. Couple days later he reakoned it didnt feel like 265 bhp. So took it to rollers and it made about 240 bhp. The reason? It was set up for 95 ron petrol. He recently had another RR and it made 280 on v power.......SO GO FIGURE

So it was mapped for £100... Lucky man!
Did he get a rolling road printout of this?

And of course it was setup for 95Ron,
People generally don't map for above 95 Unless they have to (Stage 1) because it means that people might not know and wont be able to work out why its not running aswell on lower grade fuels. So what mappers do is leave the fuelling alone (As far as Ron Ratings go) and just map for stage 1.
If your going higher than that you can request that its mapped for above that to get the most out of it but people generally dont because not everyone has a local 99Ron garage.

This case is a Dyno lottery, a 40BHP increase from using premium fuels on a remap set to use standard fuelling? Thats a tad strange in my book.


Dont get me wrong I'm not doubting premium fuels.
I used to run my Cupra on it for a long time and I'm aware that its a purer fuel and providing your tracking/spirited driving I'm sure you will notice a difference and it will burn alot better but if your pottering back and forth to work not only will you not notice a difference but it wont make a difference other than your wallet is atleast £6 worse off and theres been no proof that it damages your engine. Providing its serviced correctly and you occasionally buy some injector cleaner (If your really that worried)

I've never heard of someone on here coming on and saying.
"You know what... My car feels like crap when I put supermaket fuel in it."

Only current members who fill up with VPower and have then convinced themselves that it feels better say that, If it wasn't up to scratch your car would be running alot worse than just "Feeling" a little worse.

Personally I literally feel no difference in my day to day jaunts but should I take the car for a spirited drive I generally fill up with premium. Thats why the manual/fuel cap says 95-98, You can use both.

Horses for courses

Also see:
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2003-07-30-premiumgas_x.htm
Obviously a US article and take with a pinch of salt especially considering I've seen 85 Ron in the US but it justifies the point.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/premium-gas-luxury-vehicles.htm
The difference between recommends and requires.
Also bear in mind VW's in the US use 89Ron fuel and achieve the same performance as the UK (stock)

 

[traumapat]

Cars that have been remapped stage 1 are mapped to use better fuels. Which tuner is mapping to 95 then?
You need to remember most cars in this thread are "tuned" so will produce less on 95.

Would agree on the stock argument but was certain its designed for 97ron or above.(lcr)

 

[CJRamze]

A mapper that actually know what there talking about and cares as much as you do for your car would make things very clear to you and would be checking the car prior to you paying and being happy with the car.
My car is a Custom stage 2 car.
What's the point of getting a car mapped but not using the best fuel possible.
It's like Usan Bolt, instead of eating a very healthy and protein filled diet to get the best out of his body he can he sits and eats McDonalds and tins of Irn Bru.

Mapping a car for 95 ron fuel makes no sense to me. Paying £500 for a map, might aswell get the best one possible.

Like I said, believe what you want to believe

Just to address your point.
I'm not saying there isn't a performance increase in premiums (Whilst marginal)
But Will @ P-Torque has said his Stage 1's are fine on 95Ron (As in it wont cause problems)
However I'm sure you'll get a little extra out of 99Ron, the OP is asking if any problems can arise and no, No problems will arise from the use of supermarket fuel.

and should I be going back and forth to work (Like I was over Winter) and not going for spirited drives theres nothing wrong with using 95 RON.

Should I be taking my car up the brecon beacons or over to the Isle Of Man again or taking my car on the track I'll shoot for premium for that increase but general day to day its fine. Thats why our fuel caps say 95-98.

 

[CJRamze]

Cars that have been remapped stage 1 are mapped to use better fuels. Which tuner is mapping to 95 then?
You need to remember most cars in this thread are "tuned" so will produce less on 95.

Would agree on the stock argument but was certain its designed for 97ron or above.(lcr)

Mappers dont "Map" for 95Ron as its the standard,
But generally they dont map for higher quality fuels unless you request it.
Stage 1 is designed for zero modifications to your car and if thats the case it should (and in my case does) run fine on 95Ron.

Also the OP has just bought his car I may have assumed he's running stock.

Again just to re-iterate, I'm not doubting that there isn't a small performance increase in premiums.
I'm saying it wont cause any issues (Damage)

 

[t0m]

This thread could go on forever, but as mentioned the majority of Cupra's on here are mapped now so will run higher octane for best results (like I do). My car does feel rough and produce lower mpg on 95 ron and it's not just me 'thinking it' because I pay more for super.... It is fact! I've tried a month of regular when my car was a daily driver and was seeing 2/3 less mpg per day even after ECU had adjusted! (trialled it for 4 weeks and used 2 tanks)...

SEAT have recommended 97/98 upwards since the LC/LCR's have been in production, so I'm not sure why we're talking about 'what's best for these engines?'

If your a daily driver and aren't too fussed about losing a couple of mpg in your standard Cupra and are low on money that month, then use regular unleaded it won't kill your car by any means and you won't lose 40bhp!!

I personally wouldn't own the car if I couldn't afford the best petrol to put in mine. But that's just me I guess. Maybe as it's my project/pride and joy I will always refuse to put regular stuff in it, knowing that it won't feel as good as it can do.

All boils down to an individual's situation, needs and finances at the end of the day. Money is the deciding factor and in the current climate I'm not surprised if alot more people run regular now.

 

[traumapat]

Mappers dont "Map" for 95Ron as its the standard,
But generally they dont map for higher quality fuels unless you request it.
Stage 1 is designed for zero modifications to your car and if thats the case it should (and in my case does) run fine on 95Ron.

Also the OP has just bought his car I may have assumed he's running stock.

Again just to re-iterate, I'm not doubting that there isn't a small performance increase in premiums.
I'm saying it wont cause any issues (Damage)

which mappers dont map to for higher ron fuels and what figures are they producing? Are their customers happy with the figures being lower?

Id still want fuel with detergent added rather than the cheapest, but yes, you shouldnt damage anything using 95ron.
However when you do go back to decent fuel it woud be worth resetting the ecu and throttle body as the car will have retarded itself, let it adapt to the better ron.

 

[CJRamze]

P-Torque runs fine on Standard fuel. Stage 1 no mods.
Running 275.4 BHP with 290Ftlb of torque.

 

[traumapat]

P-Torque runs fine on Standard fuel. Stage 1 no mods.
Running 275.4 BHP with 290Ftlb of torque.

those figures on 95ron?

 

[t0m]

P-Torque runs fine on Standard fuel. Stage 1 no mods.
Running 275.4 BHP with 290Ftlb of torque.

Stage one LCR, no mods and those figures?!
Which map? P-Torque?

 

[Faisal]

simple resolution:

on a standard car you probably wont notice any difference.

but on a stage 2 car mapped with the higher detonation point that the 99ron fuel gives, it does make a difference.

as a matter of fact, fifth gear done a test on standard shell petrol vs v power petrol. they tested a clio sport, something else and a remapped scooby.

the clio made 3-5bhp gain or along those lines, where the scooby made a massive 20bhp gain with v poewr as it was mapped to suit it.

i think the article is available online if you want to google it.

 

[CJRamze]

Stage one LCR, no mods and those figures?!
Which map? P-Torque?

Apologies, Exhaust system and a decat ( I always forget about this )
Standard FMIC, TIP, Airbox, Filter etc.

The First couple of rolling roads (Pre Map) Made only 219bhp
However post map it made 274bhp on the same rollers on the same day.

Regardless of the dyno lottery thats a tidy increase.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnQjwvQWcb4

 

[DOLBY]

Hmmmm ok deep breath.....

QUOTE
I agree, putting 95 Ron fuel in a high performance car like an Aston or a GTR or a tuned Subaru or Evo is rediculous.
Your car will generally run like crap as its designed for a higher octane.
However the LCR isn't, and with a stock ECU theres little to no performance increase in using premium fuels.


Generally speaking any performance car (ie 220 bhp and upwards) are owned and run by enthusiasts (not always but 95% of the time), so the owner knows it needs the best fuel, mods, tyres etc etc. But as these cars are so cheap these days they are falling into the wrong hands so to speak. People that probably couldnt really afford it new, have bought one cheap and running cheap mods that are probably universal fitment from an old Saxo or something...hence these cars running and looking like crap.

So you saying a LCR cant have equal or more power than any Evo you care to mention?? A standard Evo should be run on 98 ron as a general rule...so a 300 bhp LCR shouldnt???




QUOTE
So your telling me that all the people who run supermarket fuels who claim that it feels no different are talking crap? Thats a pretty bold statement from someone who doesn't drive everyone else's car...
I think its you personally that "Feels the difference" I dont think it feels any different at all but your "Looking for it to feel better" because you've paid more where as I'm comparing the fact that its cost me considerably less to use supermarket fuels
I've filled up with both, and dependant on how poor I am at the time depends on which fuel I can use. The Margins in performance are small and for people that are driving back and forth to work during the week 95Ron is fine.

Ok, i use Tesco so isnt that a supermarket fuel or am i missing something here? My point is Asda fuel, as they have no premium fuel.
Ok, do a search about Premium fuel on here and i wont be suprised if 90% of mapped LCR cars, are always run on super....and many owners defending their use of the god stuff.
Ok so if you are pottering back and forth all week you dont put your foot down ocassionally??? no??? well maybe you have the wrong car my friend. So you get to the weekend (and only then) do you put the good stuff in? Im sorry i dont buy your comment and tbh im very confused by it.




QUOTE
So it was mapped for £100... Lucky man!
Did he get a rolling road printout of this?
This case is a Dyno lottery, a 40BHP increase from using premium fuels on a remap set to use standard fuelling? Thats a tad strange in my book.


I've never heard of someone on here coming on and saying.
"You know what... My car feels like crap when I put supermaket fuel in it.

Yes it was mapped at Inters 2010 and they had a deal on. He got a rolling roadprintout by AmD and was told it may be software related. So he tok it back to Jabba and they themselves noticed that is wasnt setup for 98 fuel. Since then he has only fitted a 007p (no performance gains) and a panel filter.....and a software tweak and he made 280 bhp. Of course you cannot get 280 from stage 1 but the software tweak helped here dont you agree??

 

[revere]

I put V-Power in my car and then Tesco 99 as a 2nd choice if the nearest place going is a Tesco and I'm low on fuel but I only put enough in to get me to my nearest Shell garage. Personally when I moved from 95 to 99 I felt a difference in response when accelerating and my engine note changed slightly as well, the engine felt like it wasn't labouring as much, this is only my opinion so please someone don't go into a rant and start flaming me for it.

Also you get double points for filling up with V-Power and you get a flashy card when you put enough in per month to join the V-Power club

 

[CJRamze]

Christ Almighty, I have to address all your points now.
This is hopeless.

But as these cars are so cheap these days they are falling into the wrong hands so to speak. People that probably couldnt really afford it new, have bought one cheap and running cheap mods that are probably universal fitment from an old Saxo or something...hence these cars running and looking like crap.

I don't see what this has to do with the topic.
Maybe you have the car but you've lost your job or you've taken a massive paycut? Thats why your struggling to put good fuel in?

So you saying a LCR cant have equal or more power than any Evo you care to mention??

A stock LCR CANNOT.
A modified LCR can... but I never said that it couldn't eitherway. Now your just making things up

A standard Evo should be run on 98 ron as a general rule...so a 300 bhp LCR shouldnt???

Wrong again, Yes Evo's run 98 however they come out of the factory like that.
Did I say a 300BHP LCR shouldn't at any point? No I did not.
Infact I said should I be taking mine on the track or out for a blast I'D use 98Ron.

I just stated to the OP that theres nothing wrong running cheap fuel.
I assumed he was stock because he bought it off someone else who used cheap fuel and the cars rated for 95-98Ron.

Ok, i use Tesco so isnt that a supermarket fuel or am i missing something here? My point is Asda fuel, as they have no premium fuel.
Ok, do a search about Premium fuel on here and i wont be suprised if 90% of mapped LCR cars, are always run on super....and many owners defending their use of the god stuff.

I classed Tesco as supermarket fuel because:
A) They are a supermarket
B) They sell 95Ron which most people use

I'm sure 90% of users here do run premium I'm not doubting that, As I've stated... I use premium, Is 95Ron fuel bad for the car? The answer is "No"

If your car is lumpy, and runs badly on 95Ron then I suggest you have that investigated unless your car is specifically mapped and now 95Ron is out of the question.
Thankfully my Stage 1 remap isn't remapped this way and I can run 95Ron fuel without issue.

"Ok so if you are pottering back and forth all week you dont put your foot down ocassionally??? no??? well maybe you have the wrong car my friend. So you get to the weekend (and only then) do you put the good stuff in? Im sorry i dont buy your comment and tbh im very confused by it.

How is what I said in any way confusing.
You think because I own an LCR and I drive to work I've got motorways/Open roads to travel on? and that because I dont put premium until I'm using it for actual spirited driving that means I have the wrong car?

Your statement in itself is confusing Dolby.
I live a little over 2 and a Half miles from work, I work from 6-7 in the morning to 7pm at night and my flat currently is so small that I can't keep a bike in it. So instead I have to drive. I live in inner Cardiff so I can't put my foot down nor should I not only because it would be dangerous to everyone else but my car wont be up to temprature!

I currently can't really afford premium fuel and other premium items as I'm supporting my girlfriend through Uni, I apologise for not fitting into your Golden Elite of LCR drivers but I'm doing the best I can.

Again....
Let me explain

The OP Asked if running 95Ron fuel in a Stock LCR would cause problems.
The answer... Is no

Might it cause problems in a Stage 2 LCR specfically designed to only take 98Ron and above Fuel?

Yes... but thats not what we are talking about.