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Well, when I last compared the boost plots of my LCR with those from an Ibiza Cupra R, the difference was 1psi... the difference in power almost 35bhp... the difference... 1 car has a K03 turbo, the other a K04 (standard mapping), so the E05 should be producing more again!! It's not all just about the boost pressure...
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Madmile i thought you said that midrange and top end were much better ,didn't you also say something about a much higher top speed.If this is true why are you moaning its done the job.I do agree about spec diffrence between golf and beeza,large fmic and better f/p seems to help,but what about larger injectors?.Hope it works out for you,but don't forget it's early days yet.
Andy.
Andy.Shock_Xe
Guest
Bugger it ima go for injectors and 4bar fpr before Jabba, I want to be safe and know i hgave done everything i can and dont want that niggly thought of "What if i had done....."
Anyone have any ideas which injectors would suit and £££ and fitting?
Anyone have any ideas which injectors would suit and £££ and fitting?
Check with atp but somthing like these should be about right.
http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/m...OD&Product_Code=MUM-FUL-009&Category_Code=FUL
http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/m...OD&Product_Code=MUM-FUL-009&Category_Code=FUL
If Mike's mapped it... then fueling and any shortcomings would have been mentioned... He does use wideband lambda when mapping ya know. 
For anyone with an Ibiza, considering 4bar FPR... remember my fuel pump pressure sagging and subsequent dead cylinder last year... Burnt exhaust valve and melted piston.
Be careful. Thats what S3 fuel pumps are now part of a Jabba IHI conversion.
Downpipe exit design is something which is different from Ibiza to Golf.... MKIV based cars having no rear engine mounting getting in the way (from memory)
Be interesting to see REVO's E05'd Ibiza anf John's MKIV when completed and finish mapped.
REVO's Ibiza having a nice $$ turbo outlet/downpipe, which should certainly help flow. Add an appropriately sized FMIC or CC and it should go pretty well.
For anyone with an Ibiza, considering 4bar FPR... remember my fuel pump pressure sagging and subsequent dead cylinder last year... Burnt exhaust valve and melted piston.
Be careful. Thats what S3 fuel pumps are now part of a Jabba IHI conversion.
Downpipe exit design is something which is different from Ibiza to Golf.... MKIV based cars having no rear engine mounting getting in the way (from memory)
Be interesting to see REVO's E05'd Ibiza anf John's MKIV when completed and finish mapped.
REVO's Ibiza having a nice $$ turbo outlet/downpipe, which should certainly help flow. Add an appropriately sized FMIC or CC and it should go pretty well.
I guess in real world... this is the difference in power to performance... as aside figures for the pub
Its a gauge of sorts...
Nippa
Guest
Ello chaps I've been quietly reading this thread from afar.. I've been looking at popping an E-05 into my Beetle 1.8T, but so far the results here are not overly encouraging? But I agree with you guys in that it seems Ibiza's have a bottleneck someplace that appears to hold back the power. So maybe only an issue on Ibiza's? I've read about a couple of Golfs (Including the one here) and they both faired much better. So I am hoping an E-05 would be effective for my Beetle also. It has already done quite well for itself at Jabba. Only has a remap, beefed up DV, a basic intercooler mod, nothing else. Yet it pumped out 228bhp (rule = 237). Holds torque nicely right up to 5000rpm or so. So not too bad going for a K-03s.
http://homepage.mac.com/luapy/jabbabug.jpg
Next mod will be a Milltek turboback.. And hopefully later an, E-05, if they are indeed worth it for my car or not?
Opinions welcome
I've been quietly reading this thread from afar.. I've been looking at popping an E-05 into my Beetle 1.8T, but so far the results here are not overly encouraging? But I agree with you guys in that it seems Ibiza's have a bottleneck someplace that appears to hold back the power. So maybe only an issue on Ibiza's? I've read about a couple of Golfs (Including the one here) and they both faired much better. So I am hoping an E-05 would be effective for my Beetle also. It has already done quite well for itself at Jabba. Only has a remap, beefed up DV, a basic intercooler mod, nothing else. Yet it pumped out 228bhp (rule = 237). Holds torque nicely right up to 5000rpm or so. So not too bad going for a K-03s.http://homepage.mac.com/luapy/jabbabug.jpg
Next mod will be a Milltek turboback.. And hopefully later an, E-05, if they are indeed worth it for my car or not?
Opinions welcome
As far as i know Revo are using larger injectors on a 3 bar fpr. They have modified a golf air intake pipe samco type. And are using a custom 3" downpipe and forge smic. Revo's boost pressures and map will be very intresting to see, getting hold of a 3" downpipe and getting it fitted onto the milltek sports cat is not to much of a problem. Kev said there Ibiza should have figures available within the next month. Chargecooler seems very good. As long as Revo's map is good and the map does not resemble mount everest straight up and down. Its all intresting, obviously custardscupra lack of bhp compared to the Golf is not heat releated, could be downpipe, dont think that its injectors as stock injectors and 4 bar fpr are good enough for at least 265-270bhp. Revo will prob map for midrange and will not bother trying to hold on until the death. As always time will tell. Hopfully the mystery will be solved so i can go faster.
Err, there's a bit more different between the two cars than just the turbo. Boost is a multiplier of flow, corrected for compressor and intercooler efficiency. Engine airflow is directly proportional to output and thus so is boost. What manifold pressure alone doesn't tell you is how much work the turbo is doing to produce that boost or even if it has exceeded its capability.
According to Borg-Warner specs, the K0-3 can flow enough to support an output of ~240bhp, so why doesn't it manage it on the Ibiza? How can the IHI make more power than the KKK's using the same boost pressure? I'll give you a clue: the fuelling is incidental. There's plenty of turbo theory out on the net, some of it's even correct, might just be worth a read?
I aint no Einstein and clues dont really help, answers do so i will give u it. As long a Revo and GolfTT are using stock non modified engine manifolds then the limiting factor on the ibiza is not the Fpr, or injectors, small port head or large port head, its the Downpipe and heat, the turbo can only increase the amount of rpm's the impeller can spin at by increasing boost pressure if the products of combustion cant be removed from the engine manifold and exhaust system faster than normal then the impeller will refuse to spin faster.
In conclusion for more boost to be run ie 24psi rather than 19.5psi in my case the turbo needs to be allowed to push combustion waste out better/faster/easier less back pressure will allow more boost. As long as golftt/revo are running stock engine manifolds the limiting factor on the Ibiza is the Miiltek downpipe/or stock downpipe/exhaust. The strongest chain is only as strong as its weakest link, the miiltek has a 2" bottle neck on the dp as Dor pointed out. Sort out a 3-3 1/4" Downpipe and connect it to the milltek sports cat and the missing 15-20bhp will be found as long as the rest of the pipe work is 2.5" to 3".
In conclusion for more boost to be run ie 24psi rather than 19.5psi in my case the turbo needs to be allowed to push combustion waste out better/faster/easier less back pressure will allow more boost. As long as golftt/revo are running stock engine manifolds the limiting factor on the Ibiza is the Miiltek downpipe/or stock downpipe/exhaust. The strongest chain is only as strong as its weakest link, the miiltek has a 2" bottle neck on the dp as Dor pointed out. Sort out a 3-3 1/4" Downpipe and connect it to the milltek sports cat and the missing 15-20bhp will be found as long as the rest of the pipe work is 2.5" to 3".
Turbo flow back is the key to the amount of boost allowed to be dialed in.
Custardcupras car would see 240bhp on a 4th gear run i am sure and like is said below 26bhp is possible. Even if we said 20bhp the 260bhp is there and so is the missing bhp from the ibiza.
1.8T Hi-Flow Downpipe
Constructed from 3" Mandrel bend Stainless steel pipe work, this is a direct fit for any KKK series Turbo unit, Comes with a Cat-Bypass unit which matches the O.E size CAT back exhaust systems and O.E Oxygen sensor mounting locations. On the dyno this down pipe increased Bhp by a massive 26Bhp while still using a standard VW Back Box 'Dyno' (we recommed installing ABD racing Inserts, to limit movment of engine)
Description
Part
Price
3" Stainless Steel Down pipe
18;3down
£249.95
New Full 3" system available see latest parts
Custardcupras car would see 240bhp on a 4th gear run i am sure and like is said below 26bhp is possible. Even if we said 20bhp the 260bhp is there and so is the missing bhp from the ibiza.
1.8T Hi-Flow Downpipe
Constructed from 3" Mandrel bend Stainless steel pipe work, this is a direct fit for any KKK series Turbo unit, Comes with a Cat-Bypass unit which matches the O.E size CAT back exhaust systems and O.E Oxygen sensor mounting locations. On the dyno this down pipe increased Bhp by a massive 26Bhp while still using a standard VW Back Box 'Dyno' (we recommed installing ABD racing Inserts, to limit movment of engine)
Description
Part
Price
3" Stainless Steel Down pipe
18;3down
£249.95
New Full 3" system available see latest parts
Nippa
Guest
So, in other words, and to cut this very long story considerably shorter...
E-05's being naff on Ibiza's is not really the fault of the E-05.. But quite probably the downpipe arrangement Ibiza's have?
So perhaps still a good turbo for most other VAG 1.8T's which are not held back with crap downpipes?
I await opinions
E-05's being naff on Ibiza's is not really the fault of the E-05.. But quite probably the downpipe arrangement Ibiza's have?
So perhaps still a good turbo for most other VAG 1.8T's which are not held back with crap downpipes?
I await opinions
Shock_Xe
Guest
Originally posted by Nippa
So, in other words, and to cut this very long story considerably shorter...
E-05's being naff on Ibiza's is not really the fault of the E-05.. But quite probably the downpipe arrangement Ibiza's have?
So perhaps still a good turbo for most other VAG 1.8T's which are not held back with crap downpipes?
I await opinions
Im going to the place where i had all my stainless made up for FMIC & Cai today and gonna look at a 3" downpipe into the Miltek Cat Today! Will let you know how it goes
KMadmile, how much did Jabba charge you for FPR??
Hurray, we have a winner!
Gary, the clues weren't directed at you - I guessed that you'd taken in and understood what I'd said on the other thread. It just seemed that every time I pointed out where the problem lies - pre-turbine back pressure (credit to max_torque for explaining its importance) - it was ignored in favour of some other improbable theory that didn't fit the facts or maths such as fuelling. Was beginning to think I must be typing in f*cking Chinese!
The waters have been muddied somewhat by the Milltek D/P not actually being what it was supposed to be and by Bill's car requiring higher boost than the equivalent IHI'd Golf to obtain a given output which suggested that any restriction may not be due to the downpipe. However, it may be that even the IHI D/P on the Ibiza is more restrictive than the equivalent Golf version?
One other point to bear in mind with the E-05 is that even if it does finally produce Stage 1 IHI output, if/when you get bored with it and want to upgrade, you'll have to swap to a bigger turbo again.
Gary, the clues weren't directed at you - I guessed that you'd taken in and understood what I'd said on the other thread. It just seemed that every time I pointed out where the problem lies - pre-turbine back pressure (credit to max_torque for explaining its importance) - it was ignored in favour of some other improbable theory that didn't fit the facts or maths such as fuelling. Was beginning to think I must be typing in f*cking Chinese!
The waters have been muddied somewhat by the Milltek D/P not actually being what it was supposed to be and by Bill's car requiring higher boost than the equivalent IHI'd Golf to obtain a given output which suggested that any restriction may not be due to the downpipe. However, it may be that even the IHI D/P on the Ibiza is more restrictive than the equivalent Golf version?
One other point to bear in mind with the E-05 is that even if it does finally produce Stage 1 IHI output, if/when you get bored with it and want to upgrade, you'll have to swap to a bigger turbo again.
