tuning,quaife diff for leon cupra mk2

[robdf2]

i see what you mean but even £1800 is a lot just to get your car back to the way it was except for the new intercooler.
but as you say more power equals internal upgrades but saying that £1800 is half way there for more power

 

[RobH]

i see what you mean but even £1800 is a lot just to get your car back to the way it was except for the new intercooler.
but as you say more power equals internal upgrades but saying that £1800 is half way there for more power

know what your saying but spending 4k is alot especially when you didnt plan for it aswell as other commitments.

 

[robdf2]

tough decision to make , sometimes when these things happen it makes your mind up for you to get it done.
well it could have been more in the end for your repair so a lot spent but could have been worse.

 

[Leonneke]

i agree with all the above apart from the intercooler bit, its a must i blow a turbo becuase of this and it does add power and more low down shove imo.

Well hi there Rob. I will try to explain that your conclusion is totally wrong and just based on your suggestion. If your intercooler was the problem, than the story would be as following.

Your temperatur went OVER AND BEYOND the temp of 90-92 degrees. That is very easy to tell, you can see that on the dash. So if you really saw that, like up to 100 degrees or more, the turbo is not the problem. The problem then is, that you were stupid enough to keep on pulling behind the cars limits. But I don't think that is true, is it.
If the intercooler is running out, you can always tell.

I think, correct me if i am wrong, that your turbo blew up, without any warning or whatso-ever. There are several reasons why this happens. I will give you the some of the best:
1) pulling the turbo to soon, so when the OIL temp is not right yet ( takes very LONG - mostly up to 15-20 minutes)
2) a leak in the system, oil, weak bearings, turbo not correctly mounted
3) turbo is not 100 % from day one (it is made by men)

And what happens very, very often, is using the turbo in the wrong way.
Your car is mounted with the KKK Borg-Warner K04 TFSI turbo. Most people totally do not know what the real range of the turbo is. The main problem with the K04 is, that it really has a limit. It falls of like hell. This starts far more early then the 'red' lines in your rpm.

Lot's of people who have a fast car, don't really know where the power / torque is at it's best. I see lots of young guys, that drive the turbo over his max peak. It makes a lot of noise and more important, your turbo gets really hot and is constantly pushed to and over it's limits.

Driving a turbo motor is firstly using your brains and knowing what the turbo can do and cannot do. Again, a IC will give you ZERO extra power. It will make it possible to use your power longer and safer. My kkk04 turbo will be internally upgraded. This results in a higher peak performance of the turbo, up to an range above 6500 rpm. But more important, the turbo will spool up more early. Even with this update I will stay with the normal Intercooler at first.

Tuning is not about 'modding' . Tuning is about using the best parts that really connect with each other and play in each others range. If you mount a BIG Garrett turbo, than you will need more cooling. Same for intake and exhaust. Intake and turbo. Fuel and air.

 

[RobH]

Surely lowering intake temps gives you more power.

Never really rev the car to redline and i dont think it was No.2 on your list but it could be 1 or 3 but when it went, it wasnt in the power range ie lower than 3500 revs but the engine was cold, but like i said there was no oil damage and the turbine on the exhaust side is loose as if it has overheated. Maybe from the night before when it was getting some spirited driviing then didnt let it cool down properly ie turning the engine off straight after a blast and when i drove it the next morning bye bye turbo.

 

[robdf2]

lowering intake temps allows your car to hit the maximum bhp it can achieve and hold it there longer , doesnt actually give you more power.
the more efficient intercooler you have the longer you will be able to sustain your power for.

 

[Poverty]

lowering intake temps allows your car to hit the maximum bhp it can achieve and hold it there longer , doesnt actually give you more power.
the more efficient intercooler you have the longer you will be able to sustain your power for.

spot on. I think to BT the k04, you will end up spending 6k in all for all the supporting drivetrain and chassis mods which is quite a sum.

 

[Leonneke]

lowering intake temps allows your car to hit the maximum bhp it can achieve and hold it there longer , doesnt actually give you more power. the more efficient intercooler you have the longer you will be able to sustain your power for.

Very well said. Tried that a couple of times. A lot off people WANT this mod to give them more power.
Especially the guys that sell them. The better tuners and engineers, like J.D. over here, will NOT claim that. They will honestly tell you that there is no increase in power what-so-ever. And yes, a bigger turbo needs a better cooling. It is just the same with cold weather. It is not that the cold weather gives your car more power. The problem is, that the warmer weather will decrease your max bph. So a car does not run faster in the winter. No, it performs at it's best. The warmer it gets, the worser the performance.

In Holland there are also a lot of guys that mount a bigger intercooler. And they leave the turbo exactly the same. And yes, the S3 intercooler is better. But it has no benifit to mount it on the cupra for more power. Tuning is a 'practice' or 'wisdom' or 'profession'.
Please don't tune without thinking !!!

 

[ZBOYD]

Remaps make the turbo work harder - therein it makes sense to help reduce temps and thats what an up-rated intercooler provides. In short it helps longevity of components and sustain power for longer.

They may not provide an increase in overall power, but a side effect of installation means that the car actually reaches its potential so in short it does give the car power by allowing it to achieve its best potential output.

My own car and many others beside make more power with an up-rated intercooler than they did without one, only because they are able to more easily reach their potential.

Telling people that tuning without thinking might be a good mantra to live by, but an understanding of why certain components work the way they do and the benefits they provide during tuning is also useful to understand.

 

[Leonneke]

Telling people that tuning without thinking might be a good mantra to live by, but an understanding of why certain components work the way they do and the benefits they provide during tuning is also useful to understand.

That is exactly what I mean. System-thinking. But my reply on the IC is based upon the story of the topic-starter. Standard turbo. What you say is what I say. Upgrading the IC is usefull when you are system-thinking.

What I just want to make clear, that there is no use in upgrading the IC as a mod on it's own. But okay, enough said about the IC. I just want people NOT to make the same mistakes as I did at the start. Upgrading without thinking in systems.

I was stupid enough to go for one mod and just forget the rest. For instance, I mounted WALK together with a stabi in the lower front of the car.Changing the front that heayy, meant uge problems in the tail of the car. Just like goin' for more power without thinking about the brakes. I am not a tuner and not a system-thinker. That goes for most of the people on forums like these. I really think discussions like these will help.

So thanks for the better explanation of this !

 

[nickydobreanu]

Guys, are we 100% positive that for a September 2008 Leon Cupra MK2 the code for the gearbox is O2Q?
I might order my LSD from Quaife, but I am not sure which one is the good one. Q or M? Cheers!

 

[Al]

02Q is the code for the MK2 Leon Cupra gearbox. 02M is the code for the MK1 Leon Cupra gearbox.

 

[nickydobreanu]

Thank you very much, djhorace. Will order it soon. Cheers!

 

[beeko85]

So would a lsd be a good upgrade for me?im going for eibach sportline springs this month, and a ths quickshift, and im on stage 2 bluefin, on a fr tfsi so k03, havent rr'd it yet but superchips claim around 260bhp. last week i couldnt even get past a mates standard leon fr tdi to get into the correct lane, i just couldnt put any power down in the rain. it was a pretty bad night i have to say, but even so i was a bit miffed at that one. still thinking of this walk kit too, but if i was to spend around 1000 buying and fitting a lsd, would i still have to do the walk?

 

[wild willy]

Well hi there Rob. I will try to explain that your conclusion is totally wrong and just based on your suggestion. If your intercooler was the problem, than the story would be as following.

Your temperatur went OVER AND BEYOND the temp of 90-92 degrees. That is very easy to tell, you can see that on the dash. So if you really saw that, like up to 100 degrees or more, the turbo is not the problem. The problem then is, that you were stupid enough to keep on pulling behind the cars limits. But I don't think that is true, is it.
If the intercooler is running out, you can always tell.

I think, correct me if i am wrong, that your turbo blew up, without any warning or whatso-ever. There are several reasons why this happens. I will give you the some of the best:
1) pulling the turbo to soon, so when the OIL temp is not right yet ( takes very LONG - mostly up to 15-20 minutes)
2) a leak in the system, oil, weak bearings, turbo not correctly mounted
3) turbo is not 100 % from day one (it is made by men)

And what happens very, very often, is using the turbo in the wrong way.
Your car is mounted with the KKK Borg-Warner K04 TFSI turbo. Most people totally do not know what the real range of the turbo is. The main problem with the K04 is, that it really has a limit. It falls of like hell. This starts far more early then the 'red' lines in your rpm.

Lot's of people who have a fast car, don't really know where the power / torque is at it's best. I see lots of young guys, that drive the turbo over his max peak. It makes a lot of noise and more important, your turbo gets really hot and is constantly pushed to and over it's limits.

Driving a turbo motor is firstly using your brains and knowing what the turbo can do and cannot do. Again, a IC will give you ZERO extra power. It will make it possible to use your power longer and safer. My kkk04 turbo will be internally upgraded. This results in a higher peak performance of the turbo, up to an range above 6500 rpm. But more important, the turbo will spool up more early. Even with this update I will stay with the normal Intercooler at first.

Tuning is not about 'modding' . Tuning is about using the best parts that really connect with each other and play in each others range. If you mount a BIG Garrett turbo, than you will need more cooling. Same for intake and exhaust. Intake and turbo. Fuel and air.

Oil temp may take a little longer to warm up than the watercooling circuit but it is being applied as soon as the engine starts turning, careful selection of the correct viscositiy will ensure protection straight away but common sense tells you not to rag it from cold and allow the turbo to cool down before turning the engine off despite watercooling over run circuits.
Upgrading your turbo internals to hold more boost higher up the rev range but have a quicker spool is normally a contradiction. Can you explain more about your proposed upgrades.

 

[Al]

if i was to spend around 1000 buying and fitting a lsd, would i still have to do the walk?

They do different things. You dont need to do either, but both will help.

 

[beeko85]

ive been emailing different companies in belfast asking if they would fit a lsd, and prices etc but no replies yet, i watched a vid on youtube from futrell autoworks on a mkvi gti which they were fitting with a pelequin diff, they kind of make it look easy but its obvious its a big job at the same time if you know what i mean, would want someone who knows what theyre doing

 

[Al]

Mine is fitted to the box according to the specialist. There was a bit of grinding required to stop the diff from fouling the box apparantely.

Just need to swap out the boxes on the car now

 

[beeko85]

im leaning towards the quaife 02Q atb diff, i still havent got a response from any garages i emailed about fiting yet but im sure ill get someone to fit it. what kind of specialist fitted yours dj horace? a transmission specialist, vag specialist, diff specialist-if there is such a thing? im getting the engine mounts first though. ive never done a track day, and i doubt that in everyday road use id really notice the difference that a wavetrac might have over a quaife, and with the quaife being about £200 cheaper...

 

[nickydobreanu]

djhorace, could you please let us know whether or not you needed bolts to get the diff in the gear box? Or were there already bolts? Rivets?

And what else did they require except the Oil? Maybe some gaskets? Thanks.

I have ordered the Quaife, as the Wavetrac is not available at the moment (Autotech said they need some plates to arrive).